Way to go vaccineophobe parents: Measles Outbreak

[opendoor]

Originally Posted by rayne008

I think some legitimate questions about vaccinations get pushed aside due to the ignorance and anger around this topic. Instead of typing out my concerns, I'll just copy snippets from this Doctor's blog, which contain some of the questions I have... Obviously I have no way to determine this guys credibility.

He does touch base on many of the diseases that we are being vaccinated for, including measles.

I think there are more than enough questions raised to promote an intelligent conversation, rather than mindless vitriol from both extremes of the issue.

Given that he's a chiropractor, I'd ignore his title of "Doctor" with regards to his credibility. Really, the fact that he's a chiropractor makes him less credible, since the entire field is built upon a foundation of pseudo-science.

And that doesn't even get into the junk he's writing. He repeatedly implies that if you don't die from a disease (or even if there's only a small chance of death), that vaccination serves no purpose. I'm sure all the people who are permanently disabled from polio or suffer from chronic illness due to contracting Hepatitis would disagree. I mean, who can disagree with this logic:

How do you contract Hepatitis A? Eat food that someone else pooped in that is infected with Hepatitis A. There are no statistical reports of deaths from Hep A, just a 0.0098% chance of contracting it. The solution is good sanitation, hygiene, and nutrition. Eating out is going to be a risk but again, I'll take my chances of eating food prepared by other people.

I really like this beauty of a chart as well which compares the the rates of various maladies of vaccinated children in a study in Germany and compares it to the results from a self-reported survey on an anti-vaccine website. Real impressive "science" there:



Of course in that scientifically rigorous vaccine-injury.info survey the sample is made up almost entirely of people who shun science based medicine, so it really isn't too shocking that the incidences of diagnosed illnesses is much lower in a sample that doesn't even go to real doctors for diagnoses. I'm sure if there was a Chi imbalance section on there though, the red line would be off the chart.

[rayne008]

Originally Posted by evman150

*Yawn*

The guy is a CHIROPRACTOR.

Jesus, for people who love to say "do your own research" you sure don't do your own research.

All I said is that a parent these are some of the questions I have. Posting a summary of some of the questions I have certainly doesn't show a lack of research.

[evman150]

Originally Posted by rayne008

All I said is that a parent these are some of the questions I have. Posting a summary of some of the questions I have certainly doesn't show a lack of research.

Here's your answer: Vaccinate your kids.

Source: Every qualified person ever.

[NuclearPizzaMan]

Originally Posted by rayne008

All I said is that a parent these are some of the questions I have. Posting a summary of some of the questions I have certainly doesn't show a lack of research.

Research without having the education to properly parse your sources is pointless.

Have you heard about the terrible chemical DHMO? It's literally everywhere. You should read about it! http://www.dhmo.org/facts.html

[PsYcNeT]

I like how the name of that guy's book is found 12 times on every page.

He's just looking out for your best interests though!

"Big Medical just wants all your money!!! (buy my book)"

[ah123]

Originally Posted by NuclearPizzaMan

Research without having the education to properly parse your sources is pointless.

Have you heard about the terrible chemical DHMO? It's literally everywhere. You should read about it! http://www.dhmo.org/facts.html

Brilliant!! I wonder if one could create an uproar about DHMO and get some celebrities behind banning it

[GGG]

Originally Posted by rayne008

I think some legitimate questions about vaccinations get pushed aside due to the ignorance and anger around this topic. Instead of typing out my concerns, I'll just copy snippets from this Doctor's blog, which contain some of the questions I have... Obviously I have no way to determine this guys credibility.







He does touch base on many of the diseases that we are being vaccinated for, including measles.



I think there are more than enough questions raised to promote an intelligent conversation, rather than mindless vitriol from both extremes of the issue.

He does make one excellent point. Putting a needle into your skin bypasses all of the bodies natural prevention methods. This allows the vaccine to work as we aren't routinely exposed to dead viruses of deadly diseases. If we were we would develop natural immunity. Because we don't we need to vaccinate.

His whole logic is terrible. It really boils down to if people naturally get sick there is nothing that could have been done.

Also saying that their is extremism on both sides assumes that you alwayse need to treat both sides equally. When one side is completely wrong you dont.

[Kybosh]

I find it funny that he's discussing the perceived flaws in vaccine research using some extremely faulty logic on his part.

When he argues semantics between vaccination and immunization he should realize that the term vaccine is from the first treatment of cow pox (latin vacca; ultimately used for small pox). Vaccination doesn't mean injecting something into your body, unless you're explaining it to a toddler.

[Jimmy Stang]

Originally Posted by rayne008

All I said is that a parent these are some of the questions I have. Posting a summary of some of the questions I have certainly doesn't show a lack of research.

But I think that your "information" sums up the entire problem with the anti-vaccination movement, and that's why it was pounced on. There is "evidence" from a questionable source, in this case a chiropractor, and a nice shiny graph that shows a small snippet that would suggest that the vaccination is useless whilst ignoring more convincing information to the contrary. Misinformation from questionable sources - that's the anti-vaccination movement in a nutshell.

[PsYcNeT]

Originally Posted by Jimmy Stang

Misinformation from questionable sources - that's the anti-vaccination movement in a nutshell.

Misinformation from questionable sources who are trying to sell you something while simultaneously decrying Big Pharma/Medical.

[Knut]

Originally Posted by rayne008

I think some legitimate questions about vaccinations get pushed aside due to the ignorance and anger around this topic. Instead of typing out my concerns, I'll just copy snippets from this Doctor's blog, which contain some of the questions I have... Obviously I have no way to determine this guys credibility.







He does touch base on many of the diseases that we are being vaccinated for, including measles.



I think there are more than enough questions raised to promote an intelligent conversation, rather than mindless vitriol from both extremes of the issue.

One extreme is rational and correct. The other is extremely wrong.

[Jimmy Stang]

Timely, and although not related to vaccinations, this is certainly related to endangering minors through the parents' blind rejection of science and medicine:

Criminal charges are pending against a Calgary mother in relation to her seven-year-old son's death earlier this year.
Early on the morning of March 2, emergency crews were called to a 17th Avenue S.W. basement suite for a report of a young boy having a seizure. He was taken to hospital where he was pronounced dead.
An autopsy found he died of a strep infection, which is treatable with penicillin.
Police allege the mother did not take the boy for treatment, giving him holistic remedies instead.

Link: http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/calgar...tion-1.2436945

[jar_e]

Since it kind of ties into the same theme as failing to vaccinate...

http://globalnews.ca/news/985030/cal...ld-sons-death/

Police have arrested a 44-year-old woman in connection with the death of her son, after she allegedly gave him holistic treatments for an illness instead of seeking medical treatment.

An autopsy revealed he died as a result of a strep infection, which is often treatable with antibiotics such as penicillin.


Detectives claim the boy, who lived with his mother, was not taken for medical help despite his deteriorating condition.


It’s alleged the victim was given holistic remedies and was bedridden for up to 10 days prior to his death.


Police say after speaking with medical experts and the Crown Prosecutor’s Office, they arrested the mother of the boy.


Charges of criminal negligence causing death and failing to provide the necessaries of life are pending against the woman, who has not yet been identified.

[rayne008]

It is a very interesting topic, and I do agree with the sentiment that information and stats can be interpreted in many different ways..

I think it is ok to ask questions and to share information. (like the CDC info above) I certainly don't have an agenda and would appreciate civil discussion.

For example, here is a summary of vaccine-preventable diseases from the WHO... My question from this is why are we being told to give tetanus shots to 2 month olds...

http://apps.who.int/immunization_mon...cidences?c=CAN

[Knut]

<Facepalm> The numbers are low because we use Vaccines. If we stopped using Vaccines then we would start to have cases of Tetanus again.

[Burninator]

Originally Posted by rayne008

I think it is ok to ask questions and to share information. (like the CDC info above) I certainly don't have an agenda and would appreciate civil discussion.

Just to nip this in the bud early...a discussion is not continuously "asking" questions while ignoring the answers.

[pylon]

Awesome, I have been waiting all day for a child endangering anti-vaccine supporter to chime in.

I got my wish.

[SportsJunky]

Originally Posted by rayne008

I certainly don't have an agenda

I feel like you do.

[FireFly]

Originally Posted by tete

Wasn't that the smallpox one? It's not given anymore.

I know a bunch of non-vaxxers (by choice) and they're planning measles "parties" if one of their kids end up with it so that they all can be infected. I don't think they understand the severity that can happen with measles.

Is it wrong that I read this and thought "Good! Darwin at work... people wiping out the 'stupid' gene they've passed on to their innocent children."

[Thor]

Can I just say how much I love you all.