Potential Gaudreau trades: Rest of Eastern Conference Post#253

[Vinny01]

Originally Posted by Monahammer

Too much of a robbery for us. Even with our 1st going back I think it's a stretch, but I love it anyways.

You could be right but the way I see things.

Gaudreau >> Reinhart and the fact Johnny comes in with 2 years and $10M cash owed would be a big factor for the Sabres. They also sell the fanbase on improving their roster with a 27 year old one year removed from 99pts. This also should appease Eichel short term and potentially be the beginnings of a dangerous combo up front for them.

Flames would be pretty much forced to pay Reinhart on a long term deal.

Kylington is younger and cheaper than Montour who needs to be qualified at over $3M and likely wants a long term deal.

Buffalo is saving huge cash the Flames are adding some critical right shots they need in the lineup.

I do feel like my initial offer favored the Flames but adding 19 makes it less enticing for me. If Buffalo adds their second maybe the Flames add another late pick then including 19 makes sense for me.

[ComixZone]

Originally Posted by Monahammer

Too much of a robbery for us. Even with our 1st going back I think it's a stretch, but I love it anyways.

I don't think so.

Reinhart is a leech, Montour is a 4th/5th defenceman.

The 8th OA pick is the best piece there.

[Vinny01]

Originally Posted by ComixZone

I don't think so.

Reinhart is a leech, Montour is a 4th/5th defenceman.

The 8th OA pick is the best piece there.

I agree the 8th pick is the best piece but I think adding 2 right shot players to play in the top 6 and potentially top 4 help the team now.

This deal is very much in line with the Hamilton trade and the type of move Treliving has been known to make (acquiring RFA players).

[GranteedEV]

Originally Posted by ComixZone

I don't think so.

Reinhart is a leech, Montour is a 4th/5th defenceman.

The 8th OA pick is the best piece there.

I haven't really watched him as a Sabre, but the guy who used to play for the Ducks was a top pairing defenseman, and I actually thought he was better than Fowler in those years.

[The Original FFIV]

Originally Posted by Monahammer

Exactly the way I see it. Fills a primary need (top 4 RHD) and lets us swing for the fences on a top 10 pick. The rest of the trades are lacking a real home run pick.

Philadelphia is a low first, Frost (who is good but no shot at being Johnny good) and Ghost is largely a cap dump right now.

Georgiev is alright and on the upswing, Buchenvich is one of those guys that we hear will be good every year, and a mid first. Still no hope of a player as good as johnny.

Merzlinkins is interesting because he's a very legit tender prospect (moreso than Georgiev IMO.) But i've never liked Boone Jenner (think he's best in bottom 6 role) and the pick is again mid round. As an aside, because of the wild variation in 13-70 of this draft i would say it's potentially one of the worst ever to have mid 1st round picks in. You might be able to get similar or better value players with two 2nds.

Premise behind all of these deals is to get 2 players + 1st rounder back. Also went in with idea that we have to take money back given the flat cap. Tried to find best fit.

Philly - Ghost isn't that far removed from some good seasons. Can this be re-captured? Believe so. Lots of changes in Philly and could be a victim of the upheaval. AV is a coach that can bury players if he doesn't like them and this could be the case here. Went back and forth between Frost/Farabee but believe Frost is better fit as he is a C and is Canadian and may stay longer than Farabee

NYR - have young G which would be the best piece coming back. Could stabilize us for years instead of a stop gap. While Buchnevich won't replace Johnny, he will provide some of the offence we lose in this trade.

CLB - went with Elvis over Joonas as they are interchangeable but the salary for Elvis is higher which helps CLB sign Dubois. Could go with either goalie really. For Jenner, he wears a letter and plays an honest game. Didn't have the best playoff but believe his game would translate better in the playoffs if used properly. Seems like a player who will do anything to help the team win, maybe just a personal bias.

Originally Posted by ComixZone

The only one that proposes quality for quality is NJD. Everything else is just quantity for quality.

Big no to everything but the NJD trade, but even then it should just be 7th + 18th, no Severson/Woods.

Took Severson back as we need D and probably need to take salary back. Garrioch said they might want to move Butcher instead and really, I'm ok with either given our hole on D. Woods plays a tough game which we need more of and comes at a decent hit.

Getting a first back in all deals proposed is not inconsequential given that there are teams looking to dump salary. Could use the first to get a good player or use it to pick in a deep draft. Creates flexibility.

[Roof-Daddy]

Originally Posted by GranteedEV

I haven't really watched him as a Sabre, but the guy who used to play for the Ducks was a top pairing defenseman, and I actually thought he was better than Fowler in those years.

He was misused in Buffalo, and there is rumblings that he may not even get qualified by the Sabres due to monetary reasons.

I would certainly be fine buying low on him if it's possible.

[Enoch Root]

The problem with trying to get 2 players back (plus a pick) is the expansion draft.

For example (using one of the more talked about suggestions), if you trade Gaudreau for DeBrusk + Kase + 1st is that (along with the fact that you are trading an 80-90 point guy for 2 40-point guys) is that you are going to lose one of them in the expansion draft.

So you make that trade, and then you lose Kase to Seattle. In that scenario, you have turned Gaudreau, an elite winger, for DeBrusk, a decent, middle-6 winger who can put up 40 points, and a late 1st.

That is brutal asset management.

Instead of targeting 2 players, I think trade proposals should be targeting 1 (higher-rated) player and 1 prospect and a pick.

The expansion draft is just one year away and can't be ignored.

Also, Ghost is not a good defenseman and should not be the centerpiece of any Gaudreau trade proposal.

[SportsJunky]

My thoughts as well^

A player, prospect and a pick is what I would like to see for Gaudreau.

[The Original FFIV]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

The problem with trying to get 2 players back (plus a pick) is the expansion draft.

For example (using one of the more talked about suggestions), if you trade Gaudreau for DeBrusk + Kase + 1st is that (along with the fact that you are trading an 80-90 point guy for 2 40-point guys) is that you are going to lose one of them in the expansion draft.

So you make that trade, and then you lose Kase to Seattle. In that scenario, you have turned Gaudreau, an elite winger, for DeBrusk, a decent, middle-6 winger who can put up 40 points, and a late 1st.

That is brutal asset management.

Instead of targeting 2 players, I think trade proposals should be targeting 1 (higher-rated) player and 1 prospect and a pick.

The expansion draft is just one year away and can't be ignored.

Also, Ghost is not a good defenseman and should not be the centerpiece of any Gaudreau trade proposal.

Depends on what 2 players you get back. If you get a G, inconsequential. We will need to protect 1 regardless.

If you get a D, you can protect the d you acquire and gamble by exposing Gio (or look at a trade Involving him). We will lose a decent player regardless. I just can’t see a team giving up a solitary, high end piece for Gaudreau Which will in itself justify a trade (ie What High end assets do these Acquiring teams have that they Would Willingly give up to get Johnny). It will have to be a package with Multiple pieces that hopefully develop into an asset(s) that push us to the next level.

[Vinny01]

In the trade thread I was mentioning getting Hall’s rights along with Kuemper would allow the Flames to make a move with Johnny. If the Flames acquired Hall+Kuemper and then trade Johnny to philly for Gostisbhere, Frost, 1st it gets them 2 expansion exempt assets and a Dman they would expose. Flames forward group would be down Gaudreau but add Hall+Frost and they would go from Talbot to Kuemper.

That team is better just not sure how much?

[Yoho]

We got Jonny with a 4th round pick. Get the highest first round magic beans pick and hope for the best.

Every other roster player trade we lose out on.

[Enoch Root]

Gostisbehere is a 5/6 D-man. He is terrible defensively. He is also an LD.

Absolutely not the guy to be building a Gaudreau trade around.

You are right though, the Flames would expose him

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

The problem with trying to get 2 players back (plus a pick) is the expansion draft.

For example (using one of the more talked about suggestions), if you trade Gaudreau for DeBrusk + Kase + 1st is that (along with the fact that you are trading an 80-90 point guy for 2 40-point guys) is that you are going to lose one of them in the expansion draft.

So you make that trade, and then you lose Kase to Seattle. In that scenario, you have turned Gaudreau, an elite winger, for DeBrusk, a decent, middle-6 winger who can put up 40 points, and a late 1st.

That is brutal asset management.

Instead of targeting 2 players, I think trade proposals should be targeting 1 (higher-rated) player and 1 prospect and a pick.

The expansion draft is just one year away and can't be ignored.

Also, Ghost is not a good defenseman and should not be the centerpiece of any Gaudreau trade proposal.

It works if one of the players is a defenceman. I doubt Gio gets protected, so the 3 protected D will be Hanifin, Anderson, and whoever is signed or traded for to fill the top 4 RD position.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

It works if one of the players is a defenceman. I doubt Gio gets protected, so the 3 protected D will be Hanifin, Anderson, and whoever is signed or traded for to fill the top 4 RD position.

They will need to add probably 2 or 3 defensemen, regardless. And then likely expose some good players (including, possibly, Gio)

So no, adding one on D isn't exempt from the problem.

Goalie isn't a problem though

[CliffFletcher]

I expect they’ll add one quality D and one veteran journeyman UFA who they’ll be happy enough to expose. The point is there’s a third protected defenceman slot available.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

I expect they’ll add one quality D and one veteran journeyman UFA who they’ll be happy enough to expose. The point is there’s a third protected defenceman slot available.

Right now. But here won't be when they fill out the roster.

They have 4 UFA defensemen, and they are going to replace at least a couple of them.

[Vinny01]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

Gostisbehere is a 5/6 D-man. He is terrible defensively. He is also an LD.

Absolutely not the guy to be building a Gaudreau trade around.

You are right though, the Flames would expose him

Frost and the 1st are the key assets. Ghost is in for cap purposes

[ForeverFlameFan]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

Gostisbehere is a 5/6 D-man. He is terrible defensively. He is also an LD.

Absolutely not the guy to be building a Gaudreau trade around.

You are right though, the Flames would expose him

He plays primarily RD.

I feel like he had an off year. At one point he was known as one of the highly touted OFD's in the league. I think Provorov took away a lot of those minutes from Ghost, and he didn't know how to deal with it.

I think if acquired, he could be flipped. We don't have to have him. And I disagree, it would be Giordano exposed over Ghost if it ever came that route.

[Hot_Flatus]

Originally Posted by Crown Royal

Except I don't think it's settling for less. I am very high on both DeBrusk and Kase, especially DeBrusk.

I also am not interested in trading Gaudreau until after free agency in case we cannot sign Hall, which is why I included a 2021 pick and not 2020 (but I guess they don't have a 2020 anyway)

And you're that convinced that an average 2nd line and 3rd line player plus 65 games of Taylor Hall is enough to warrant such a move? Unless the Flames are getting something tangible (like a top line player back) I suspect signing Hall would be much more of a lateral move for Gaudreau than many people think.

Hall has played north of 75 games only 3 times in 10 seasons. Hall has also only managed to be at or above a PPG player 4 times in 10 seasons. I just don't get the fanbase desire to shell out $9M a year for this oft injured and regularly mediocre production.

[Crown Royal]

Originally Posted by GranteedEV

I haven't really watched him as a Sabre, but the guy who used to play for the Ducks was a top pairing defenseman, and I actually thought he was better than Fowler in those years.

I haven't watched Buffalo much, but reading comments from Sabres fans about him is extremely negative, they don't see him as a top 4 defenseman and think he's garbage.