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Old 09-15-2011, 10:03 PM   #41
TorqueDog
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Hotkeys are great when you've got... y'know, keys. Given that this is intended to be usable both with touch and with a keyboard/mouse, you need to be able to accomodate both and the ribbon bar does that better than a File/Edit/View menu (or hiding as much as possible a la Vista/7).
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Old 09-16-2011, 09:06 AM   #42
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The Ribbon exposes features hidden in menus and sub-menus of sub-menus. How many people use Invert Selection? Probably a lot less then knew that there was an Invert Selection in the first place and now it's front and centre. Microsoft has done a ton of research and user pattern testing on the Fluent User Interface and Ribbon going back years.

Interface and UX design is not about designing around what people say they do, it's about designing for what they do do (haha do do).

I will purge examples from the MSDN blog but I have had the same arguments regarding my companies software when we moved to the Ribbon. We actually had a lot less push back then we thought we would.






I have spent a bunch of time defending the Ribbon against users who say you have taken away document space which is never true if designed correctly.


Shortcuts and for every option are always available and the Ribbon can support multiple shortcuts for the same commands.


While it appears that the Ribbon is the least customizable Window style its actually the most. A nicely formatted Quick Access Toolbar with collapsed Ribbon.
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Old 09-16-2011, 09:53 AM   #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Barnes View Post
The Ribbon exposes features hidden in menus and sub-menus of sub-menus. How many people use Invert Selection? Probably a lot less then knew that there was an Invert Selection in the first place and now it's front and centre. Microsoft has done a ton of research and user pattern testing on the Fluent User Interface and Ribbon going back years.

Interface and UX design is not about designing around what people say they do, it's about designing for what they do do (haha do do).

I will purge examples from the MSDN blog but I have had the same arguments regarding my companies software when we moved to the Ribbon. We actually had a lot less push back then we thought we would.






I have spent a bunch of time defending the Ribbon against users who say you have taken away document space which is never true if designed correctly.


Shortcuts and for every option are always available and the Ribbon can support multiple shortcuts for the same commands.


While it appears that the Ribbon is the least customizable Window style its actually the most. A nicely formatted Quick Access Toolbar with collapsed Ribbon.
Good post. I'm especially intrigued with the lack of pushback you got when you switched over your users to the ribbon. Every "everyday" user I've seen try to make sense of the Office ribbon gets frustrated very easily. And it clashes with my minimalist design upbringing, but I'm not a desktop app dev.
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Old 09-16-2011, 11:19 AM   #44
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I've really come to enjoy the ribbon, mostly because of the contextual menus that pop up in it. I've also come to like the Outlook ribbon quite a bit. I guess it helps that Autodesk forced me to get used to the ribbon, but I'd say it's use is 100x more helpful than I needed in Windows. I used to have 5 or 6 toolbars of 20 icons to use in Civil 3D, now I have 1 ribbon that switches to whatever I need when I click on an object.

Basically it removes a ton of right clicking I used to do, and I don't mind that.
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Old 09-16-2011, 11:24 AM   #45
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We got some comments from the usual Hate Everything Microsoft Does crowd. Those just get ignored.

We managed the there is less document window space before getting any comments by demonstrating what our software was like when it was originally designed when screen resolutions were at 800x600 vs today and how many features were exposed and never more than 2 clicks away at the most. We also showed that some windows gained some document size and some lost at the most a dozen or so pixels. We pushed the Quick Access toolbar set below the collapsed Ribbon as a really great way to customize your workspace without sacrificing the ease of use of the Ribbon.

The Office 2007 Application Button was the most problematic for us. It was so big and obvious, no one ever clicked it and we got a lot of calls saying how do I save, print, open etc.. The Windows 7 style window with the File tab and Backstage/Menu that Office 2010 uses is a much better implementation and I am excited to start creating some Backstage designs.

For the most part, people didn't really care. I guess that is a compliment. They just kept working after a huge user experience change from the Windows 95/98 style Menu/Toolbar interface.

I do understand what you're talking about regarding it clashing with more minimalist designs. I have a feeling things may change. It matches Windows 7's aesthetic but not Metro at all. A bigger clue as to where it is going is to look at Office 15 where some Metro elements have been included in Outlook while maintaining the Ribbon. The document space has been greatly simplified and most interface elements removed and switching modes slides horizontally like Metro Apps. Where it will end up, I wish i knew.



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Old 09-17-2011, 12:58 AM   #46
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No, but that's why the customization feature is key.

Get that crap out of there that you never need.
Ribbons for all!
Booooo!
Very well, ribbons for none!
Booooo!
Ribbons for some, miniature american flags for the others!
Yay!
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