[PGT] Stars 2 Flames 1

[Saint Troy]

Time for Treliving to rattle that dressing room by waiving a couple vets, Stajan may be a great room guy but he’s done as an NHL center.

[mrdonkey]

Originally Posted by combustiblefuel

Brent Sutter is not an up grade. Some of the worst years I had to watch outside the young guns era.

Better get ready for round 2! This is pretty much the same thing.

[pepper24]

Bottom 6 forwards still with only 1 goal combined this season.

Useless 3rd line whether Bennett is wing or center.


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[tsquared1967]

GG puts out well-balanced lines by playing his top line with his bottom pairing on defense and his fourth lines with his top pairing on defense. Top line to score goals without defense carrying the puck or jumping into the play in order to keep the puck out of the net. Top pairing defense will carry the play into the offensive zone and score goals whIle the fourth line will cover for the defense jumping into the play to prevent goals against.

[blender]

Originally Posted by tsquared1967

GG puts out well-balanced lines by playing his top line with his bottom pairing on defense and his fourth lines with his top pairing on defense. Top line to score goals without defense carrying the puck or jumping into the play in order to keep the puck out of the net. Top pairing defense will carry the play into the offensive zone and score goals whIle the fourth line will cover for the defense jumping into the play to prevent goals against.

I get the logic, but where are the results?

[activeStick]

Last night's effort is particularly concerning because it comes after the coach was very clearly fed up with the team and blasted them in front of the media before the game.

[ReinhartonD]

While many of us may want to jettison GG ten games in, this probably isn’t going to happen. First, some have listed a bunch of reasons while Treliving shares the blame—if there’s any chance they’re thinking of firing him in the next while, he won’t be allowed to hire a new coach now; new GMs usually get to bring in their own guy.

Also, the best replacements are usually not available during the season as they’re already employed. So likely that means we’d have an interim (Cameron?) until the end of the season probably delivering similar game plans.

Making a quick decision now means we could end up with a different coach, but not a coach who’s best long-term, and they won’t fire whoever comes in next for quite a while (unless it’s an interim), so it needs to be a well thought-out choice.

[Rejean31]

Originally Posted by goodyear

Brouwer on the PP is insane but GG did the same thing last year by rolling out Chiasson all the time. Smfh.

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At least Chiasson would chip in with a goal now and then. Brouwer? Not so much. He is the poster boy for the guy who got his big paycheque and then checked out.

[Flash Walken]

One important thing to remember is this:

Brent Sutter's coaching ability was completely vindicated in hindsight, and I believe GG will be too. Sutter had a putrid roster competing for a playoff spot by playing he way they needed to to have success.

Once the team added a bunch more skill in his second season guys were able to put up points again, but were still just not good enough. He hid a lot of problems with the roster that were exposed to the gruesome sunlight after his departure where the wheels completely fell off.

Gulutzan had last year's team over performing significantly through their strong systems play last year, specifically special teams.

I think if you put this roster in the hands of a lesser coach we would really see the bottom coming up at us fast.

When it became clear by the halfway point that things were not working out with the flames young star Dion phaneuf, the team took the opportunity to trade him for a bunch of warm bodies in an attempt to salvage the season by squeezing out more offense.

This is how things look to be going again this season. I will be surprised if Bennett finishes the season on the flames roster.

[Gaskal]

Originally Posted by ReinhartonD

While many of us may want to jettison GG ten games in, this probably isn’t going to happen. First, some have listed a bunch of reasons while Treliving shares the blame—if there’s any chance they’re thinking of firing him in the next while, he won’t be allowed to hire a new coach now; new GMs usually get to bring in their own guy.

Also, the best replacements are usually not available during the season as they’re already employed. So likely that means we’d have an interim (Cameron?) until the end of the season probably delivering similar game plans.

Making a quick decision now means we could end up with a different coach, but not a coach who’s best long-term, and they won’t fire whoever comes in next for quite a while (unless it’s an interim), so it needs to be a well thought-out choice.

Cameron, not GG, is the one stubbornly throwing Brouwer onto the powerplay. I'd prefer if he kept his single-track mind on the PP and not have it creep into the rest of the team, when we're actually playing pretty decently 5v5. So unless there is a very good candidate immediately available, replacing GG with Cameron would make me want to stab my eyes out watching the games.

Gerard is also similarly to blame, as he is solely responsible for PK duties. Stubbornly throws Stajan and Brouwer out there ad nauseum. Heck, why not use a pair like Bennett and Tkachuk instead? This love affair with Stajan and Brouwer is really trying my patience. I get they are very professional and hard working and good influences..... but get them off the ####ing ice, pronto.

While Glen does do certain things very perplexingly (which has been covered already in this thread so I won't go into it like the special teams) he at least has the team playing respectable at even strength. But I imagine he has a leash the length of this homestand to get things righted or he's done.

[MisterJoji]

Originally Posted by tsquared1967

GG puts out well-balanced lines by playing his top line with his bottom pairing on defense and his fourth lines with his top pairing on defense. Top line to score goals without defense carrying the puck or jumping into the play in order to keep the puck out of the net. Top pairing defense will carry the play into the offensive zone and score goals whIle the fourth line will cover for the defense jumping into the play to prevent goals against.

Or the top line has very little chance at offense because Bartkowksi is constantly stuck in his own zone or makes bad passes.

Top defense pair can’t get anything going offensively because the 4th line can’t make an offensive play to save their lives.

Play your best guys with your best guys and let your worst guys get garbage minutes. You know, not put them out there with 2 minutes to go in a one goal game.

[MisterJoji]

Originally Posted by Gaskal

Cameron, not GG, is the one stubbornly throwing Brouwer onto the powerplay. I'd prefer if he kept his single-track mind on the PP and not have it creep into the rest of the team, when we're actually playing pretty decently 5v5. So unless there is a very good candidate immediately available, replacing GG with Cameron would make me want to stab my eyes out watching the games.



Gerard is also similarly to blame, as he is solely responsible for PK duties. Stubbornly throws Stajan and Brouwer out there ad nauseum. Heck, why not use a pair like Bennett and Tkachuk instead? This love affair with Stajan and Brouwer is really trying my patience. I get they are very professional and hard working and good influences..... but get them off the ####ing ice, pronto.



While Glen does do certain things very perplexingly (which has been covered already in this thread so I won't go into it like the special teams) he at least has the team playing respectable at even strength. But I imagine he has a leash the length of this homestand to get things righted or he's done.

But Glen is the HEAD COACH. If he can see what everyone else can see, that the specialty teams is hot garbage, grow a pair and either tell Gerrard/Cameron to adjust or take it over yourself.

[Geeoff]

Man. Remember the time we beat the Ponda curse? That was a good post-game thread!

#firejobu

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by Flash Walken

One important thing to remember is this:

Brent Sutter's coaching ability was completely vindicated in hindsight, and I believe GG will be too. Sutter had a putrid roster competing for a playoff spot by playing he way they needed to to have success.

Once the team added a bunch more skill in his second season guys were able to put up points again, but were still just not good enough. He hid a lot of problems with the roster that were exposed to the gruesome sunlight after his departure where the wheels completely fell off.

Gulutzan had last year's team over performing significantly through their strong systems play last year, specifically special teams.

I think if you put this roster in the hands of a lesser coach we would really see the bottom coming up at us fast.

When it became clear by the halfway point that things were not working out with the flames young star Dion phaneuf, the team took the opportunity to trade him for a bunch of warm bodies in an attempt to salvage the season by squeezing out more offense.

This is how things look to be going again this season. I will be surprised if Bennett finishes the season on the flames roster.

How so? His unrelenting and inflexible commitment to his system resulted in an awful team and an awful product. And he has never come anywhere near the NHL again.

And Gulutzan didn't get this team overachieving, he simply finally got them going after half a season. And now the same problems are arising that we saw last year.

This is a talented team that is underachieving, not a talentless team that he is squeezing the most out of.

I could not disagree with you more, here.

[jonkaupp]

A lot of the hysteria is pretty overblown for 11 games in but I will admit the fact that Darryl Sutter is just sitting out there is pretty hard to ignore. This is the kind of roster that I feel he could do a lot for. Regardless I don’t see the team letting go of GG right now so hopefully the team just turns it around.

[Gaskal]

Originally Posted by MisterJoji

But Glen is the HEAD COACH. If he can see what everyone else can see, that the specialty teams is hot garbage, grow a pair and either tell Gerrard/Cameron to adjust or take it over yourself.

Pretty sure that's next up on the list, as he's already called the special teams out, over the media as well. He hired them to do special teams and they were able to drag it out of the mud last year, so it would be a last resort. We are coming up pretty quickly on that though.

[GranteedEV]

Originally Posted by Flash Walken

Brent Sutter's coaching ability was completely vindicated in hindsight, and I believe GG will be too. Sutter had a putrid roster

Wrong. Sutter broke players and made them into shadows of their best selves.

Sutter had Jay Bouwmeester in his prime, a 12-15 goal, 40+ point top pair defenseman, who he turned into a 4-5 goal, 30-ish point defenseman.

Sutter had Olli Jokinen not too far removed from his prime. A 35+ goal, 40-ish assist forward, who he turned into a 20 goal, 37 assist forward.

Sutter had Mark Giordano in what would/should have been his prime, a guy who under Hartley was on average a 16G/37A/53P player...and had him as averaging as a 10G/26A/36P player. Gulutzan has Giordano averaging 12G/26A. Hmm. Which Giordano helps this team win games? The one who's part of a putrid roster? Or the one who's considered as a Norris contender combining his elite two-way play with offensive skill and instinct? I get that Giordano has slowed down but the issue extends far beyond that - the system has neutered Giordano and everyone else.

Offense isn't everything, and yes Hartley's systems had some glaring issues defensively, but that doesn't mean we needed to go back to Brent Sutter. There are some damn good teams who balance offensive play and defensive play, and this team has the talent to do it. You need Giordano to be a 50 point defenseman because that makes everyone better - it makes Bennett better, it makes Gaudreau better, it makes Hamilton better, it makes Troy friggin Brouwer better.

What Gulutzan is doing to Bennett is what Sutter did to Backlund, and what previous coaches did to Savard and St. Louis. What he's doing to Gaudreau seems to resemble what Sutter did to Jokinen, too.

[Igottago]

Originally Posted by Flash Walken

One important thing to remember is this:

Brent Sutter's coaching ability was completely vindicated in hindsight, and I believe GG will be too. Sutter had a putrid roster competing for a playoff spot by playing he way they needed to to have success.

Once the team added a bunch more skill in his second season guys were able to put up points again, but were still just not good enough. He hid a lot of problems with the roster that were exposed to the gruesome sunlight after his departure where the wheels completely fell off.

Gulutzan had last year's team over performing significantly through their strong systems play last year, specifically special teams.

I think if you put this roster in the hands of a lesser coach we would really see the bottom coming up at us fast.

When it became clear by the halfway point that things were not working out with the flames young star Dion phaneuf, the team took the opportunity to trade him for a bunch of warm bodies in an attempt to salvage the season by squeezing out more offense.

This is how things look to be going again this season. I will be surprised if Bennett finishes the season on the flames roster.

Lol, no.

If you think the roster just isn't very good (I completely disagree), then surely you must think the GM has done a poor job putting the team together?

[direwolf]

Originally Posted by Geeoff

Man. Remember the time we beat the Ponda curse? That was a good post-game thread!

#firejobu

I think most of us thought that game would be a huge turning point for this group. And for one game there, it looked like it was when they came from behind to beat LA in a spirited, hard fought game. Those California games were exciting, fun, playoff-like atmospheres.

Then came the debacle against Ottawa, and the wheels fell off. Aside from one easy win against a terrible Canucks team and the comeback against Nashville, for the most part the team has been hot garbage, especially on home ice. Terrible special teams have also cost us huge over these last few games. They seem to be reverting back to the same mistakes and lackluster play from early last season, and that's extremely troubling. Don't know if that's a coaching issue, or if it's the players, or a combination of both. But it's obvious that something needs to change.

[Anduril]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

He's better than Stone but not by leaps and bounds. I don't think he's better than Methot and he was fetched for a 2nd round pick.

Missing the context.

27 yo, RH shot, signed for 3.85m until 2020
32 yo, LH shot, signed for 4.9m until 2019