[News] Hurricanes officially match Aho offer sheet (5 years x $8.454 million)

[transplant99]

Originally Posted by Sylvanfan

It basically made news and pretty much helped set the RFA market. But did nothing for his team.

Back when the Flyers gave Webber that 14 year contract with a huge chunk paid up front to try and force the Predators to take the compensation, not only did they match...but they also traded him after paying a huge amount of the front loaded dollars. Yesterday the Predators signed one of the more coveted free agents. If anything matching that offer sheet galvanized the franchise and ultimately made it more valuable.

Much ado about nothing. If I'm Carolina I take all 7 days to match because I can, and they can trade Aho for a monster return in 3 years too if they like.

Im not convinced it even did this unless current guys are all wanting half of the deal paid in the first year....which is certainly possible but really difficult for many markets to make happen

I mean does this have any effect on the Marner deal? Im not sure it does. He wants to be paid as the leading scorer of that team the last 2 years. That will be North of 10 and maybe 11...whether he ends up getting it in TO or not is another story.

[Scroopy Noopers]

Originally Posted by transplant99

They cant. Player cannot be traded for a year now.

Could they not execute a trade right now and send additional compensation with an understanding they won’t match? That’s how I understood that post. I don’t really see that scenario working though.

Should have been something you figured out prior to the offer sheet though, maybe trade for the RFA then sign him yourself, while giving up more compensation than obligated.

[transplant99]

Originally Posted by Scroopy Noopers

Could they not execute a trade right now and send additional compensation with an understanding they won’t match? That’s how I understood that post. I don’t really see that scenario working though.

Should have been something you figured out prior to the offer sheet though, maybe trade for the RFA then sign him yourself, while giving up more compensation than obligated.

I don't think so. That player essentially signed his next NHL contract yesterday, now the teams wait until one decides which of two teams get that contract and player.

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by The Yen Man

So at the end of the day, Habs get nothing while missing out on signing any UFAs. What a dumb offer. If Habs were serious about getting Aho, they should have just ponied up another couple of million and that 1st round pick. They've been looking for a top line centre since forever it seems. Who was their last good one? Saku Koivu?

18-year-old Jesper Kotkaniemi looks pretty good.

[GreenLantern2814]

Originally Posted by topfiverecords

I agree. I don't think Montreal got creative enough here. All they've done is force a billionaire to pay out 11.3 of 42.27 million up front.

If you're gonna swing, swing for the fences.

Montreal came for the king, and they missed.

Sebastian Aho is a #1C. Or at least that's what he looks like. Those are the hardest things in the sport to acquire. The player is 21. Give him 7/$70M with all the bonus structures you did before, or don't waste our time.

Tom Dundon just gave the AAF I don't know how many millions only to shutter the league a week later. He may not want to pay Aho all that money in cash, but it's a cap league with a salary floor - if he's going to have to spend money anyway, he's going to spend it on a player who puts asses in seats and sells jerseys instead of three scrubs.

I truly think the only way offer sheets work is if you price the player out of the team's cap. You can't just throw some cash around and hope to intimidate a small market because they're a small irrelevant dustheap in the universe of hockey. The cost of not matching is every good young player you ever get.

[PlayfulGenius]

Originally Posted by GreenLantern2814

Montreal came for the king, and they missed.

Sebastian Aho is a #1C. Or at least that's what he looks like. Those are the hardest things in the sport to acquire. The player is 21. Give him 7/$70M with all the bonus structures you did before, or don't waste our time.

Tom Dundon just gave the AAF I don't know how many millions only to shutter the league a week later. He may not want to pay Aho all that money in cash, but it's a cap league with a salary floor - if he's going to have to spend money anyway, he's going to spend it on a player who puts asses in seats and sells jerseys instead of three scrubs.

I truly think the only way offer sheets work is if you price the player out of the team's cap. You can't just throw some cash around and hope to intimidate a small market because they're a small irrelevant dustheap in the universe of hockey. The cost of not matching is every good young player you ever get.

In general, I think everyone will agree this is accurate.

In this case, I think MTL was likely acting on some intel that suggested the CAR owner might not have the capital on hand to pay the bonus, up front... if so, they DID, in fact, swing for the fences as they attempted to steal a primary talent on a reasonable contract... a huge coup, if they ended up being lucky enough for it to work.

I don't get the perspective that MTL made a mistake here. They took a stab at a player, with no risk whatsoever. There is obvious risk involved when signing a player to an inflated contract. Sure, they could have offered an AAV of $11M over that same term, but would that have been a 'win'?? Obviously MTL doesn't think so. At the very least, there would be significant risk involved.

To suggest they made a mistake implies that MTL sees the player as worth more than what they offered... or that were willing to acquire the player "at all costs", which I feel is obviously false. They took a free spin, and it looks like they won't win the jackpot, but they likely weren't expecting to do so.

[The Yen Man]

Originally Posted by PlayfulGenius

In general, I think everyone will agree this is accurate.

In this case, I think MTL was likely acting on some intel that suggested the CAR owner might not have the capital on hand to pay the bonus, up front... if so, they DID, in fact, swing for the fences as they attempted to steal a primary talent on a reasonable contract... a huge coup, if they ended up being lucky enough for it to work.

I don't get the perspective that MTL made a mistake here. They took a stab at a player, with no risk whatsoever. There is obvious risk involved when signing a player to an inflated contract. Sure, they could have offered an AAV of $11M over that same term, but would that have been a 'win'?? Obviously MTL doesn't think so. At the very least, there would be significant risk involved.

To suggest they made a mistake implies that MTL sees the player as worth more than what they offered... or that were willing to acquire the player "at all costs", which I feel is obviously false. They took a free spin, and it looks like they won't win the jackpot, but they likely weren't expecting to do so.

Disagree with the bolded statement. Their risk is the opportunity cost of the deal. They'll now end up with nothing, and lost big opportunities on the UFA market. Maybe Duchene was not a realistic option, maybe he was. Guess we'll never know. Not only that, but you've now alienated some of the GMs in the league with nothing to show for it.

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by The Yen Man

Disagree with the bolded statement. Their risk is the opportunity cost of the deal. They'll now end up with nothing, and lost big opportunities on the UFA market. Maybe Duchene was not a realistic option, maybe he was. Guess we'll never know. Not only that, but you've now alienated some of the GMs in the league with nothing to show for it.

I don't know about this in this situation. It seems clear that the reason Montreal's offer sheet was so much lower than expected is because they are nervous about overspending for a player. If this helps to set the RFA market for other NHL GMs I cannot see that they would be overly frustrated by it.

[sureLoss]

Canes are pissed at Aho's agent. Will be interesting to see if this becomes an issue next time Aho or another client's contract comes up with the Canes.

Ken Campbell @THNKenCampbell
Hurricanes' owner Tom Dundon and GM Don Waddell throwing some serious shade at Sebastien Aho's agent, Gerry Johannson. Waddell: "The agent sold a bill of goods." Dundon: "The team got manipulated into believing some things that might not have been true."

Ken Campbell @THNKenCampbell
Hurricanes owner Tom Dundon on Sebastien Aho's agent Gerry Johannson and whether his response to the offer sheet will make things complicated in dealings with Johannson: "I could care less about Sebastien's agent and things being complicated. It doesn't matter at all."

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by PlayfulGenius

In general, I think everyone will agree this is accurate.

In this case, I think MTL was likely acting on some intel that suggested the CAR owner might not have the capital on hand to pay the bonus, up front... if so, they DID, in fact, swing for the fences as they attempted to steal a primary talent on a reasonable contract... a huge coup, if they ended up being lucky enough for it to work.

I don't get the perspective that MTL made a mistake here. They took a stab at a player, with no risk whatsoever. There is obvious risk involved when signing a player to an inflated contract. Sure, they could have offered an AAV of $11M over that same term, but would that have been a 'win'?? Obviously MTL doesn't think so. At the very least, there would be significant risk involved.

To suggest they made a mistake implies that MTL sees the player as worth more than what they offered... or that were willing to acquire the player "at all costs", which I feel is obviously false. They took a free spin, and it looks like they won't win the jackpot, but they likely weren't expecting to do so.

I suppose it's a mistake if they really wanted the player as it's very possible if they slightly raise their offer they get the player they covet. As said above it's really hard to get #1 centers and it seems to me the Habs got a little cute in thinking they could front-load a bunch of cash and keep their offer low enough that they only had to give up a 1st, 2nd, and 3rd round pick. If they pulled it off it would have been the steal of the year but to me it's classic kijiji buyer mentality of low-balling when a sensible offer will get what you covet. At the very least they should have offered $9 million a season as the two 1st round picks may have been enough to sway Dundon into taking the picks but it seems to me like the classic buyer that really wants something but is just too cheap to pay a fair price for it.

[topfiverecords]

Originally Posted by PlayfulGenius

In general, I think everyone will agree this is accurate.

In this case, I think MTL was likely acting on some intel that suggested the CAR owner might not have the capital on hand to pay the bonus, up front... if so, they DID, in fact, swing for the fences as they attempted to steal a primary talent on a reasonable contract... a huge coup, if they ended up being lucky enough for it to work.

I don't get the perspective that MTL made a mistake here. They took a stab at a player, with no risk whatsoever. There is obvious risk involved when signing a player to an inflated contract. Sure, they could have offered an AAV of $11M over that same term, but would that have been a 'win'?? Obviously MTL doesn't think so. At the very least, there would be significant risk involved.

To suggest they made a mistake implies that MTL sees the player as worth more than what they offered... or that were willing to acquire the player "at all costs", which I feel is obviously false. They took a free spin, and it looks like they won't win the jackpot, but they likely weren't expecting to do so.

No one yet suggested that Montreal made a mistake here.

Perhaps having 8.454 million of your projected cap, a contract, a roster position, and 3 of your next top draft picks held in limbo for 7 days at the very opening of free agency has potential to be restrictive to what else Montreal can achieve.

[Scroopy Noopers]

Originally Posted by transplant99

I don't think so. That player essentially signed his next NHL contract yesterday, now the teams wait until one decides which of two teams get that contract and player.

Yes....I understand that. The poster asked if there was a way to send additional compensation so they don’t match. Not about trading for Aho.

[PlayfulGenius]

Originally Posted by The Yen Man

Disagree with the bolded statement. Their risk is the opportunity cost of the deal. They'll now end up with nothing, and lost big opportunities on the UFA market. Maybe Duchene was not a realistic option, maybe he was. Guess we'll never know. Not only that, but you've now alienated some of the GMs in the league with nothing to show for it.

maybe, but I doubt it... reports suggest Duchene had already made his choice by the time this offer sheet came out.

I don't agree there alienation amongst GMs, I just don't see it, and I don't see any downside to what MTL did here.

[PlayfulGenius]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

I suppose it's a mistake if they really wanted the player as it's very possible if they slightly raise their offer they get the player they covet. As said above it's really hard to get #1 centers and it seems to me the Habs got a little cute in thinking they could front-load a bunch of cash and keep their offer low enough that they only had to give up a 1st, 2nd, and 3rd round pick. If they pulled it off it would have been the steal of the year but to me it's classic kijiji buyer mentality of low-balling when a sensible offer will get what you covet. At the very least they should have offered $9 million a season as the two 1st round picks may have been enough to sway Dundon into taking the picks but it seems to me like the classic buyer that really wants something but is just too cheap to pay a fair price for it.

this could very well be... perhaps they got too greedy and could've made a real coup here with a bit more reasonable offer.

[Huntingwhale]

Late to the party. But reading Ricardow quote himself in anger just made my day lol.

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by transplant99

They cant. Player cannot be traded for a year now.

That is not what I'm saying. Offer Carolina another pick or player so they don't match.

[shadowlord]

If I'm Brayden Point, how would I feel about my agent right now?

MTL was willing to give me (Point) an offer-sheet for an $8.4million contract, but my agent said -- give it to my other client (Aho) instead because CAR is more likely to match.

Feels a bit like the agent was working in his own interest since both are his clients, and possibly a conflict of interest.

If I was Point, I better get more than 8.4m x 5y.

[transplant99]

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

That is not what I'm saying. Offer Carolina another pick or player so they don't match.

I guess thats possible, but there is nothing they could offer that would sway things that way IMO....on top of which i doubt Waddell is taking a lot of calls from Bergevin at the moment.

Besides think its pretty clear Carolina is intent and content with keeping the player at that price even if they don't like bonus structure attached.

It was a dumb offer.

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by transplant99

I guess thats possible, but there is nothing they could offer that would sway things that way IMO....on top of which i doubt Waddell is taking a lot of calls from Bergevin at the moment.

Besides think its pretty clear Carolina is intent and content with keeping the player at that price even if they don't like bonus structure attached.

It was a dumb offer.

How do you know there was nothing Montreal could have offered? Of course there was, just a question of whether they could have agreed on something.

[GreenLantern2814]

Originally Posted by shadowlord

If I'm Brayden Point, how would I feel about my agent right now?

MTL was willing to give me (Point) an offer-sheet for an $8.4million contract, but my agent said -- give it to my other client (Aho) instead because CAR is more likely to match.

Feels a bit like the agent was working in his own interest since both are his clients, and possibly a conflict of interest.

If I was Point, I better get more than 8.4m x 5y.

Point can sign an offer sheet with the Habs this very second if he really wants to.