[Signing] Flames sign Deryk Engelland (3yrs, $2.9M AAV)

[Itse]

Originally Posted by Street Pharmacist

I'm not upset about the money, we're miles away from it mattering at all. I'm disappointed that we keep getting players to fill a role (playing physical and acting as a deterrent) that only had so many sheltered minutes to give.

Hmm, I guess the difference then is that I don't see Engelland needing that much sheltering. Sure, he's a bottom pairing D-man, but he's not terrible either. (Based on what I remember, which admittedly isn't that much.)

[Dentoman]

Originally Posted by Aarongavey

Signings like this one really make you wonder whether Treliving and Burke instead of Feaster and Weisbrod was a lateral move in terms of hockey intelligence or whether our front office has regressed and taken a step backward.

Holy hyperbole!!
Treliving comes out and explains the reasoning for the deal .... and I liked his explanation. This signing, although admittedly expensive, was for a player that, in his eyes, fills a hole on the blueline. He also feels Engelland will bring some intangibles. At this length of term, this contract will not become an issue for the Flames.
The Flames are not at a stage where they can trade prospects for players and are not that attractive of a destination for UFA's .... so what do you do? You pay them the money, which the Flames do have and have tons of cap space to do so.

[EldrickOnIce]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

Completely agreed with Treliving's comments about the contract...

Didn't want to give term. Say it again. Didn't want to give term.

Gave extra dollars (at a time when they are reaching for the floor) in order to keep the term short. Got a character guy for an interim period to fill a gap.

Whining about the salary is completely missing the big picture IMO.

Absolutely true.
I really don't care for this signing, most meaning I don't care about it at all. It was a good year to be a journeyman right handed defenseman and the only thing that mattered was not handing out term.

Flames are front runners for McDavid now. This is very good.

[cral12]

Justify the Engelland signing all you want, this is not a good signing other than the fact that we will be in an excellent draft slot in 2015 and I'm all for that. I hope that is what this is and when we are truly contenders Flames brass don't make a signing like this.

Just so no one gets their hopes up on Engelland, he is what he is - depth guy, tough, good teammate...

From my colleague and from someone who knows the Pens better than pretty much anyone outside the organization (and some within), @MikeColligan:
"...insane money for a 3rd pairing defenseman with minimal upside..."

[Calgary4LIfe]

Originally Posted by Street Pharmacist

He brings a physical edge that Butler didn't. The thing I'm confused about is who is actually going to play hockey when Bollig, Big Ern and Engelland are on the ice?

He got heavily sheltered minutes in Pittsburgh, as did the other two. There's only so many sheltered minutes to go around. One of these guys will be playing in over their head

Someone posted that Bollig actually had the majority of his zone starts in the defensive zone, and against tough competition. Not the type of guy it seems that needs sheltering, though I haven't checked the advanced stats for myself.

[Dentoman]

Originally Posted by cral12

Just so no one gets their hopes up on Engelland, he is what he is - depth guy, tough, good teammate...
"

Don't think anyone really thinks any different.
As someone posted earlier ... it was a perfect year to be a RH defenseman.

[868904]

People still don't get it, whining about Engelland's first pass and zone exits and his ability.

This signing and Bollig's acquisition aren't about Engelland or Bollig or winning games next year. It's about giving the young players, especially those small softies like Sven and Gaudreau and Granlund, the room and confidence and freedom to play their game.

The added toughness is an investment in protection of these young players so they don't get ruined.

There's more to building a team than collecting all the skill players, it's not a hockey card collection.

[Timbo]

What if...he plays close to his contracts worth. Wouldn't that be great?
Yes it is probably very unlikely, however bear in mind he will have a different coach and that can make a big difference. (Stajan comes to mind here how he was brutal under B. Sutter's system)

He also will not be the #1 enforcer and can concentrate more on other parts of his game.
With the current climate of the FA and Calgary in a rebuild and hovering below the cap floor it is a given we needed to overpay. Better in money then term IMO.
The question I have is, were there viable alternatives to fill this need?
I have yet to see any other players mentioned other than Butler. Treliving seems to be a person not to shy away from hard work and diligence, so I have faith that he exhausted many other player options until getting Engelland.

I had no illusions earlier this year that someone would be overpaid by the Flames to get to the floor.
I hope Engelland celebrates his financial win-fall and comes to camp in shape with a good attitude and can play within the system and prove his worth to the degree that Flames management hopes he can.

Best of luck Engelland. here is to hoping you don't get tied to the CP whipping post.

Cheers

[bubbsy]

agree with the above....

flames could have likely gotten gilbert (maybe a few more bucks) who's play in florida did seem to indicate that he's got top4 worthy play in him.

Based on this signing, i don't think the intention was necessarily bringing in a good hockey player. They got a #7 or #8 dman from the pens in who adds toughness but also good teammate/locker room qualities.

[puds]

Obviously, a bad contract in the vacuum but he fills a current need and down the road the contract will have no effect on us once we are rebuilt and spending to the cap. Therefore, no issue with the contract and excited to see what he can bring to the table.

[flambers]

Basically a #6 / #7 type of dman. This one is a bad contract, in year three of the deal Flames will have a tough time deciding what to do with him (i.e. minors etc).

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by cral12

Justify the Engelland signing all you want, this is not a good signing other than the fact that we will be in an excellent draft slot in 2015 and I'm all for that. I hope that is what this is and when we are truly contenders Flames brass don't make a signing like this.

Just so no one gets their hopes up on Engelland, he is what he is - depth guy, tough, good teammate...

From my colleague and from someone who knows the Pens better than pretty much anyone outside the organization (and some within), @MikeColligan:
"...insane money for a 3rd pairing defenseman with minimal upside..."

Everyone knows what he is Cral - they need a physical #6 D. Who cares about the money? Seriously, why does anyone care? They have NO CHANCE of approaching the cap anytime soon. None.

They saved term by giving dollars. Term is way more important right now, IMO

And he won't impact the price of any other players.

[ricardodw]

I think the Flames Management clearly understand that it is dangerous to have swagger provided by only McGrattan.

It's a long season and the protected small guys will get extra attention when McGrattan is injured (hands have to be be injured at some point in the season) and is unable to stand up for them.

The year Jackman was unable to fight and Tom Kostopulous was forced into answering the bell was brutal.

[Vulcan]

Originally Posted by Street Pharmacist

I'm not upset about the money, we're miles away from it mattering at all. I'm disappointed that we keep getting players to fill a role (playing physical and acting as a deterrent) that only had so many sheltered minutes to give.

Yeah, a player of his seeming quality can be hidden on the 4th line but it's pretty hard to hide a defenceman. We'll see how it goes. He may be better than I think or maybe Wotherspoon pushes him down to the 7th spot.

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by flambers

Basically a #6 / #7 type of dman. This one is a bad contract, in year three of the deal Flames will have a tough time deciding what to do with him (i.e. minors etc).

What?

The Flames have all of $20 m committed to 6 players in the final year of Engelland's contract. Hudler, Jones, Glencross, Russell, Hiller and Ramo will all be on new deals, or else playing elsewhere. That same year will see Gaudreau, Monahan, Brodie, Baertschi, Wotherspoon, Granlund and Ferland on new RFA deals, and Giordano requiring a new contract. Poirier, Sieloff, Klimchuk, Kulak will be in the final years of their ELC deals, and Bennett will still have another year left on top of that. In all likelihood, the decision about what to do with Engelland will be a minor one.

[Resolute 14]

Originally Posted by 868904

People still don't get it, whining about Engelland's first pass and zone exits and his ability.

This signing and Bollig's acquisition aren't about Engelland or Bollig or winning games next year. It's about giving the young players, especially those small softies like Sven and Gaudreau and Granlund, the room and confidence and freedom to play their game.

The added toughness is an investment in protection of these young players so they don't get ruined.

There's more to building a team than collecting all the skill players, it's not a hockey card collection.

Not just a protection of these young players - but to wear the opposition down. We want these guys to hit people. Bollig is the kind of player who will drive into the corner hard - hard enough that players like Taylor Hall will pull the chute rather than take contact. (Seriously. One of the Chicago papers wrote an entire story about how Bollig created goals against Edmonton by scaring the crap out of Hall.) We want Engelland to be the same type of guy.

We also, of course, want these intangible benefits to at least create as much offence as any tangible mistakes cost. They are, after all, fourth line and third pairing players.

[getbak]

Originally Posted by bubbsy

flames could have likely gotten gilbert (maybe a few more bucks) who's play in florida did seem to indicate that he's got top4 worthy play in him.

The rumour is that they were interested in Gilbert and were planning on going hard after him. He signed with the Habs pretty early in the day, and Engelland was signed pretty late in the day.

Gilbert has played 7 full seasons in the NHL and has played in 5 playoff games. Over the last five seasons, he has played on the 30th overall team twice, and the 29th overall team twice (he got traded from the Oilers at the deadline, but played most of the season in Edmonton).

The Flames will likely finish near the bottom of the league again next season. The Habs will likely be in or fighting for a playoff spot all of next season, and will most likely be in at the end.


I bet the Flames did go hard after Gilbert, and probably offered him more money, but the desire to finally play for something resembling a contender won out. Engelland, on the other hand, has played the last five seasons on a contender and still hasn't seen much playoff action, so the money won out for him.

[Flash Walken]

Put me in the category with Treliving that doesn't think Engelland is nearly as bad as he's being made out to be.

[Phanuthier]

Originally Posted by Resolute 14

Not just a protection of these young players - but to wear the opposition down. We want these guys to hit people. Bollig is the kind of player who will drive into the corner hard - hard enough that players like Taylor Hall will pull the chute rather than take contact. (Seriously. One of the Chicago papers wrote an entire story about how Bollig created goals against Edmonton by scaring the crap out of Hall.) We want Engelland to be the same type of guy.

We also, of course, want these intangible benefits to at least create as much offence as any tangible mistakes cost. They are, after all, fourth line and third pairing players.

that sounds hilarous

got a link?

[StrykerSteve]

Based on everything I'm reading about the man, I'm excited to have him as a part of the team.