[News] With the 144th OA pick, the Flames select LW Ethan Wyttenbach

[Jay Random]

There are a couple of things no scout can definitely see by watching a 17-year-old kid play. One is exactly how much he can improve his strength and speed by consistent training, and the other is whether he has the dedication to do it.

Wyttenbach seems to have chosen Quinnipiac specifically because it will help him develop physically, and so far, it’s paying off. That’s a projectable quality, but he hadn’t shown it yet in his draft year, when everyone expected him to play another season in the USHL.

[Bingo]

https://twitter.com/user/status/2020967289902755874

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

Correction: they SAW nothing special, and CONCLUDED that production wouldn't translate.

That was last year. Things change. Progression is key, and his progression is highly indicative of success.

I would also add the caveats that a scout on the Flames very much did see something special that could translate, albeit further from a sure thing than someone in the first round (acknowledging there’s no such thing as a sure thing).

And I don’t think it has anything to do with scouts being “typically correct” or not either. 5 scouts might have a guy ranked 5 different places, but where they end up going depends on who has watched him, what the team list looks like, what picks a team has, etc. For all we know St. Louis correctly identified him as a good pick for the late first/early second, but didn’t have a pick until 147 so missed out.

I think people put way too much stock in draft position. Scouting is educated guessing and there are a whack of reasons why the draft order shakes out the way it does. Yes, size makes it easier to apply a player’s talents at the NHL level, but I don’t think it’s the determining factor it once was and I think scouting/drafting is slow to catch up.

[Wastedyouth]

Originally Posted by Snuffleupagus

As a 5th round pick had he stayed in junior and was leading the USHL in scoring I still would be excited, what he's doing against older players in NCAA div-1 college is very rare no matter what the division.

I was riffing on someone else that was poo pooing him.

[WickerChicken]

Got to give kudo's to Button and the Flames scouting staff. Hitting a few homeruns later in drafts will go a long way to accelerating this Rebiggle. They have been on a tear the last few years.

[1qqaaz]

Isn't Steve Pleau the one who would have scouted both Johnny Gaudreau and Ethan Wyttenbach?

[getbak]

Originally Posted by 1qqaaz

Isn't Steve Pleau the one who would have scouted both Johnny Gaudreau and Ethan Wyttenbach?

He's listed as a pro scout, so it's unlikely he would have been scouting the USHL.

[CFO]

Next 2 drafts will be important. After that the foundation should be set.

[YyjFlames]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

I would also add the caveats that a scout on the Flames very much did see something special that could translate, albeit further from a sure thing than someone in the first round (acknowledging there’s no such thing as a sure thing).

And I don’t think it has anything to do with scouts being “typically correct” or not either. 5 scouts might have a guy ranked 5 different places, but where they end up going depends on who has watched him, what the team list looks like, what picks a team has, etc. For all we know St. Louis correctly identified him as a good pick for the late first/early second, but didn’t have a pick until 147 so missed out.

I think people put way too much stock in draft position. Scouting is educated guessing and there are a whack of reasons why the draft order shakes out the way it does. Yes, size makes it easier to apply a player’s talents at the NHL level, but I don’t think it’s the determining factor it once was and I think scouting/drafting is slow to catch up.

One of the interesting things Conroy or Button said on a draft related clip is that part of their drafting process considers whether a player may fall and be available later in the draft.

Button also said after this past draft that they grabbed Phillips in the 3rd round, higher than they might have, because there had been a run on big bodied defenders and they wanted to get one.

They may have ranked Wyttenbach as a 3rd round talent but felt he was more likely than Phillips to fall to their next pick in the 5th round with the way the draft was going.

Similarly, a few other teams may have considered Wyttenbach as a 2nd or 3rd round prospect, but they ranked a couple of players higher (or prioritized size) and figured they'd take him with a later pick if he was available (and then had the same discussion in the 4th and 5th round with their lists).

EDIT: I think this is where BPA for teams is modified even against their own lists. They're actively analyzing the way a draft is going (both who they've picked so far against their pipeline and what players other teams are taking) and adjusting their list as they go. So after the first and maybe the second round, they might not necessarily be taking the top player on their list.

[TrentCrimmIndependent]

Originally Posted by Tacoman

Just a heads up that on that list is Tyson Gross, an undrafted 6’3” centre who is having a great year. Great on faceoffs…and his Dad is actually an employee of the Calgary Flames!

Nepo signing incoming?

[Itse]

Originally Posted by YyjFlames

One of the interesting things Conroy or Button said on a draft related clip is that part of their drafting process considers whether a player may fall and be available later in the draft.

Button also said after this past draft that they grabbed Phillips in the 3rd round, higher than they might have, because there had been a run on big bodied defenders and they wanted to get one.

They may have ranked Wyttenbach as a 3rd round talent but felt he was more likely than Phillips to fall to their next pick in the 5th round with the way the draft was going.

Similarly, a few other teams may have considered Wyttenbach as a 2nd or 3rd round prospect, but they ranked a couple of players higher (or prioritized size) and figured they'd take him with a later pick if he was available (and then had the same discussion in the 4th and 5th round with their lists).

EDIT: I think this is where BPA for teams is modified even against their own lists. They're actively analyzing the way a draft is going (both who they've picked so far against their pipeline and what players other teams are taking) and adjusting their list as they go. So after the first and maybe the second round, they might not necessarily be taking the top player on their list.

I would imagine this is one of those things were a GM and/or head of scouting might make an impact in strategy, some being more prone to this type of gambling and others just wanting to focus on who they like.

[Jiri Hrdina]

Bader has an interesting tweet this morning. Only 14 players have hit 50+ equivalency in their D+1 season. The names are impressive: Kariya, Eichel, Fantilli, Celebrini, Connor, Boeaser, Keller, Holloway, Cooley, Smith, Leonard, Perreault, Martone and now Wyttenbach.

[TrentCrimmIndependent]

That list ranges between good and elite nhlers. Very high floor.

Pretty encouraging.

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by Jiri Hrdina

Bader has an interesting tweet this morning. Only 14 players have hit 50+ equivalency in their D+1 season. The names are impressive: Kariya, Eichel, Fantilli, Celebrini, Connor, Boeaser, Keller, Holloway, Cooley, Smith, Leonard, Perreault, Martone and now Wyttenbach.

Response to a Pinder comment ...

https://twitter.com/user/status/2021245599820226640

[fotze2]

I've been grossly let down by Flames prospects over the years I am deeply cynical. The list is endless. Never get your hopes up even if justified.

[blankall]

Originally Posted by Jiri Hrdina

Bader has an interesting tweet this morning. Only 14 players have hit 50+ equivalency in their D+1 season. The names are impressive: Kariya, Eichel, Fantilli, Celebrini, Connor, Boeaser, Keller, Holloway, Cooley, Smith, Leonard, Perreault, Martone and now Wyttenbach.

Wyttenbach just turned 19 (today actually, happy bday!). For him to be leading a league that includes men aged 24-26 is very impressive.

[Gaudreau is a Ninja]

Originally Posted by fotze2

I've been grossly let down by Flames prospects over the years I am deeply cynical. The list is endless. Never get your hopes up even if justified.

I don’t know man, I agree back in the day they were bad at drafting but I got say Button and crew have done pretty good job at drafting. Especially in the middle to late draft. Gaudreau, Mangy, Fox, Ferland, Wolf just off the top of my head.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Gaudreau is a Ninja

I don’t know man, I agree back in the day they were bad at drafting but I got say Button and crew have done pretty good job at drafting. Especially in the middle to late draft. Gaudreau, Mangy, Fox, Ferland, Wolf just off the top of my head.

Pospisil, Fox.

[Calgary Highlander]

The main reason the draft selections look lean outside of a few guys is the sheer volume of picks Treliving traded away.

- 2025 1st Rounder (Monahan)
- 2025 4th Rounder (Tkachuk trade)
- 2024 5th rounder (Carpenter)
- 2024 7th rounder (Jarnkrok)
- 2023 3rd rounder (Jarnkrok)
- 2023 5th rounder (Toffoli)
- 2022 1st rounder (Toffoli)
- 2022 3rd rounder (Vladar)
- 2022 4th rounder (Pitlick)
- 2021 4th rounder (Forbort)
- 2020 3rd rounder (Gustaffson)
- 2020 4th rounder (Fantenberg)
- 2019 7th rounder (Shore)
- 2019 2nd rounder (Hamonic)
- 2018 1st rounder (Hamonic)
- 2018 2nd rounder (Hamonic)

Other than Toffoli, none of these acquisitions were particularly good.

Can't find draft steals if you pawn off all your bullets for a bunch of mediocre players.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Calgary Highlander

The main reason the draft selections look lean outside of a few guys is the sheer volume of picks Treliving traded away.


Other than Toffoli, none of these acquisitions were particularly good.

Can't find draft steals if you pawn off all your bullets for a bunch of mediocre players.

Well, the Monahan one was essentially to get Kadri. So we'll see what the end result is.