Your Flames off-season nightmare scenario

[The Fonz]

Draft: Outside of the top 8
Trade: Clarkson
Free Agent: Ramo
Camp: Smid

[Badgers Nose]

Originally Posted by Mister Yamoto

Ramo and Ortio.

Amen. Thats permanent emotional damage scary.

[Zulu29]

Draft: trade down
Trade: not trading for a starting goalie, not trading wideman
Free Agent: lucic or overpaid FA, re-signing Ramo
Camp: Smid comes back

[Imported_Aussie]

Nightmare would be Monahan negotiations dragging out, he signs a big offer sheet which the flames match, then have to give the same to Gaudreau losing any cap flexibility. And they draft Chychrun at 6. And then don't address the goalie spot at all

[kyuss275]

LOL. After looking at my post, I see a thanks from "this post is terrible". I presume "New Era" has 2 accounts.

[Enoch Root]

MAF isn't a nightmare, but overpaying for him is.

People here seem to think we can grab him for a late 2nd. I highly doubt that. I would guess that the price is #35OA plus a prospect or maybe Colborne.

At that price, I would consider it close to a nightmare.

Howard would definitely be a nightmare.

As for the draft, trading down would be a nightmare, unless it were part of a trade that got us a quality starter at a decent price. Keller would be disappointing. I wouldn't be thrilled with Nylander by any stretch, but it isn't a nightmare.

I continue to believe that Treliving will make a deal with Columbus.

[Matty81]

Originally Posted by Imported_Aussie

Nightmare would be Monahan negotiations dragging out, he signs a big offer sheet which the flames match, then have to give the same to Gaudreau losing any cap flexibility. And they draft Chychrun at 6. And then don't address the goalie spot at all

Yep... And a 4 year term so he hits ufa status asap too and you're rebuilding again in 4 years or paying even more. I suspect getting that deal done is priority number 1 right now for mgmt.

[868904]

Put me in the camp that hopes Raymond gets a new opportunity. Not that it was all Hartley's fault for Raymond's poor play, but I don't think he helped the situation. In fact, after listening to Tre's interviews yesterday, I get the feeling that Hartley's failing to get the most out of guys like Raymond and Baertschi was a pretty big reason why he was let go.

Tre was talking about communication a lot and the Baerstchi case is a prime example. We don't really know what was behind the scenes, but the more that is revealed now, it sounds like perhaps Hartley just didn't communicate very well with him. Like Gulutzan said, with today's player, you have to tell them why and how, not just go do it. Baerstchi has indicated that the Canucks coaching staff did a much better job of explaining things to him. I've been hard on Baerstchi but maybe Hartley was had more fault to the situation, and perhaps Treliving feels the same way.



Hope Raymond is working his butt off right now hoping to impress at camp.

[The Fonz]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

People here seem to think we can grab him for a late 2nd. I highly doubt that. I would guess that the price is #35OA plus a prospect or maybe Colborne.

At that price, I would consider it close to a nightmare.

I don't believe MAF will net that kind of return. I realize the reports suggest that he will, but I feel like those media members suggesting so are being used by the Pens.

His contract, body of work these last few years, and the fact that he lost his job to a rookie, tell me that the Pens will take what they can get for him. They need to trade Fleury, more than any other team needs to acquire him.

I'd be shocked if he cost any more than 1 of our late 2nd round picks.

[IamNotKenKing]

Originally Posted by Alberta_Beef

I'm not huge on either Nylander or Fleury but suggesting getting both is pretty laughable, Ricardo levels of laughable.

Why is that laughable? Serious question.

[Jason14h]

Draft: Trade down with someone who takes Wideman. Go off the board with that pick

Goalies: Trade for Howard and pair with Ortio or Ramo

FA: I've basically hated every UFA the Flames have done under Trev, so I guess signing another mid/low tier player to 2-3 million a year.

Camp: One of the stars gets injured.

[CsInMyBlood]

Originally Posted by 868904

Put me in the camp that hopes Raymond gets a new opportunity. Not that it was all Hartley's fault for Raymond's poor play, but I don't think he helped the situation. In fact, after listening to Tre's interviews yesterday, I get the feeling that Hartley's failing to get the most out of guys like Raymond and Baertschi was a pretty big reason why he was let go.

Tre was talking about communication a lot and the Baerstchi case is a prime example. We don't really know what was behind the scenes, but the more that is revealed now, it sounds like perhaps Hartley just didn't communicate very well with him. Like Gulutzan said, with today's player, you have to tell them why and how, not just go do it. Baerstchi has indicated that the Canucks coaching staff did a much better job of explaining things to him. I've been hard on Baerstchi but maybe Hartley was had more fault to the situation, and perhaps Treliving feels the same way.



Hope Raymond is working his butt off right now hoping to impress at camp.

If anything, Hartley gave Raymond waaaaay to much leash, prime ice time, top linemates and chance to turn his game around.

Raymond got every opportunity and more under the previous coaching staff.

Baertschi on the other hand, I believe did not get the proper chance to succeed here.

[The Fonz]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

People here seem to think we can grab him for a late 2nd. I highly doubt that. I would guess that the price is #35OA plus a prospect or maybe Colborne.

As of now, the only realistic options for the Pens to trade Fleury are:

Buffalo
1a -
1b - Lehner

Calgary
1 -
2 -


Then there are some potential destinations, depending on how the next couple weeks play out:

Toronto - if they buyout/trade Bernier
Dallas - if they buyout/trade Lehtonen
Vancouver - if they buyout/trade Miller
Winnipeg - if they buyout/trade Pavelec


Other rumoured markets, I just don't see a fit:

Ottawa - is Fleury an upgrade on Anderson, who's under contract for another 2 years?
Philadelphia - is Fleury an upgrade on Mason, under contract and a few years younger?


There are more goaltenders available this summer, than there are spots for said goaltenders. I don't think we acquire Fleury if the cost is higher than a late 2nd. If the Pens wanted 35thOA+, wouldn't Treliving shift his focus to Bishop?

[TheKurgan]

Originally Posted by Mister Yamoto

Ramo and Ortio.

This

[Jason14h]

Howard and Ortio or Howard and Ramo would be worst!

[IgiTang]

Originally Posted by Jason14h

Draft: Trade down with someone who takes Wideman. Go off the board with that pick

Goalies: Trade for Howard and pair with Ortio or Ramo

FA: I've basically hated every UFA the Flames have done under Trev, so I guess signing another mid/low tier player to 2-3 million a year.

Camp: One of the stars gets injured.

First of all, Frolik was a great signing. Those who dont think so... something is off..

As for nightmare, I dont think MAF is a nightmare at a couple picks after 35oa or a pick and a middling prospect (Wotherspoon, Culkin, Kulak, Arnold).
The cap hit and term bother me a bit, but it could be worse.

I have warmed to the idea of bringing Riemer in for 2 years.

Draft: Nylander is to be a better version of his brother William, William was tearing it up on a terrible TO team to end last season.. But hes a terrible pick? Cmon..

Draft Nightmare would be drafting a goalie in the first round. Dropping a couple spots and picking up one of the top 3 D, isnt ideal, but it isnt a nightmare.

Trading #6 for a goalie in the league, Nightmare.

UFA: Signing a 32 yo Backes to a 5+ year deal for $6+ mil per.. That would be an absolute nightmare.

Camp and WC, Gaudreau, Bennett or Monny getting hurt.

Our UFA's - Letting Nakladal walk would be a bad thing.

Trading colborne and or wideman and or smid for a goalie would be ideal if we cant sign sign reimer for a favourable (team friendly) amount and term.

[Alberta_Beef]

Originally Posted by ignite09

How is that laughable? Drafting Nylander and trading for M.A. Fleury is a fairly realistic scenario. Also don't see how some call that a nightmare. A point producing RH RW and a top 15 goalie seem like the kind of things that would move this team forward. Trading down into the teens, drafting Day with that pick, and signing Lucic to a 7 year 7 mil. deal, now that's a nightmare.

should have said it was laughable to say getting both was a nightmare

[Alberta_Beef]

Originally Posted by IamNotKenKing

Why is that laughable? Serious question.

I mistyped and it changed the meaning of my post. It's fixed now

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by The Fonz

I don't believe MAF will net that kind of return. I realize the reports suggest that he will, but I feel like those media members suggesting so are being used by the Pens.

His contract, body of work these last few years, and the fact that he lost his job to a rookie, tell me that the Pens will take

what they can get for him. They need to trade Fleury, more than any other team needs to acquire him.

I'd be shocked if he cost any more than 1 of our late 2nd round picks.

They don't seem to think that.

To all the people that have said this: I fully agree that there are more goalies 'available' than there are potential new homes for them (and I have been saying so for some time).

However, that doesn't mean that each team will be looking to be the first one to dump a goalie (even if they should be).

Fleury has an NMC and the organization appears to respect him. They have made it pretty clear they aren't looking to dump him.

We shall see, of course. But my impression is that other teams will be more aggressive in moving a goalie than the Pens are.

And if Fleury isn't cheap to acquire, then he is a terrible choice.

[Cleveland Steam Whistle]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

MAF isn't a nightmare, but overpaying for him is.

People here seem to think we can grab him for a late 2nd. I highly doubt that. I would guess that the price is #35OA plus a prospect or maybe Colborne.

At that price, I would consider it close to a nightmare.

Howard would definitely be a nightmare.

As for the draft, trading down would be a nightmare, unless it were part of a trade that got us a quality starter at a decent price. Keller would be disappointing. I wouldn't be thrilled with Nylander by any stretch, but it isn't a nightmare.

I continue to believe that Treliving will make a deal with Columbus.

That's a very fair point on MAF. The cost of acquisition could absolutely turn into a nightmare.

I know this was brought up many times before in the expansion thread, but what is the deal in Pittsburg. If they keep MAF are the forced to protect him in the expansion draft, and therefore be forced to expose Murray (as we understand the rules at this point) or are they just at risk of losing him to LV for nothing (assuming they want to protect Murray).

Edit: sorry,must reading your next post and I think you answered my question. Fleury has an NMC which means they'd be forced to protect him, meaning they would have expose Murray, no? That would likely make them pretty motivated, but not in a rush. They have no reason to dump him quickly for nothing to a team like us. Hang on to him as long as they want, see if any teams goaltending ####s the bed to start the year and increases the needs a goalie bad market, drive a bidding war. And worse case scenario, you can trade him for next to nothing next year before the expansion draft.