2015/2016 Trade Speculation and Rumors

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

Please list for us, because I don't know any.

Well Colborne, Bouma, Granlund, Grant, Agostino, Poirier, Shore. The common denominator is that none of these guys sans maybe Poirer has top six skills and ability. You take away that Canucks series and this kid has shown absolutely nothing in the NHL. He's been easily on of the most pedestrian Flames players this season and he's less physical than Bennett.

[Poe969]

I loved how Ferland played in the playoffs last year too...against the nucks...for the most part. He ended up getting injured and couldn't continue at the pace he played. It's not like he steam rolled everyone on the ducks and they just beat us. I like Ferland and I've always thought he'd have good chemistry with Bennett but if we could do a second and Ferland for Drouin, I'd do it in a heartbeat

[TOfan]

Originally Posted by Poe969

They have more guys like Ferland then they do like Drouin sounds better. Ferland does play all out every shift but he doesn't really put up points. I think this is a whole "skill vs. will" where Ferland seems to always put himself out there and Drouin seems to have the skill to be a top 6 forward.

The Flames lack offensive skill. Drouin provides that. A gu like Hunter Smith could replace Ferland if he was gone but we don't have anyone in the system with the skill like Drouin.

Does he though? I consistently see Ferland shying away from confrontation. He never seems to want to engage physically, even if someone does something to disrespect the team.

want proof? watch this from earlier in the year when Kesler scores and empty net goal after the horn. Ferland, despite being the closest Flame to Kesler, was ready to let this go. He doesn't react till Wideman and Gio jump in there. If Ferland was truly engaged, he would have reacted immediately.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rwifh8vcNSU

Michael Ferland 2015-16 is a shadow of what he was in that series. The potential is there, an maybe it's been the head injuries, but he seems to be content to cruise along at 75%. This has to be a concern for the Flames.

Drouin for Ferland and a 2nd is a no-brainer.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

Well Colborne, Bouma, Granlund, Grant, Agostino, Poirier, Shore. The common denominator is that none of these guys sans maybe Poirer has top six skills and ability. You take away that Canucks series and this kid has shown absolutely nothing in the NHL. He's been easily on of the most pedestrian Flames players this season and he's less physical than Bennett.

Guys as physical as Ferland: Bouma, with an honourable mention to Poirier

Guys as fast as Ferland: Poirier, probably Agostino, maybe Grant

Guys with as much offensive talent: Poirier (more), Colborne (different), Granlund (shot)

Guys with overall skill set and potential equal to Ferland: Poirer (more)

That's it. Poirier. Different kind of player, but definitely more upside than Ferland.

I am not going to say anything silly like Ferland is more valuable than Drouin, or anything like that. But Ferland has a rare and desirable skill set. The Flames have stated as much many times. He is not a career bottom 6er - again, the Flames have publicly stated (Hartley, Treliving, Conroy) that they believe he is a top 6er.

You don't see it. That's fine. But comparing him to Agostino and Shore is laughable.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by TOfan

Does he though? I consistently see Ferland shying away from confrontation. He never seems to want to engage physically, even if someone does something to disrespect the team.

want proof? watch this from earlier in the year when Kesler scores and empty net goal after the horn. Ferland, despite being the closest Flame to Kesler, was ready to let this go. He doesn't react till Wideman and Gio jump in there. If Ferland was truly engaged, he would have reacted immediately.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rwifh8vcNSU

wow, ok then

[Poe969]

Ferland is still a rookie and would have likely got a suspension of some sort for doing that. I probably would have done the same in his shoes because he didn't know what to do. As soon as he saw that someone else started it, he was in there like a dirty shirt. But what you did show with that clip was that the coach had enough confidence in him to be on the ice with less than a minute left trying to tie the game.

[Flames Draft Watcher]

Originally Posted by TOfan

I like Ferland as much as the next Flames fan, but slow your roll there man.

Ferland ran around against a soft team for seven games. Otherwise he looks to be a middling prospect who has had three concussions. If he can't play with some physical authority he isn't very useful and his play this year would indicated that to a T.

At this point he looks to be a whole lot closer to Brett Lindros than Milan Lucic, or any other impactful power forward.

Huh? Sounds like you're overrating the concussions and underrating his physical play and skill level. Disagree.

[Flames Draft Watcher]

Originally Posted by TOfan

Does he though? I consistently see Ferland shying away from confrontation. He never seems to want to engage physically, even if someone does something to disrespect the team.

Either you aren't watching closely enough or we're watching different games. Agree to disagree.

[TOfan]

Originally Posted by Poe969

Ferland is still a rookie and would have likely got a suspension of some sort for doing that. I probably would have done the same in his shoes because he didn't know what to do. As soon as he saw that someone else started it, he was in there like a dirty shirt. But what you did show with that clip was that the coach had enough confidence in him to be on the ice with less than a minute left trying to tie the game.

no no no no.

Ferland should have known exactly what to do. that's the point. even more so for a rookie. go watch youtube clip of Lucic from his rookie year, bet you won't see him allowing others to disrespect his team literally 5ft. in front of his face.

Hartley did have him on the ice, but I suspect that is due to a lack of other options. Ferland's getting his chance, but I doubt he's be getting it for much longer.

he needs to have a presence on the ice, and obviously Kesler wasn't too worried about it.

[Poe969]

are you a Flames fan or a leaf fan?

a rookie is supposed to know exactly what to do in every situation? Now you're just grasping at things. Come on.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

Guys as physical as Ferland: Bouma, with an honourable mention to Poirier

Guys as fast as Ferland: Poirier, probably Agostino, maybe Grant

Guys with as much offensive talent: Poirier (more), Colborne (different), Granlund (shot)

Guys with overall skill set and potential equal to Ferland: Poirer (more)

That's it. Poirier. Different kind of player, but definitely more upside than Ferland.

I am not going to say anything silly like Ferland is more valuable than Drouin, or anything like that. But Ferland has a rare and desirable skill set. The Flames have stated as much many times. He is not a career bottom 6er - again, the Flames have publicly stated (Hartley, Treliving, Conroy) that they believe he is a top 6er.

You don't see it. That's fine. But comparing him to Agostino and Shore is laughable.

I was in agreement with your post until the end. I don't think there's anything laughable about comparing Ferland to a guy like Agostino.

[heep223]

Originally Posted by TOfan

I agree with you in that I think the Flames will want to address their size moving forward, so Drouin isn't a fit.

that said, a second for Drouin is just silly. you're losing credibility. Utter nonsense.

If Yzerman would do Ferland and a second for Drouin, any GM with two brain cells to rub together would do that every day of the week and twice on Sunday.

I never had any to begin with

[TOfan]

Originally Posted by Flames Draft Watcher

Either you aren't watching closely enough or we're watching different games. Agree to disagree.

Really?

As far as I know, Ferland has dropped the gloves once this year and that was the first game of the year in retaliation to last years playoffs. maybe I'm wrong. Fighting is down, but still, he with his playing style should have had a few by now.

I never see him giving face washes, punching guys in scrums, he may throw a decent hit once every five games or so, but I don't see it. I don't see him asserting himself very much at all really. For what he is supposed to be I see him as being fairly passive.

[GranteedEV]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

Guys. Ferland's has 13 points in 64 career games, this season 2 goals and 6 assists despite being gifted top 6 (top 3 at times) ice time as well as time on powerplay. A lot of fans have complained about Colborne but Ferland would kill to have Colborne's offensive output. No teams are asking for this guy in any sort of trade involving players like Drouin.

Ferland played in the top 6 for just a month, and he wasn't put in half the offensive situations that Colborne is regularily put into because Colborne's only use is at that end where he's still not that useful due to his turnovers / lack of hockey sense.

Here are Ferland's stats between Dec 22nd 2015 (the day he was bumped up to the top 6 for the first time all season) and Jan 21st (the day he got injured)

12 GP
1G / 4A / 5Pts and plus there was that total-highway robbery on another sure-goal by Jonathan Quick.
11 GF / 6 GA (on-ice)
51.3% Corsi-For / 53.1% Fenwick-For (5v5)
52.8% Scoring Chances For / 53.9% High-danger Chances For (5v5)

These are strong underlying 5-on-5 stats, if every player on the team had these kind of stats we would be discussing the Stanley Cup.

Colborne is the one that would kill to have measurables remotely that strong in any role, 3rd line or top 6 while putting up that kind of production.

Ferland's production in a top 6 role was perfect for a role player in his second year. Our power play was rolling with him on the ice too. Please don't compare him to Joe freakin' Colborne who manages to make Johnny and Monny look like Byron and Lombardi when he's on the ice with them.

[Ozy_Flame]

Guys can we please keep this discussion to some other location, this thread is supposed to be for rumors and speculation

[Poe969]

I thought we were speculating on the value of Ferland compared to Drouin.

Humble apologies.

What do you ultimately think they'll get for Drouin? Where do you think he'll end up? When do you think he'll be traded?

[TOfan]

Originally Posted by Poe969

are you a Flames fan or a leaf fan?

a rookie is supposed to know exactly what to do in every situation? Now you're just grasping at things. Come on.

I'm a hockey fan. I'm a Flames fan and a Leafs fan. Regardless, I don't need to be a fan of any team to see and understand what a player like Ferland should be.

Seriously, you think these guys need to be coached about this sort of stuff? This sort of thing, aggression, is either something you have within you or you don't. You're not going to turn Jay Bouwmeester into Bryan Marchment.

Ferland is (or should be) a power forward. He should have reacted immediately in that situation. That is his job. He shouldn't have to be coached or told that he is there to protect his teammates and intimidate the opponent. First and foremost that-is-his-job. The flames have no one else in there line up who can/will do that and be an effective player at the same time. And that is probably why he is getting as much rope as he has been given.

Ferland should be a 15-20 goal guy who is physically imposing. He should be a guy who can change a game with a goal, a hit, or a fight. I'm not seeing much of any of that.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by Poe969

I thought we were speculating on the value of Ferland compared to Drouin.

Humble apologies.

What do you ultimately think they'll get for Drouin? Where do you think he'll end up? When do you think he'll be traded?

Montreal? Given how they have been exposed as lacking offensive game breakers I would imagine Drouin would be a player on their radar. It's possibly Yzerman may prefer to trade him out of conference especially if he comes to the realization that he's not going to hit a home run on the return. Like I said before this siutuation as well as Hamonic and others will likely get sorted out at the draft.

[heep223]

Originally Posted by TOfan

I'm a hockey fan. I'm a Flames fan and a Leafs fan. Regardless, I don't need to be a fan of any team to see and understand what a player like Ferland should be.

Seriously, you think these guys need to be coached about this sort of stuff? This sort of thing, aggression, is either something you have within you or you don't. You're not going to turn Jay Bouwmeester into Bryan Marchment.

Ferland is (or should be) a power forward. He should have reacted immediately in that situation. That is his job. He shouldn't have to be coached or told that he is there to protect his teammates and intimidate the opponent. First and foremost that-is-his-job. The flames have no one else in there line up who can/will do that and be an effective player at the same time. And that is probably why he is getting as much rope as he has been given.

Ferland should be a 15-20 goal guy who is physically imposing. He should be a guy who can change a game with a goal, a hit, or a fight. I'm not seeing much of any of that.

Of course he should be coached and guided. He's a young emerging player who additionally has had problems between the ears in his past.

You're losing credibility

[burnitdown]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

Guys as physical as Ferland: Bouma, with an honourable mention to Poirier

Guys as fast as Ferland: Poirier, probably Agostino, maybe Grant

Guys with as much offensive talent: Poirier (more), Colborne (different), Granlund (shot)

Guys with overall skill set and potential equal to Ferland: Poirer (more)

That's it. Poirier. Different kind of player, but definitely more upside than Ferland.

I am not going to say anything silly like Ferland is more valuable than Drouin, or anything like that. But Ferland has a rare and desirable skill set. The Flames have stated as much many times. He is not a career bottom 6er - again, the Flames have publicly stated (Hartley, Treliving, Conroy) that they believe he is a top 6er.

You don't see it. That's fine. But comparing him to Agostino and Shore is laughable.

I agree with a lot of what you're saying but despite you saying all these things with such authority/certainty, I disagree with your assessment of his offensive ability. He can play in the top 6 as a banger and puck retriever but I see his cap at around 30-40 points. He averaged 42 pts/82 games in the AHL and 16.7 pts/82 games in the NHL to-date. Nothing has really screamed offensive threat yet. If you put any of those other guys in that role, I'd expect similar (if not better) production.