You Know What Really Grinds My Gears? Now with 3x more gears...

[btimbit]

Originally Posted by GGG

I’m pro this one.

90% of the time of I am sick it’s definitely reasonable to expect a few hours of work out of me. What do you find wrong about this? If the expectation for people not coming in is being incapable of performing work then that expectation was far too stringent.

I think the reasonable compromise is stay home more and stay home if kids are sick but if you are capable of working and it doesn’t affect recovery you should probably work.

I mostly agree, I mean, the reason I stay home when sick isn't because I physically can't do the job, it's just because I don't want to make others sick.

I'd guess the problem comes in with if that becomes an expectation

[Looch City]

Originally Posted by stone hands

You guys dont just like...shut your computer off at 430 or whatever and move on with your evening?

I’m telling ya, it’s the culture of work work work. And if you’re not working, what the meaning of life?

[iggy_oi]

Originally Posted by GGG

I’m pro this one.

90% of the time of I am sick it’s definitely reasonable to expect a few hours of work out of me. What do you find wrong about this? If the expectation for people not coming in is being incapable of performing work then that expectation was far too stringent.

I think the reasonable compromise is stay home more and stay home if kids are sick but if you are capable of working and it doesn’t affect recovery you should probably work.

In most cases neither the employee nor employer are medical doctors so it would be extremely complicated in practice and open up the employer to a lot more liabilities.

“We’re writing you up for not doing enough work while you were at home sick”

Let’s see how that one goes.

People can still work while sick in a lot of cases, but making it compulsory to do so probably isn’t even legal.

[calf]

Originally Posted by Looch City

If you’re not answering emails between 6PM-6AM, the company could lose billions!!! Think about the money!

Sometimes I send emails to my team in the evening because I have something on my mind and want to get the communication out while I'm thinking about it clearly. But I make sure they know it's a tomorrow or the next day thing, because that's common courtesy. Or even better, I hit delay send so it goes out in the morning and they don't feel the need to work in the evening because that's when the email came.

[Locke]

Originally Posted by Looch City

I’m telling ya, it’s the culture of work work work. And if you’re not working, what the meaning of life?

Very much so, and for some people...thats their normal.

When I was starting my business I was pretty much available all the time, disconnecting from that took a fair amount of effort and even to this day many, many years later it still happens.

[Sliver]

Originally Posted by Locke

Very much so, and for some people...thats their normal.

When I was starting my business I was pretty much available all the time, disconnecting from that took a fair amount of effort and even to this day many, many years later it still happens.

I made the enormous mistake of giving my cell number to some customers when I first started. Haven't done it in, like, 15 years, but I still get calls/texts evenings and weekends from one of those guys who had it from way back when. That's the kiss of death right there. Nothing snaps me out of enjoying myself more than switching into work mode to deal with a call that could have easily waited until business hours.

[NinePack]

Buying a jar of banana peppers only too have around 70+% of them with the woody/hard centres.

[Ped]

My company deals with a lot of clients whose operations run at various times of the day - so I am generally expected to answer client or boss calls or emails - if necessary.

However, I understood that coming in and am okay with it, because for the most part, unless it's an emergency, which happens rarely, it's stuff that I can just acknowledge and deal with during normal working hours.

Sometimes employees will call me on a weekend and I don't answer. If they call again or text, it means it's important. Otherwise, it can wait until Monday.

And to be fair, I am well treated and compensated by my company, knowing these expectations, and the actual amount of hours I spend "at" work are much less than 8 per day. I generally go in around 9 and leave by 2. And if I need a day off for something, there has never been an issue, as long as I tell my boss I won't be in.

[Locke]

Originally Posted by Sliver

I made the enormous mistake of giving my cell number to some customers when I first started. Haven't done it in, like, 15 years, but I still get calls/texts evenings and weekends from one of those guys who had it from way back when. That's the kiss of death right there. Nothing snaps me out of enjoying myself more than switching into work mode to deal with a call that could have easily waited until business hours.

Yep. I've got similar problems.

When I started I made a point to get a Business Cell because I was at a point where to grow a fledgling business I really needed to be on top of everything all the time.

As my business expanded and I didnt need to be that constantly accessible anymore it was difficult to stop.

To compound that though was that family and friends would recommend associates and coworkers, etc. and the only number they have for me was none other than my personal cell.

[Fighting Banana Slug]

I have to say, WFH has not extended my work hours at all. Occasionally field an email question in the evening, same as when I was DT 5 days a week.

Pro Tip: You are not that important. Unless your phone blows up with urgent messages, it can wait until tomorrow morning.

[TorqueDog]

Originally Posted by ResAlien

If only there was some way to not reply to after hours emails.

Literally everything is designed to make it easier for employees to do exactly the opposite, and to motivate them to get better at being always reachable. And it all starts with the phone.

People get corporate phones and use them for personal, or phone subsidies to install work apps and mail on their personal devices. So now the device you've always got with you and already staring at for a good portion of the day is a gateway to work. Even people who don't actually put corporate e-mail on their personal device through an app, well, chances are they know how to use Outlook Web App or similar, so they end up looking at it anyway.

For a long time, a company laptop connecting via the corporate VPN was really the only way to properly connect to work resources remotely. Well, the cloud and the pandemic sure put that on its head. It has never been easier for people to just 'casually' work after hours because "Well, it's just one e-mail".

Everything has been designed -- from corporate cultures, to BYOD policies, to the software companies use -- with the intention of making it frictionless to work more from where ever you are.

[ResAlien]

Eh if you can’t draw a line with your job between work and life that sounds like a you problem. The issue is less WFH and more the culture of some jobs and employees being taken advantage of.

[stone hands]

Who cares if ur reachable or not. People will get the hint if you never answer them outside of your scheduled working hours. And if they dont, tough titty

I have my work emails on my phone and see people working late hours(because I see the emails), but thats you problem for giving a damn when you're off the clock

[Wormius]

Originally Posted by Sliver

I made the enormous mistake of giving my cell number to some customers when I first started. Haven't done it in, like, 15 years, but I still get calls/texts evenings and weekends from one of those guys who had it from way back when. That's the kiss of death right there. Nothing snaps me out of enjoying myself more than switching into work mode to deal with a call that could have easily waited until business hours.

If you had an iPhone you could add them to a do-not-disturb schedule. Also if they have an iPhone it will indicate to them that you’ve placed them on do-not-disturb.

[81MC]

Originally Posted by ResAlien

Eh if you can’t draw a line with your job between work and life that sounds like a you problem. The issue is less WFH and more the culture of some jobs and employees being taken advantage of.

Yeah, unless your workplace is psychologically unsafe and toxic and your family is dependent on your income and you feel pressured support teams operating in multiple time zones etc etc.

[MoneyGuy]

I’ve never boycotted any product until now. I don’t buy Heinz products (business reasons) or almond anything (environmental reasons) and was grocery shopping and see that competing products are flying off the shelves but the two I won’t buy don’t seem to be selling (unless they’ve been restocked).

[TorqueDog]

Originally Posted by ResAlien

Eh if you can’t draw a line with your job between work and life that sounds like a you problem. The issue is less WFH and more the culture of some jobs and employees being taken advantage of.

Yeah, yeah, but I say the same thing about the obese and eating, and suddenly everyone drops their meatball sub in outrage.

Things can be designed to be addictive. Just something as simple as notifications. Hell, we figured out how to gamify fitness, dating, the stock market, you don't think the gamification of productivity isn't already well underway? It's a bit less in-your-face about it, but it's there.

[DoubleF]

Originally Posted by calf

Sometimes I send emails to my team in the evening because I have something on my mind and want to get the communication out while I'm thinking about it clearly. But I make sure they know it's a tomorrow or the next day thing, because that's common courtesy. Or even better, I hit delay send so it goes out in the morning and they don't feel the need to work in the evening because that's when the email came.

This is a good one, but I don't like how it makes people think that there's an OK expectation to contact you and expect you to notice things outside of office hours.

Using a delay send function to send it 30 mins to an hour before work hours start is a better path IMO.

To be fair, I do what you do. I'm OK working outside of work hours or on weekends to catch up, but I don't like people being aware of that and thinking I'm supposed to be available then. I'm seeing these negative effects, so I'm changing to using the delay email function.


But the worst of the problem is that many people still have not clued in that WFH situations are not all the same situations across the board. There are significant differences from one person to another, significantly more than when people worked in the office full time. My WFH or hybrid situation is not the same as other people's WFH or hybrid situation (type of work, collaboration, time zones, tools available, replaceability etc.). What drive me up the wall is when people vocally act like it is... and these vocal people are the types who are literally the "do barely anything" while WFH and boasting about it or the type to be wasting 5-6 hours a day/pretending to be busy and doing nothing when in the office type people.

[FormerPresJamesTaylor]

Originally Posted by Ducay

Downtown Posers GMG


You all know these types. They work hybrid and come in on Tuesdays and Thursdays to clog up everyone's commutes and make coffee and food lines unbearably long.
They come into the office and take all their meetings remote anyways, meanwhile the folks who actually make things happen have been in 5 days a week since April 2020. They're effectively role playing as downtown workers those days. If you're in 2 days a week - you're overhead

80% of Suncor - I'm looking at you

This was replied to 100 times by now but I want to 101. Get a life my dude

[GGG]

Originally Posted by iggy_oi

In most cases neither the employee nor employer are medical doctors so it would be extremely complicated in practice and open up the employer to a lot more liabilities.

“We’re writing you up for not doing enough work while you were at home sick”

Let’s see how that one goes.

People can still work while sick in a lot of cases, but making it compulsory to do so probably isn’t even legal.

I don’t know how you write that as a policy and even if written down it would be impossible to enforce. It’s the same reason you can’t get rid of someone for taking to many sick days. So don’t see a change in the risk of abuse /employer over reach as the old sick day arrangement.

Essentially unless you are posting pictures from Hawaii on your sick days regardless of WHF policies you won’t get disciplined for it. A worker who routinely abuses sick days such that it is an issue worth writing someone up for is likely a worker who has plenty of reasons to be written up