[Rumour] Dowbiggin is reporting a new head of hockey ops

[kyuss275]

Originally Posted by Lanny'sDaMan

Solstice UthBaradin ‏@Baradinthebard 2h
@RogMillions So what would you puts the odds of Shanny joining the #NHLFlames at?


Roger Millions ‏@RogMillions 3m
@Baradinthebard even money


Solstice UthBaradin ‏@Baradinthebard 1m
@RogMillions I like them odds.


Little twitter conversation I just had with Roger about Shanny. Thought I would share as it is on topic.

Not being a big gambler, i presume that means 50-50 chance. Kind of hoping it was more of a done deal.

[Cleveland Steam Whistle]

Originally Posted by Roof-Daddy

He was President of the Blues for the last number of years as they rebuilt to what they are now.

2006-06-30 Blues - hired as president of hockey operations
2011-05-03 Blues - re-signed as president of hockey operations to a multi-year contract extension
2012-10-05 Blues - agreed as president of hockey operations to a buyout of the remaining 3 years of his contract.

Thanks, I knew he was president of the Blues, just wasn't sure what his exec. resume was before that, if anything. Obviously you can spin things in various ways, but to me it looks like we are frigging ourselves over an executive who in 6 seasons, failed to make the playoffs 4 times, qualified twice and won 1 round....................

I get it the Blues look poised to potentially be better, although failed to take a step forward this year with a first round loss, but I'm not sure I get what all the JD hoopla is about. What has he really accomplished? We certainly ran D.Sutter out of town for less as far as result go.

[Lanny'sDaMan]

Originally Posted by kyuss275

Not being a big gambler, i presume that means 50-50 chance. Kind of hoping it was more of a done deal.

Yup even money is 50-50.

[Flames Draft Watcher]

Originally Posted by Cleveland Steam Whistle

Thanks, I knew he was president of the Blues, just wasn't sure what his exec. resume was before that, if anything. Obviously you can spin things in various ways, but to me it looks like we are frigging ourselves over an executive who in 6 seasons, failed to make the playoffs 4 times, qualified twice and won 1 round....................

I get it the Blues look poised to potentially be better, although failed to take a step forward this year with a first round loss, but I'm not sure I get what all the JD hoopla is about. What has he really accomplished? We certainly ran D.Sutter out of town for less as far as result go.

Sutter was our GM. Davidson was the Blues president. So they aren't directly comparable that way.

Davidson was responsible for bringing Doug Armstrong in as a succession plan for when Pleau retired. Armstrong and Davidson brought in Ken Hitchcock which looked like a brilliant move.

If you want to compare him to Ken King, King was responsible for bringing in Sutter. Letting Sutter choose Playfair, Keenan, Sutter as coaches. King is responsible for bringing in Feaster and replacing Sutter with him as well as bringing in Weisbrod and Hartley.

The credit for the Blues rebuild should go to Armstrong, Davidson but also the drafting of now Columbus GM Jarmo Kekelainen who was Asst. GM before Armstrong became GM.

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by Cleveland Steam Whistle

Thanks, I knew he was president of the Blues, just wasn't sure what his exec. resume was before that, if anything. Obviously you can spin things in various ways, but to me it looks like we are frigging ourselves over an executive who in 6 seasons, failed to make the playoffs 4 times, qualified twice and won 1 round....................

I get it the Blues look poised to potentially be better, although failed to take a step forward this year with a first round loss, but I'm not sure I get what all the JD hoopla is about. What has he really accomplished? We certainly ran D.Sutter out of town for less as far as result go.

Look at the age of the Blues core now versus when he took over. Davidson set them up to succeed in the future as well as any team in the league. And he didn't take any shortcuts or throw around money to do it - he patiently drafted and developed a homegrown squad of very good young players.

[Cleveland Steam Whistle]

Originally Posted by Flames Draft Watcher

Sutter was our GM. Davidson was the Blues president. So they aren't directly comparable that way.

Davidson was responsible for bringing Doug Armstrong in as a succession plan for when Pleau retired. Armstrong and Davidson brought in Ken Hitchcock which looked like a brilliant move.

If you want to compare him to Ken King, King was responsible for bringing in Sutter. Letting Sutter choose Playfair, Keenan, Sutter as coaches. King is responsible for bringing in Feaster and replacing Sutter with him as well as bringing in Weisbrod and Hartley.

The credit for the Blues rebuild should go to Armstrong, Davidson but also the drafting of now Columbus GM Jarmo Kekelainen who was Asst. GM before Armstrong became GM.

I agree with much of what you said above, although I do think you are too focused on the titles of President in your comparisons, not all NHL Presidents do the same things IMO.

Regardless of that, I think the key is what I bolded. Specifically the words "looked" and "credit". What exactly are we giving him credit for at this point? The answer appears to be be moves that "look" good, but haven't really amounted to anything yet. JD has very little actual "success" in his exec. role to his name, just a bunch of stuff as fans that "we think seem good" and that we "expect to pan out".

Point is, it is far from a certainty anything he's done will pan out. St. Louis may struggle just as the Flames did for the first 5 years post lock out to accomplish much of anything, and Columbus may continue to spin in circles.

I think there is a lot of counting chickens before eggs have hatched with JD, and there was a time when the bulk of Flames fans felt like D. Sutter / K. King had their on ice plan locked and loaded and we were sitting pretty. Things change pretty fast, and far too many people are way too upset we missed on an exec. in JD that has yet to give any proven results IMO. Maybe a year or two from now there might be evidence to suggest our dissapointment is valid, but certainly there isn't much to go on right now.

[Cleveland Steam Whistle]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

Look at the age of the Blues core now versus when he took over. Davidson set them up to succeed in the future as well as any team in the league. And he didn't take any shortcuts or throw around money to do it - he patiently drafted and developed a homegrown squad of very good young players.

Did he, or did he just inherit an over the hill team with no where to go but to get younger. Kind of like what is happening with the Flames right now. I'm not going to be doing cartwheels over the fact the Flames have gotten younger and giving the management staff thumbs up for doing it, it's happenning by default.

And it's not like he made them younger while keeping them competitive, as mentioned, he missed the playoffs 4 out of 6 and has one playoff win in that time frame. Not sure he was working any miracles over there.

[Roof-Daddy]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

Look at the age of the Blues core now versus when he took over. Davidson set them up to succeed in the future as well as any team in the league. And he didn't take any shortcuts or throw around money to do it - he patiently drafted and developed a homegrown squad of very good young players.

You're speaking of Davidson like he was the GM. I'd imagine Armstrong is more directly responsible for the Blues current situation than Davidson is, but Davidson is the one who brought Armstrong in.

[Flames Draft Watcher]

Originally Posted by Roof-Daddy

You're speaking of Davidson like he was the GM. I'd imagine Armstrong is more directly responsible for the Blues current situation than Davidson is, but Davidson is the one who brought Armstrong in.

Davidson I think is even more hands on than King. The evidence for this is the behind the scenes draft look with STL a few years ago and the behind the scenes look at CBJ this year. Davidson sits in with the GM and the scouts for all their meetings and does say things and have input on the process. I think Davidson is similar to Lowe in EDM in that they both are involved in a lot of the hockey decisions. King I'm sure is involved in the biggest decisions involving our big players but no evidence he's as involved as guys like Davidson and Lowe.

[Phanuthier]

Originally Posted by Roof-Daddy

You're speaking of Davidson like he was the GM. I'd imagine Armstrong is more directly responsible for the Blues current situation than Davidson is, but Davidson is the one who brought Armstrong in.

Well the hope for me is Shanahan can bring in a quality NHL GM

[MissTeeks]

Eric Francis‏@EricFrancis2m

Ken King just confirmed Flames are looking to expand hockey operations and have talked to several people including Shanahan. No decision yet

[taxbuster]

Originally Posted by Phanuthier

Well the hope for me is Shanahan can bring in a quality NHL GM

Until Feaster has blown his wad (1 yr? 2 yr? more) I don't think you're likely to see a big change.

I think that the Flames will EXPAND their hockey ops, not dismantle it. Weisbrod is ready for the draft. As long as Feaster reports to a hockey guy (ie not KK) - so someone like Shanny - I'm fine with that.

Checks and balances.

[Phanuthier]

Originally Posted by taxbuster

Until Feaster has blown his wad (1 yr? 2 yr? more) I don't think you're likely to see a big change.

I think that the Flames will EXPAND their hockey ops, not dismantle it. Weisbrod is ready for the draft. As long as Feaster reports to a hockey guy (ie not KK) - so someone like Shanny - I'm fine with that.

Checks and balances.

Well I would hope Feaster gets "promoted" to something more on business side, like "organizational manager of hiring for Flames/Stamps/Roughnecks/etc" and we get a actual GM. Something similar to Lowe.

[MissTeeks]

@CruickshankCH: #Flames Ken King on dinner with Brendan Shanahan last week: "There were no jobs offered nor sought." Team trying to add hockey dep't depth.

[mikephoen]

Originally Posted by MissTeeks

@CruickshankCH: #Flames Ken King on dinner with Brendan Shanahan last week: "There were no jobs offered nor sought." Team trying to add hockey dep't depth.

That's the kind of doublespeak denial I was looking for. That confirms it for me that Shanny is coming aboard.

[sureLoss]

Scott Cruickshank ‏@CruickshankCH 35s #Flames president Ken King added that new role is, so far, undefined. "We are not looking for a general manager, and Jay is aware of that."

[Fire]

Originally Posted by sureLoss

Scott Cruickshank ‏@CruickshankCH 35s #Flames president Ken King added that new role is, so far, undefined. "We are not looking for a general manager, and Jay is aware of that."

nm, I didn't see the "not".

[Vulcan]

Originally Posted by sureLoss

Scott Cruickshank ‏@CruickshankCH 35s #Flames president Ken King added that new role is, so far, undefined. "We are not looking for a general manager, and Jay is aware of that."

Yeah but if Jay gets a new boss, the writing is on the wall. It's like when King hired Feaster as Asst. GM, Sutter's days were numbered.

[Red John]

Originally Posted by sureLoss

Scott Cruickshank ‏@CruickshankCH 35s #Flames president Ken King added that new role is, so far, undefined. "We are not looking for a general manager, and Jay is aware of that."

Too bad.

Got hopes up for nothing.

[icecube]

Originally Posted by Phanuthier

Well I would hope Feaster gets "promoted" to something more on business side, like "organizational manager of hiring for Flames/Stamps/Roughnecks/etc" and we get a actual GM. Something similar to Lowe.

Promoting Feaster would be akin to promoting this guy...