Making the playoffs or keeping our top-10 first round pick 2025?

[Goriders]

Originally Posted by Paulie Walnuts

Clearly fold the team and come back as an expansion team. Look at Vegas.

No mention of Seattle and how teams learned and didn't allow themselves to get swindled.

But the point is there’s more than one way to skin a cat.

[The Cobra]

Originally Posted by Vinny01

The Flames having multiple 1st round picks in 3 straight drafts is one way. They might not be picking crazy high but if they are picking multiple times in the top 32 that helps build a strong base. If they keep their cap sheet relatively clean and not waste money on free agents like Treliving loves to do they should have assets and space to acquire star players when they are asking out.

When star players ask out, they don’t tend to come to Calgary.

And star players aren’t on the market very often. It’s not a viable strategy.

[Paulie Walnuts]

Originally Posted by Goriders

But the point is there’s more than one way to skin a cat.

Yup you are right.

Another way to build a team. Scrap the current Flames and come back as an expansion team and take other teams to the cleaners for players and assets. Maybe we can change our weather as well when we come back.

[Vinny01]

Originally Posted by The Cobra

When star players ask out, they don’t tend to come to Calgary.

And star players aren’t on the market very often. It’s not a viable strategy.

Hamilton came and signed. Eichel would have come here. Having assets and cap space to be able to make trades is critical. Lindholm and Hanifin were great adds. They likely do not get their franchise players but targeting young up and coming players who want a change of scenery is a viable option and should be part of the strategy

[Vinny01]

Originally Posted by Bonded

Edmonton, Buffalo, and Ottawa have also some of the worst management I regards to trades and roster decisions. Edmonton has managed itself out of winning a cup despite having McDavid.

We can blame the several GM’s but we can’t discount the cultures these teams embraced where they basically said we are going to lose now to win later. These teams have struggled to turn things around and these teams have a much similar market to Calgary than the examples people love to throw out like Chicago, New York or Florida

[Paulie Walnuts]

Originally Posted by Vinny01

Hamilton came and signed. Eichel would have come here. Having assets and cap space to be able to make trades is critical. Lindholm and Hanifin were great adds. They likely do not get their franchise players but targeting young up and coming players who want a change of scenery is a viable option and should be part of the strategy

When we went after Eichel we had 2 other stars on the team, and 1 was rumoured to be in the package.

Hamilton trade while good, it came when the team wasn't ready to compete at a high level. And we didn't do much with him on the team 1 playoff appearance.

[Vinny01]

Originally Posted by Paulie Walnuts

When we went after Eichel we had 2 other stars on the team, and 1 was rumoured to be in the package.

Hamilton trade while good, it came when the team wasn't ready to compete at a high level. And we didn't do much with him on the team 1 playoff appearance.

What is your point here? I am not saying the flames do this deal now but it could be part of their rebuild strategy over the next couple of years. They could have a superstar Dman in Parekh and goalie in Wolf in 3 years so maybe then they could go after whatever Eichel or Pettersson is on the market. I am just saying having multiple picks and a good prospect base along with cap space are the very best assets to have when looking to acquire a young budding star.

[Bonded]

Originally Posted by Vinny01

We can blame the several GM’s but we can’t discount the cultures these teams embraced where they basically said we are going to lose now to win later. These teams have struggled to turn things around and these teams have a much similar market to Calgary than the examples people love to throw out like Chicago, New York or Florida

I don’t think those teams embraced losing to get high picks. I think they got there through sheer incompetence and that is why they are continuing to struggle. Edmonton just screwed themselves this offseason with their UFA signings and RFAs. Buffalo traded away ROR, Eichel, and Reinhart. Ottawa blew their wad on players who didn’t want to be there. Florida used to struggle to get players when they sucked as well, Zito is a good GM that made savvy trades.

[Hackey]

The failed rebuilds arent the issue, the management is the issue.

If Calgary is well managed I see them becoming more like Nashville and Minnesota. Good club's but not elite.

You need to use every method possible to build a team and if you neglect one, your path becomes so much tougher. High picks, depth picks, volume of picks, trades, UFAs. You need some luck in all of those areas but as soon as you remove a couple of those paths for building you're almost doomed. And if the high picks is off the table you're really going to have a substantially more difficult path as it is by far the most probable path to land elite talent.

[Paulie Walnuts]

Originally Posted by Vinny01

What is your point here? I am not saying the flames do this deal now but it could be part of their rebuild strategy over the next couple of years. They could have a superstar Dman in Parekh and goalie in Wolf in 3 years so maybe then they could go after whatever Eichel or Pettersson is on the market. I am just saying having multiple picks and a good prospect base along with cap space are the very best assets to have when looking to acquire a young budding star.

We will need those picks and prospects to graduate to come and play for us. So what is left to trade ? Young budding stars aren’t available for trade frequently. Hoping to see one come up isn’t a strategy.

We have cap space but we also have players to sign. Zary, Coronato and Wolf will all get significant raises. All 3 could potentially eat up that 20M.

[Aarongavey]

Originally Posted by Paulie Walnuts

The Vegas argument needs to stop they are an expansion team not even 10 years in the league.

At a minimum they are inconvenient for the narrative.

[Vinny01]

Originally Posted by Paulie Walnuts

We will need those picks and prospects to graduate to come and play for us. So what is left to trade ? Young budding stars aren’t available for trade frequently. Hoping to see one come up isn’t a strategy.

We have cap space but we also have players to sign. Zary, Coronato and Wolf will all get significant raises. All 3 could potentially eat up that 20M.

I thought it was clear when I said it was part of a strategy but you seem to be making it sound like it is the only strategy. The main point for me was to continue to draft multiple times in the high rounds and avoid overpriced free agents

[Aarongavey]

Originally Posted by Paulie Walnuts

We will need those picks and prospects to graduate to come and play for us. So what is left to trade ? Young budding stars aren’t available for trade frequently. Hoping to see one come up isn’t a strategy.

We have cap space but we also have players to sign. Zary, Coronato and Wolf will all get significant raises. All 3 could potentially eat up that 20M.

Well once we sign those players for a combined 20 million (wolf’s would not kick in until after next year anyway so maybe call it 13 million) the Flames would have about 27 million left next offseason to 5 forwards and 2 dmen. Cap space is not exactly a concern for the next 4-5 years for this franchise. God willing they sign all the young RFAs to long term 6-8 year deals and take advantage of this weird moment in time where their biggest problem year over year will be reaching the cap floor.

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by Paulie Walnuts

We will need those picks and prospects to graduate to come and play for us. So what is left to trade ? Young budding stars aren’t available for trade frequently. Hoping to see one come up isn’t a strategy.

We have cap space but we also have players to sign. Zary, Coronato and Wolf will all get significant raises. All 3 could potentially eat up that 20M.

Lol those 3 arent making 20M

[Paulie Walnuts]

Originally Posted by dino7c

Lol those 3 arent making 20M

You think they will sign for 3-4M each? Comparable have been set. We will be buying UFA years.

Zary is coming in 6-7
Coronato 6-7
Wolf is going to be 7 plus.

Conroy isn’t making the same mistakes Brad did.

[ComixZone]

Originally Posted by dino7c

Lol those 3 arent making 20M

I don't see why they wouldn't?

On long-term deals, you're likely in the 6-7M range for Zary and Coronato already, and if Wolf continues to grow the way he is...he may end up being a $9M goalie on his next contract if the Flames want to commit to him long term.

$7M on a $98M salary cap is 7.1% of the salary cap.
$7M on a $39M salary cap was 17.9% of the salary cap (Iginla, 05/06)
17.9% of a $98M salary cap is 17.5M.

$7M salary in 25/26 is $2.8M in 05/06, I feel like you’re still thinking $7M is top-line money or something.

[Fan69]

To me its about two things, what we have and what we need.

What do we have?

Huby-kads-sharky
Coleman - -
Weegs-

All signed long term and probably not going anywhere.
A center three wings one defencemen. Two of the three forwards over thirty.

Established or establishing but not signed. Zary, Wolf, Coronnato, backs, pospisil, Anderson, pachal, miro.

Everyone else is untradeable due to whatever combing factors, bean, mantha, kuz.

Only really tradable chip is Andersen who had any value, possibly vladar but really how much?

Im on the trade Anderson train i just think this is his peak and it only goes down hill from here. Will not be worth his contract.

Trade him gain another first, or use him for Cozens. His trade will leave the defence a shambles hopefully land in the top ten.

Line up going forward

Huby-kadri-sharky
Coleman- cozens

Weegs -

Signed long term.

Line up next year?

Huby-kadri-sharky
Coleman-cozens-coronnato
Stromgren-zary-pospisil
Pelts-kerins-?

Weegs-pachal
Miro-bahl
?-?


I think their is more to Cozens possibly top line, but lets say he gives you top six production 55 to 65 points, and not a black hole defensively. If a few of the youngsters continue progression, particularly Zary at center, and Scoronato continues scoring, and kadri doesnt fall off a cliff the forwards are looking pretty good with two possible top six centers under 25.

What do we need?
A Cozens type established center? Either trading Anderson we would have three firsts and two seconds in this draft plus hopefully a center prospect from the trade.
Two top four defencemen.

One trade could change our forwards considerably to me the forward group would be consistently playoffs the Defence tougher to solve but Wolf's progression would hide some of that.

Cost for cozens hypothetically a first and a basha/ battaglia level prospect. Still leave this draft with four picks in the first two rounds adjust some of our depth to a center signed long term. Try use cap space to trade a deal for a top four defencemen.


Center depth going forward?

Kadri,cozens, zary, backs, kerins, hopeful center from anderson trade, ( Frondell, obrian, Desnoyers from top ten pick), kerins.

I dont see us making the playoffs. I dont see Anderson getting better, and trading him would go a long way to hitting top ten especially if you keep vladar playing half the games.
The cost to aquire a Cozens type would he offset by the Anderson trades and higher pick.

Young center, one Anderson trade. A top four defender and his team looks completely different. Does it sport a mcdavid? No but its a deep team with experience, youth, and skill

[Bandwagon Surfer]

All I want is a team that looks good enough that I can see a plausible path to the cup. They don't need to win the cup, but I need it to seem plausible enough that I want to cheer for them.

Some of the Iginla Kiprusoff teams hit that mark and it was fun.

The Tkachuk Gaudreau era never had a team that was good enough to get my hopes up. All those teams were too flawed, they never had enough pieces to make it. Trying to patch it up with UFA spending and trading futures turned into a depressing death spiral.

Wolf gives me hope for the future, but goalie god mode alone is not plausible enough. There is so much building left to do.

[1qqaaz]

I don't just want a team with a "plausible path to the cup" - though this might be more fair and realistic.

Rather, what I want is a team that is a genuine contender and has 5+ consecutive stabs at the cup.
Washington led the division many times before winning the cup. Chicago, Detroit, Pittsburgh, and LA all had several stabs at the can as contenders. Even Vegas and Florida can be included in this group.

Don't put all your eggs in one basket for one playoff run. Rather, the team should be elite for a handful of years.
Cap efficiency and asset management matter.

[GreenLantern2814]

Originally Posted by Aarongavey

At a minimum they are inconvenient for the narrative.

I don’t see how they are.

Vegas was the first expansion team in two decades. They played their hand extremely well in the lead up to the draft, and selected a team with four second lines.

They have been ruthless sending out players before they decline, because they play in the most desirable market in the league and every top player will want to come here anyway so long as they win.

All they were missing was the superstar centre, and when one came available, the spent one of their nine second line players, a pick, and who cares for Jack Eichel.

Like, sure, if you have all those things going for you, you can buck the narrative.

When you’re the Calgary Flames, you need to BEDMAS that ####.