[News Roundup] CSEC/City arena deal UPDATED: Third Party Facilitator

[BoLevi]

Originally Posted by GhostCookie

None of BoLevi's posts are meant to inspire discussion, he's just hammering his point harder and harder while ignoring your statements except to find an inconsistency he can attack. He'd be right at home on the Fox news comments section.

Anyone that argues that there is no competition between jurisdictions on luring investment with lower tax rates obviously missed the Amazon HQ2 mess where dozens of cities tried to out-debase themselves to get noted upstanding employer Amazon to treat some local white collar workers as wonderfully as they treat their blue collar staff. An argument centered around a 100% corporate tax rate not generating investment is itself based around a bad faith premise and is such an absurd comparator that everything written after that was not worth the electrons inconvenienced to type it.

Likewise, if anyone thinks that removing minimum wage would create wealth among the lowest income earners, because benevolent companies would all feel so excited to, for no reason whatsoever, increase the amount spent on wages, should probably look into how the railway tunnels were built, or any other example from that time. Unskilled (and even skilled where possible) jobs would be filled en masse from companies abusing workers visas. This would create a glut of workers, allowing companies to pay less and less, starting at the entry level and then creeping upwards.

As for the arena deal, with 3 hockey teams and a lacrosse team, along with concerts and events, there is no reason why such a venture should be unprofitable, which means there is no reason why the city should put any expenditure up without a plan to recapture the investment, even if it is just from a fair market rent being earned on the lease the flames will sign. Otherwise please count me among the nays for the vote on whether we should all assume the position and let daddy edwards have his way with us financially.

Agreeing to bad arena deals is no good. That's an edmonton thing, let them agree to stupid overpayments on D men and arenas.

The claim by mull was that reducing tax rates does not attract investment, which as you point out is not true.

[#-3]

Originally Posted by Shazam

The only people that think $15/hr, is a "livable wage" are people that have never made $15/hr to live on.

I'll make one correction to this, the people who think that $15/hr is a livable wage, are the people who made $15/hr 35 years ago, and while they claim to be the "smart" business people in the room don't seem to have a strong grasp on what inflation is.

[Mull]

Originally Posted by BoLevi

The claim by mull was that reducing tax rates does not attract investment, which as you point out is not true.

Quote me x2.

Quote my text side by side that is mutually exclusive.

Don’t write my “claims” for me and mis interpret them.

Quote my text then write “this is mutually exclusive with this:” and then quote me again.

[MRCboicgy]

Sooo...any news on the rink?

[BoLevi]

Originally Posted by #-3

I'll make one correction to this, the people who think that $15/hr is a livable wage, are the people who made $15/hr 35 years ago, and while they claim to be the "smart" business people in the room don't seem to have a strong grasp on what inflation is.

Any individual worker has a certain value which they can contribute in any given circumstance. An arbitrary minimum wage doesn't change this value. The cost of living doesn't change this value.

[The Familia]

What are the chances the Flames would slap on a coat of red paint on the 4 exterior elevator towers and power wash the silver aluminum panelling? My God the Saddledome looks dirty, grungy, and old from the outside. All the exterior red panelling is faded, the silver panelling is covered in layers of dirt and dust, and the concrete ring at the top is crumbling with protective netting around it. If this new arena is not going to be built for another decade could they at least keep the current building from looking like a dumpster?

[#-3]

Originally Posted by BoLevi

Any individual worker has a certain value which they can contribute in any given circumstance. An arbitrary minimum wage doesn't change this value. The cost of living doesn't change this value.

If you are running the business that can't afford to pay it's employees a living wage, than the tough truth is society doesn't value your business at a level that should make it viable. And you are only surviving as a business owner by leaching off the vulnerable, and the support that they receive from the welfare state / philanthropy.

[rohara66]

[DJones]

Well this was a disappointing read haha

[getbak]

Originally Posted by MRCboicgy

Sooo...any news on the rink?

The next report to Council from the Event Centre Committee will be in early September. Hopefully, there will be something then.

Prior to summer, Councillor Sharp sounded encouraging that they could have a framework for a deal in place prior to Council's budget planning meetings in November: https://livewirecalgary.com/2022/07/...amework-sharp/

This committee has only met four times, and this is the final meeting until September. More information is expected with work continuing over the summer. In fact, Sharp said she’s optimistic they’ll have more to present in public at that time.

“We are, behind the scenes, moving faster than I’ve ever seen administration move and the pressure is on,” she said.

“To the public, it may seem that we’re not moving quick enough because obviously government never moves fast enough.”

When asked about a specific timeline for a framework, Sharp said it was important that city council knows what projects are on the table prior to November’s four-year budget talks.

“I think in the committee’s mind, we would like a framework in place before budget,” she said.

“I would say we want something obviously concrete for deliberations.”

[BoLevi]

Originally Posted by #-3

If you are running the business that can't afford to pay it's employees a living wage, than the tough truth is society doesn't value your business at a level that should make it viable. And you are only surviving as a business owner by leaching off the vulnerable, and the support that they receive from the welfare state / philanthropy.

If you are a person that can't get someone to willingly pay you a "living wage", then the tough truth is society doesn't value your labor.

[MRCboicgy]

Originally Posted by getbak

The next report to Council from the Event Centre Committee will be in early September. Hopefully, there will be something then.

Prior to summer, Councillor Sharp sounded encouraging that they could have a framework for a deal in place prior to Council's budget planning meetings in November: https://livewirecalgary.com/2022/07/...amework-sharp/

Well, thank ya!

[All In Good Time]

[MarchHare]

We really should stop calling it $15/hr (which sounds like a lot of money to boomers who made $1.90/hr in 1972 and don't understand the concept of inflation) and instead call it what it really is: $15/hr for a full-time worker (40 hours per week, 52 weeks per year) is $31,200 in gross annual income. Does anyone here seriously believe that's enough for a single person to live on after taxes and other deductions?

[BoLevi]

Originally Posted by MarchHare

We really should stop calling it $15/hr (which sounds like a lot of money to boomers who made $1.90/hr in 1972 and don't understand the concept of inflation) and instead call it what it really is: $15/hr for a full-time worker (40 hours per week, 52 weeks per year) is $31,200 in gross annual income. Does anyone here seriously believe that's enough for a single person to live on after taxes and other deductions?

That's the wrong question. The better question is: what is it about you such that nobody is willing to pay you more than $31k?

[Monahammer]

Originally Posted by BoLevi

That's the wrong question. The better question is: what is it about you such that nobody is willing to pay you more than $31k?

You keep making it a personal issue. Sure, let's reduce it to a personal issue. Do you pay people more than $15 an hour to make coffee? Do you ever buy coffee and expect it to cost less than $10/ cup?

You can't reduce this issue to a value of an individual's labor when there are hard costs on goods people can't afford to exceed. There's not some independent labor value chart where people are fairly slotted based on their actual labor contribution. Hell, if that were the case how could you or I make money and ramble inanely in these threads for a solid portion of our day?

[Bonded]

Originally Posted by Monahammer

You keep making it a personal issue. Sure, let's reduce it to a personal issue. Do you pay people more than $15 an hour to make coffee? Do you ever buy coffee and expect it to cost less than $10/ cup?

You can't reduce this issue to a value of an individual's labor when there are hard costs on goods people can't afford to exceed. There's not some independent labor value chart where people are fairly slotted based on their actual labor contribution. Hell, if that were the case how could you or I make money and ramble inanely in these threads for a solid portion of our day?

There is no point in arguing with someone who has reduced people solely to their value of economic output especially without even addressing the context of a person’s upbringing and inherent economic advantages/disadvantages. BoLevi reminds me of the undergrads who read atlas shrugged and thought they had the world figured out.

[Monahammer]

It's worse, it's like he read three single sentences from Das Kapital and formed an entire ####ing ideology on it.

[NegativeSpace]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

I always find it funny when there’s an argument that you shouldn’t be able to live off a minimum wage (because it’s for teenagers, or whatever) which begs the question why you’d have a minimum wage at all and why jobs that teenagers can’t hold start at minimum wage.

Because all teenagers have the the love and support of friends and families. Yes, literally all of them. There are no teenagers who are required to pay for their own cost of living, ever at any time. That doesn't happen in Canada. [Do I need green text?]

[White Out 403]

This thread is a fascinating look into the window of people who've been gaslit by the AB conservatives and corporations their whole lives. It's like watching stockholm syndrome unfold in real time

I'm sure I've written this before on CP and maybe this thread but I feel like repeating myself: under no circumstances will the NHL allow any owner to move the Flames away from Calgary. They're in a profitable and dedicated market. Full stop. If you really believe this team is on the brink of moving over not getting a fancy new arena you are engaged in pure mental fantasy.