'The Walking Dead- TV show ONLY! Only spoilers allowed are about PAST TV episodes!

[Daradon]

Originally Posted by ken0042

So here is my question- is the Governor dead? We see he has a single stab wound- close to the heart but obviously not through the heart as he was able to crawl around a bit. Then we also see his new g/f point a gun at his head and shoot, but we don't see him actually die. We could find out in season 4.5 that he was about to be bit by a walker, and she shot the walker.

I thought about that briefly too, I don't think they are going that route.

If he does show up, I'm turning off the show for good right then and there.

[DuffMan]

Originally Posted by GreenLantern

It is a neat thing to watch, but sometimes the actors take it a little too serious so I get uncomfortable and change it. I guess I am not an actor so I don't understand what you go through on a TV series, but the girl who plays Maggie was crying when she talked about losing the guy playing Herschel from the show.

She was in Maxim awhile ago and I seem to remember her saying she gets very emotionally involved in the characters, something like that.

[Flames Draft Watcher]

Salvaged the season with that one. Somehow quite satisfying.

[Zulu29]

So glad the governor is dead

[doctajones428]

From the Hollywood Reporter:

What was the conversation like when you found out the Governor would be killed off in the midseason finale?

Originally Posted by David Morrisy

I did get the death call [from Scott] and it's always a sad one. I knew the Governor wasn't someone who was going to be in it forever. I was very sad because I loved being in the show and working with everybody. Then the double whammy of also being the person who brings Scott Wilson's participation to an end was really heavy.

http://m.hollywoodreporter.com/entry/view/id/8694

He gone!

[Igster]

Originally Posted by ken0042

So here is my question- is the Governor dead? We see he has a single stab wound- close to the heart but obviously not through the heart as he was able to crawl around a bit. Then we also see his new g/f point a gun at his head and shoot, but we don't see him actually die. We could find out in season 4.5 that he was about to be bit by a walker, and she shot the walker.

On The Talking Dead, Kirkman talked about the fact that they don't want to give characters like The Governor a big death as it kind of celebrates how important the character is. That is why we don't really see him die...it's more assumed and not even worth the camera shot of him getting shot by Lilly. It's sort of like a last kick in the crotch if you will, for a bad character.

[Cortez]

I realize the plot holes have been talked about on here, but this really bothered me- When the governor and his crew first show up outside the prison there isn't a single walker up along that exterior wall. Yet this whole season we have seen hordes of them basically pushing over the fence. Where did they all go???

Great episode though- it's going to be a long wait for it to start up again.

[fredr123]

So, in January 2013, it is learned that Scott Gimple will replace Glen Mazarra as show runner: http://ca.ign.com/articles/2013/01/1...ead-showrunner

In March 2013, it is reported that David Morrissey will return to The Walking Dead as a regular cast member for season 4: http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/liv...rrissey-431929

Filming for season 4 begins in May: http://screenrant.com/walking-dead-s...re-start-date/

In August 2013, Morrissey is cast in a different pilot on AMC: http://tvline.com/2013/08/28/david-m...on-4-governor/

Season 4 begins and we get two Governor-centric episodes at the end of the first half of the season that have little to no connection with the rest of the main cast. Then he is killed off in the half-season's final episode.

I wonder what changed between the writers/producers of the show and Morrissey to go from being a regular cast member to basically an afterthought in a couple months?

[Hockeyguy15]

Other than the title of the second link it doesn't mention he would be a series regular, it just says the door was left open to appear in season 4.

I don't believe they ever intended for the Governor to be a regular character, he was just a means to an end. I think you may be over thinking the timeline and what they had planned for the Governor from the start.

Correct me if I am wrong but they would have been done shooting the Governor episodes and he would have already been dead long before he signed onto another show in August.

[GreenLantern]

Originally Posted by fredr123

So, in January 2013, it is learned that Scott Gimple will replace Glen Mazarra as show runner: http://ca.ign.com/articles/2013/01/1...ead-showrunner

In March 2013, it is reported that David Morrissey will return to The Walking Dead as a regular cast member for season 4: http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/liv...rrissey-431929

Filming for season 4 begins in May: http://screenrant.com/walking-dead-s...re-start-date/

In August 2013, Morrissey is cast in a different pilot on AMC: http://tvline.com/2013/08/28/david-m...on-4-governor/

Season 4 begins and we get two Governor-centric episodes at the end of the first half of the season that have little to no connection with the rest of the main cast. Then he is killed off in the half-season's final episode.

I wonder what changed between the writers/producers of the show and Morrissey to go from being a regular cast member to basically an afterthought in a couple months?

Thanks for this fred, this is what I was trying to figure out. The whole prison attack with the tank is a nod to the comics, from the way they line up to the line "Killem all." Except the show did a way better job, especially how they tied in the whole Herschel, and the girls shooting people.. it was great. Very well done.

I really think this whole half of the season was literally just fixing a mistake. The mistake of leaving the Gov alive.

[Hemi-Cuda]

Originally Posted by GreenLantern

Thanks for this fred, this is what I was trying to figure out. The whole prison attack with the tank is a nod to the comics, from the way they line up to the line "Killem all." Except the show did a way better job, especially how they tied in the whole Herschel, and the girls shooting people.. it was great. Very well done.

I really think this whole half of the season was literally just fixing a mistake. The mistake of leaving the Gov alive.

Except in the show the new people the Governor was with had zero reason to follow him into a battle. If they had simply gone this route at the end of season 3 with the Woodbury people it would have been way better

[Ben_in_Canada]

Originally Posted by Cortez

I realize the plot holes have been talked about on here, but this really bothered me- When the governor and his crew first show up outside the prison there isn't a single walker up along that exterior wall. Yet this whole season we have seen hordes of them basically pushing over the fence. Where did they all go???

Great episode though- it's going to be a long wait for it to start up again.

Rick & Carl knocked off quite a few of them when they did get through the fence in a previous episode, that is my take on the fence being less populated as usual.

[Bring_Back_Shantz]

Originally Posted by Hemi-Cuda

Except in the show the new people the Governor was with had zero reason to follow him into a battle. If they had simply gone this route at the end of season 3 with the Woodbury people it would have been way better

People keep saying that, but to be honest I think it's the exact opposite.
These people had a lot more reason to attack the prison than the people of Woodburry did.

The people in Woodburry had a nice cozy town to live in, with walls, elecricity, and plenty to eat, why would they risk all of that, and their own lives just to move to some prison? When things went wrong, of course they would run back to their relatively safe homes behind walls.

This new group was living in RV's, were short on food and supplies, and had to worry about walkers every day. It's not too far fetched to think they would be run a little ragged, and would be thinking that attacking a prison might not be a bad idea, especially if they got to keep what was left of it afterwards.

My thoughs on how it would go:

Gov: "Hey guys, let's attack that prison"

Woodburry Citizen: "F that. I'm staying here in my house, besides I have to keep an eye on these tomatos"

New group: "That's not a bad idea, it's a hell of a lot better than living out here in this field next to marginally effective zombie pits. Also, yeah, we have a tank, this should be kind of easy, let's do it."

[Redliner]

Great episode, even with all the plot holes. Honestly, the thing that bugged me the most was the mud zombie that bit the little girl. Don't get me wrong it was super cool, but it has been shown consistently throughout the series that the zombies "activate" as soon as there are people around, so how did the kid manage to play in that patch of dirt for what is presumably at least an hour before the zombie decided to wake up and come for breakfast?

[Hockeyguy15]

Originally Posted by Redliner

Great episode, even with all the plot holes. Honestly, the thing that bugged me the most was the mud zombie that bit the little girl. Don't get me wrong it was super cool, but it has been shown consistently throughout the series that the zombies "activate" as soon as there are people around, so how did the kid manage to play in that patch of dirt for what is presumably at least an hour before the zombie decided to wake up and come for breakfast?

The zombie was stuck under the flood zone sign, once the kid dug that up it was game over.

[fredr123]

Originally Posted by Hockeyguy15

Other than the title of the second link it doesn't mention he would be a series regular, it just says the door was left open to appear in season 4.

I don't believe they ever intended for the Governor to be a regular character, he was just a means to an end. I think you may be over thinking the timeline and what they had planned for the Governor from the start.

Correct me if I am wrong but they would have been done shooting the Governor episodes and he would have already been dead long before he signed onto another show in August.

I was going to post other links to refute your point about the "series regular" but it appears all of the other links rely on the Hollywood Reporter as a source, so perhaps you are correct.

And with respect to your point in the third paragraph, according to this, filming for the entire fourth season wrapped on November 22: http://www.wetpaint.com/walking-dead...es-filming-end So, theoretically, I suppose they could have had the first half done and all of the Governors scenes shot by August when Morrissey was announced as the lead in the new AMC pilot. Although, who knows how much of the plot they map out in advance when they are breaking episodes. They could have known early in the process the Governor was going to die mid-season or they could have changed things up later on.

[Daradon]

Originally Posted by Hemi-Cuda

Except in the show the new people the Governor was with had zero reason to follow him into a battle. If they had simply gone this route at the end of season 3 with the Woodbury people it would have been way better

Agreed. I agree with your line of reasoning for the whole argument pretty much, was going to quote your post after the episode on this topic, but decided not to comment. The way I see it is, at least they fixed the mistake and ended it well. I'm not going to worry too much about the details, I'm just glad they can move on.

I totally understand if it bugs someone so much it turns them off, things like that often bug me like that too, and I've definitely gone back and forth on this show for making no sense in situations and plot holes like this. But I really enjoyed the episode so I'm putting my reservations on the back burner again and open to see what they got coming next.

This series definitely has had some problems, I don't think I'd put it in the top tier of television programs on air right now, even though it's popularity would indicate so. But at the end of the day, there are enough good spots (above average acting, interesting characters, interesting premise, occasional great dramatic scenes/conversations) for me to continue watching at this point.

I do feel your pain though, I really do.

[Inglewood Jack]

Originally Posted by Igster

On The Talking Dead, Kirkman talked about the fact that they don't want to give characters like The Governor a big death as it kind of celebrates how important the character is. That is why we don't really see him die...it's more assumed and not even worth the camera shot of him getting shot by Lilly. It's sort of like a last kick in the crotch if you will, for a bad character.

well the writers might think that way, but for the audience that's not how most of us work I think. if there's a villain who did a lot of evil stuff, we want to see them get their comeuppance in the worst way. it's an old trope to see the bad guy get it, but I'd rather have that simple satisfaction than "don't bother with this dude, he's not worth the camera time" treatment.

Originally Posted by fredr123

I wonder what changed between the writers/producers of the show and Morrissey to go from being a regular cast member to basically an afterthought in a couple months?

they stumbled upon this thread, saw that Moon and a couple others hated the Governor character, and hastily rewrote season 4 to get him out as quickly as possible.

[Hockeyguy15]

Originally Posted by Inglewood Jack

well the writers might think that way, but for the audience that's not how most of us work I think. if there's a villain who did a lot of evil stuff, we want to see them get their comeuppance in the worst way. it's an old trope to see the bad guy get it, but I'd rather have that simple satisfaction than "don't bother with this dude, he's not worth the camera time" treatment.

Igster was slightly mistaken. Kirkman said if the character is/was important to the show then they want the death to be memorable, not just if they were a 'good guy'. He also mention that in the comic he didn't give the audience a satisfying death for the Governor and that for the show he really wanted to give the audience that satisfying death. He said he had Rick get some shots in on the Governor during their fight, then they had Michonne stab him with the sword, and then they had Lilly finish the job. Darryl, Maggie, and Glen being the only other 3 characters who would have been satisfying to finish the job.

He called the Governor's death memorable and I agree with him, which shows that he was an important character.

http://www.amctv.com/talking-dead/vi...r-talking-dead

Edit: Found the quote about the comment on deaths, he is talking about Hershel's death but on the show I remember it was more about deaths in general.
http://www.examiner.com/article/scot...e-walking-dead

Wilson’s character, Hershel, was beheaded by the series’ most dreaded character, the Governor, who also perished. Kirkman explained why Hershel’s life ended so dramatically. “You want the character’s death to be as memorable as the character,” he said. Like Hershel's death, the Governor’s life also ended with a sword.

[the-rasta-masta]

My big problem with the show is why the zombies never seem to completely rot. You'd think there would be a lot less of them walking around now.