Flames stars Sean Monahan and Johnny Gaudreau stick together

[united]

Exact same thing Burke said at the season ticket holder sessions months ago. Nothing new.
The only difference is one is offer sheet eligible (Monahan) and one is not (Gaudreau), so if Gaudreau doesn't sign with the Flames he's sitting at home come the start of the season.

[Cole436]

I think the deals will get done, but I'm not as optimistic about the circumstances as some of you here. The length of time this is taking and the comments being made are not positive signs.

I think there's a very valid reason to worry that this could drag on into training camp.

[Robbob]

I still think that it is in the later stages and mostly done. The Flames are notorious for being tight lipped and are probably aligning to announce when the players come back to Calgary for the season. They probably just sheltering the player so they don't have to do a crap ton of media stuff.

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by Toonage

I guess what I'm getting at is that it took forever to get him signed too. This is just how Treliving operates with the star players.

Hamilton was signed very quickly..

[Phaneufenstein]

Originally Posted by Brodie66

I remember when Burke was asked about the Kessel trade he said he had no problems overpaying in order to get the player(s) he wanted. It seems that same philosophy doesn't apply when it comes to signing RFAs.

I believe he was referring to the price you pay in terms of players/picks going the other way in a trade not actual dollars.

Personally, I don't really worry about the contracts at this stage.

If they are not signed by training camp that's when it'll be a bit concerning.

[Robbob]

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

Hamilton was signed very quickly..

That is because there was a pseudo deadline as the oilers pretty much came out and said they would offer sheet him.

[Textcritic]

Burke's comments could be worrisome if they were made by another member of the Hockey Ops. Dept., but because he is a notorious blowhard, I chalk this up to little more than his typical bluster.

[Southside]

http://m.thn.com/blog/whats-taking-s...eau-contracts/

[polak]

Originally Posted by Textcritic

Burke's comments could be worrisome if they were made by another member of the Hockey Ops. Dept., but because he is a notorious blowhard, I chalk this up to little more than his typical bluster.

This is true. I wish the guy would refrain from speaking.

[Huntingwhale]

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

Is there really any evidence the players agents are asking for gigantic contracts? Or are the Flames low balling them?

We just don't know. What has come out through the press has all seemed rather bland.

I have no more evidence then anyone here does. But all one has to do is look at the numbers of big 'overpaid' contracts that are handed out each summer to realise that the agents are likely demanding top dollar. That's their job. Some GMs give in. Some don't. I get the impression ours won't. And that's a good thing.

I can visualise Treliving pointing at cap friendly hits for Barkov and Mackinnon as comparables. And I can also visualise the agents pointing to Gaudreau and Monahan as being comparable to Toews and Kane since media and fans like to label them as the next 'big duo'. Wouldn't surprise me if the agents are seeking something in that ballpark. Realistically a number a in the middle is (hopefully) what gets signed.

I don't really see the Flames lowballing them. We've had our share of overpaid contracts over the years and we've also had some real fair value contracts (Iggy, Gio, etc). I don't see the Flames ownership low balling any players they deem fair market value.

But I can definitely see the agents trying to high ball (is that a word?) and get the Flames to overpay. That's what they do. Agents don't care about building cup winners. They care about their individual clients getting maximum pay so that they in turn get maximum commission.

Again I have no proof, this is just my opinion. For all we know it could be one of the small items in the contract like public appearances or charity work that is holding things up. Maybe both players hate visiting sick kids at the hospital

Originally Posted by polak

Really? Because if those two players leave, Treliving basically has to restart the rebuild. They're in almost total control of this. Not every player is going to take a discount. If they can't fit them into their plans then expect short term deals.

I don't know what you're trying to say, as I never said anything about either player departing. No one is in total 'control' of the situation. The Flames if anything have a bit more control as both players are RFA. But at the end of the day it takes 2 to tango.

Not every player will take a discount, you're right. But it's our GMs job to at least try and get one. My opinion is that is exactly what BT is trying to get the agents to agree to. The more players taking a discount, the team has a better chance of building a winner.

[MrMastodonFarm]

Originally Posted by polak

This is true. I wish the guy would refrain from speaking.

The guy barely speaks to the media nowadays, and I hardly find any of this..

"We pay players what is fair and not more than what is fair"
we are not going to change the rules for these 2 players or any other players
Predicts they will get signed before the World Cup, but if they don't they don't
He predicts they will sign one of them first then the other when asked if both will be signed at the same time
Not worried about it, both will get signed at numbers that make sense for us or they aren't going to sign

..inflammatory or worrisome.

[Street Pharmacist]

Originally Posted by Huntingwhale

I have no more evidence then anyone here does. But all one has to do is look at the numbers of big 'overpaid' contracts that are handed out each summer to realise that the agents are likely demanding top dollar. That's their job. Some GMs give in. Some don't. I get the impression ours won't. And that's a good thing.

I can visualise Treliving pointing at cap friendly hits for Barkov and Mackinnon as comparables. And I can also visualise the agents pointing to Gaudreau and Monahan as being comparable to Toews and Kane since media and fans like to label them as the next 'big duo'. Wouldn't surprise me if the agents are seeking something in that ballpark. Realistically a number a in the middle is (hopefully) what gets signed.

I don't really see the Flames lowballing them. We've had our share of overpaid contracts over the years and we've also had some real fair value contracts (Iggy, Gio, etc). I don't see the Flames ownership low balling any players they deem fair market value.

But I can definitely see the agents trying to high ball (is that a word?) and get the Flames to overpay. That's what they do.

Again I have no proof, this is just my opinion. For all we know it could be one of the small items in the contract like public appearances or charity work that is holding things up. Maybe both players hate visiting sick kids at the hospital



I don't know what you're trying to say, as I never said anything about either player departing. No one is in total 'control' of the situation. The Flames if anything have a bit more control as both players are RFA. But at the end of the day it takes 2 to tango.

Not every player will take a discount, you're right. But it's our GMs job to at least try and get one. My opinion is that is exactly what BT is trying to get the agents to agree to. The more players taking a discount, the team has a better chance of building a winner.

Toews and Kane aren't really comparables though as they signed UFA deals.

Barkov/McKinnon deals are exactly what Monahan is looking at.

Johnny has better numbers than $7.5M Tarasenko. That's a direct comparable and much more than that puts Johnny above Gio on the pay scale two years into his career. We can pontificate on whether he merits $8M a year, but the ramifications of a 3rd year player being the highest paid player on a team will have some ramifications

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by Street Pharmacist

Toews and Kane aren't really comparables though as they signed UFA deals.

Barkov/McKinnon deals are exactly what Monahan is looking at.

Johnny has better numbers than $7.5M Tarasenko. That's a direct comparable and much more than that puts Johnny above Gio on the pay scale two years into his career. We can pontificate on whether he merits $8M a year, but the ramifications of a 3rd year player being the highest paid player on a team will have some ramifications

Yes, the ramifications will certainly have ... ramifications ...

Seriously though, I think that this is likely the biggest obstacle here: the Giordano ceiling, and how low it is compared to what Gaudreau and Monahan are comparatively worth. If the Flames are insistent on keeping the ceiling intact, then it will almost certainly mean short-term deals, but I don't expect that to actually happen.

These contracts will get done, and when they do Gaudreau at least will become the highest paid player in Flames history. Management knows it, and I think they are doing their utmost to keep that number manageable.

[IgiTang]

Originally Posted by Textcritic

Yes, the ramifications will certainly have ... ramifications ...

... the digs. gotta get those digs in...

Anyway..

I think the main hold-up is the options from both sides..

The Flames want to control where the players play. IE, if Johnny and Monny want to move on down the road, the Flames want some say on how that plays out and to be guaranteed something of value in return.

If it is nothing in return, then the Flames want max term with lowest (reasonable) $$$. Ideally with a limited, if any, NMC/NTC.

Or a deal that allows the Flames to move either player before they hit UFA, but would likely have to pay max $$ for this as well.

the players would likely want maximum security in their destination and to hit UFA ASAP. What player wouldnt?

I think there is no doubt that Johnny and Monny want to sign with the Flames, but I get the feeling they want some control and say as to what happens in the after the next 3 years, and I dont know if the Flames want, nor should allow the players to have any say by locking them up long term.

It makes sense in my head. Dunno if others will agree or even get what im saying. But as I see it, it makes perfect sense and could cause this thing to drag out a bit and perhaps leave one, two or all parties a little butt hurt by the end of it.

That said, a similar situation with Stamkos happened and yzerman stuck to his guns and it worked out for TB. So it could still work out for the Flames if they gave up all control to these two, just to get this next deal done.

Either way, I think some of the love-lust has worn off for me when it comes to Johnny and Monny and snapping back to reality has me looking at this situation as, this is a business. Both sides are their own entity and looking to get maximum benefit...

From a fan perspective, I hope BT protects the club as much as possible by ensuring these two dont potentially walk for nothing short of a kings ransom in 4 years if worst comes to worst.

[GoJetsGo]

Originally Posted by polak

This is true. I wish the guy would refrain from speaking.

Pretty easy to have the same feeling towards you:

Originally Posted by polak

If these two don't want to be here we might as well hit reset.

Originally Posted by polak

Really? Because if those two players leave, Treliving basically has to restart the rebuild.

The fact that's the place you immediately jump to in all of this is ridiculous.

Neither of them are leaving. Yet that's your go-to position, right in line with the same old doom and gloom.

[IgiTang]

Originally Posted by GoJetsGo

Pretty easy to have the same feeling towards you:








The fact that's the place you immediately jump to in all of this is ridiculous.

Neither of them are leaving. Yet that's your go-to position, right in line with the same old doom and gloom.

Both players WILL be gone, eventually. How and when is the holdup.

What the club gets on their departure is the big concern for fans and should be for the GM.

[polak]

Originally Posted by GoJetsGo

Pretty easy to have the same feeling towards you:








The fact that's the place you immediately jump to in all of this is ridiculous.

Neither of them are leaving. Yet that's your go-to position, right in line with the same old doom and gloom.

I was saying that in terms of who holds leverage. Read my posts. I think they will sign short contracts. Been saying that for a bit now. Treliving is probably not willing to go over a certain number for both and obviously that number isn't what the players camps want, or it'd be done. Solution? Short term.

That said, I hope I'm wrong.

[Erick Estrada]

First post in this thread which shows how little I have been concerned with this situation. Given how Treliving has conducted himself since becoming GM of the Calgary Flames I have absolutely zero concerns that both players will sign deals that work the best for both parties.

[Vinny01]

I don't know about the rest of you but pretty much anything 6 years or less should not be over $6M per. I am really hoping for the 8 year term on both and I can live with a number as high as 7 for Monahan and high as 8 for Johnny

My hopes are 7 years $6.5M per for Monahan and 8 years $7.5M for Johnny

[saillias]

It is my personal opinion that they both are holding out to sign in China for the new KHL team and are closet Chinese nationalists who have imperialist designs on Tibet.