[Trade] Iginla to the Pens for Agostino, Hanowski, 2013 1st

[Ped]

Originally Posted by CaramonLS

See this is exactly the point!

Boston nor Pittsburgh should have had any idea that it was a two team race.

In fact, with Shero presumably not knowing that it was only a one-team race, all he really had to do was beat the Boston offer which was being widely reported, as having a conditional pick (whether that is true, that is what was reported).

Whether you believe Iginla moving on is good for the franchise or not, has nothing to do with whether the return is enough (not directed at you in particular, just a general sentiment I'm seeing) unless you believe Iginla being gone is worth any price.

A price which no matter which way you slice it, is not not what the Flames wanted.

[BloodFetish]

Originally Posted by burnitdown

Incorrect. If Iginla and Feaster agree to a list of teams he'll accept a trade to and submit that signed list to the NHLPA, then that officially modifies his NTC and allows the GM to trade him to any of those teams. No "officially waiving" once the deal is reached, the formality was already taken care of.

I'd like to see your source on this, if you don't mind. The fact that this is a new angle on this trade after umpteen million pages has me questioning this.

[Captain_Obvious]

Originally Posted by burnitdown

I was just saying he COULD have forced the issue and got a list of teams Iginla would actually accept a trade to (even if it's just one or two teams).

I understood what you were saying all along. I just think you're incorrect.

A no movement clause is in place for this very reason. So you are in no way "forced" to do anything, and retain final say in where you will be moved if you are so inclined.

So no, Feaster could not have forced Iginla to do anything.

Originally Posted by burnitdown

AT LEAST spoken to him just before he agreed to the deal with Boston and told them they won the sweepstakes.

By all accounts, he did. I don't see how you're suggesting otherwise when it's come out we preferred the Boston offer.

Iginla obviously was told this but chose Pittsburgh.

[JiriHrdina]

Originally Posted by Ped

In fact, with Shero presumably not knowing that it was only a one-team race, all he really had to do was beat the Boston offer which was being widely reported, as having a conditional pick (whether that is true, that is what was reported).

Whether you believe Iginla moving on is good for the franchise or not, has nothing to do with whether the return is enough (not directed at you in particular, just a general sentiment I'm seeing) unless you believe Iginla being gone is worth any price.

A price which no matter which way you slice it, is not not what the Flames wanted.

OK so play this out.
Feaster negotiating with Pitt says we have a great offer for Iginla, this is it, you have to beat it.

Pens could have said "OK we are bowing out, wish Iginla the best of luck for us in Boston"

Now Jay has a deal in place with a team Iginla won't officially waive to go to.

There was risk associated no matter how this one was played by Feaster. The risk being he ends up with no deal being one of them.

I also think it is clear that any "list" was not a list that was official enough that Iggy was willing to have it submitted to officially modify the nature of his NMC. I appears to have been a suggested list but he still wanted final say.

[#-3]

What is the best case with the trade in 3 to 5 years we will have equivalent of

Eric Nystrom
(sounds like Honowski might have been "the guy" in high school, but in College it started looking he would be a depth player in his pro career).

David Moss
(Maybe Agostino could come out of nowhere and provide some secondary scoring)

Backlund (A well used draft pick in the mid 20's if were lucky).

Is that still a loss on this trade?

Its just as likely we end up with nothing,

or most likely of all one out of three becomes becomes a third liner and we never here from the other two again.

I don't like to slam trades but early on. But now that I've had time to learn about these players. The only way this trade works out for us at all, is if we manage to pull a Ryan O'Reilly out of the draft who is NHL ready and much better than anyone thinks.

Not a good start Feaster, you've made 3 trades. 2 Involved our best players of the past decade. And you walked away with the rest of the league laughing at you after both of them.

Unfortunately it sounds like odds are good he will be the guy moving Bouw, Cammi, and Kipper(maybe).

Edit: Trades like Modin don't even count, nothing piece for nothing piece.

[Captain_Obvious]

Originally Posted by CaramonLS

Answer the question please. Does this process look OK to you?

How it looked is irrelevant to anyone, because Iginla had a NMC clause and ultimately held final say on where he ended up.

I think that's exactly what happened.

Originally Posted by CaramonLS

I'd be happy to inform you exactly how Feaster messed up.

I'm still waiting.

[BloodFetish]

Originally Posted by CaramonLS

I am none too surprised to have to be typing this to you, as it seems that certain things are somewhat difficult for you to understand.

I am balking at the process because of the return we got.

1) Iginla is consulted about a list of teams he might be willing to go to
2) Meehan submits the list to Feaster and leaks some information to the press
3) Feaster assembles 2 mediocre offers from the major players - Pitts and Boston, lets Iginla pick which one he would prefer
4) Feaster leads Boston on and tells Pitts that "Iginla really wants to be a Penguin"
5) Feaster accepts a trade with the Pens.

If you honestly don't see anything wrong with this process - I'd be happy to inform you exactly how Feaster messed up.

Very definitely something wrong with this process.

In #3 Feaster doesn't "let" Iginla pick which deal he prefers. It's Iginlas right to do so because of his NMC.

I think you made #4 up altogether.

[GreenLantern]

Originally Posted by Phanuthier

i thought this wasn't a deep draft, and thin after the top 4? or am i mistaken?

From what Button and Mackenzie have been saying the past few days on TSN, this is a deep draft and are drawing comparisons to 2003 and Perry.

[Phanuthier]

Originally Posted by GreenLantern

From what Button and Mackenzie have been saying the past few days on TSN, this is a deep draft and are drawing comparisons to 2003 and Perry.

out of thanks.... but thanks. awesome.

[BloodFetish]

Originally Posted by TSXCman

Considering Bennett was sent down to make room for Iggy.... Doesn't that scream for a potential movie that wasn't pushed for?

No.

[burnitdown]

Originally Posted by BloodFetish

I'd like to see your source on this, if you don't mind. The fact that this is a new angle on this trade after umpteen million pages has me questioning this.

They had Glenn Healy on Primetime Sports discussing this. Granted, he's one of the worst commentators out there and his views are usually way off base...but he did work with the NHLPA so I would assume he has some idea of NHL processes and isn't just making stuff up. He said that this is the common process that is followed when a team tries to trade a player with a NTC/NMC - they get a list of teams he'll accept, submit it to the NHLPA, then the team is able to trade him to any of those teams. That prevents these type of issues where teams work to trade a player only for the player to change his mind last second.

He gave some recent examples like Komisarek (who had a NMC) - where he signed a form saying he'll accept a demotion to the AHL, the Leafs submit it to the NHLPA, then they're able to do it. While apparently it's very common, the key is that both parties need to sign the form then submit it to the league.

So we'd only be speculating if Iginla was refusing to do this or if Feaster just didn't bother and figured Iginla's word was good enough...

[Ped]

Originally Posted by JiriHrdina

OK so play this out.
Feaster negotiating with Pitt says we have a great offer for Iginla, this is it, you have to beat it.

Pens could have said "OK we are bowing out, wish Iginla the best of luck for us in Boston"

Now Jay has a deal in place with a team Iginla won't officially waive to go to.

There was risk associated no matter how this one was played by Feaster. The risk being he ends up with no deal being one of them.

I also think it is clear that any "list" was not a list that was official enough that Iggy was willing to have it submitted to officially modify the nature of his NMC. I appears to have been a suggested list but he still wanted final say.

Honestly I don't know. It's all conjecture. But I would think if Pit agreed to give up someone who is widely considered one of their top prospects in Joe Morrow to get a winger who wasn't as good as Iginla in his prime, isn't as good as Iginla now, and captained his team literally out of the playoffs the last two seasons iirc, then I have to believe they would have been willing to pony up a better prospect then the two they did.

I think Feaster got out bluffed. No, I can't prove it, but I think it all the same.

[Quincy Egg]

I still can't believe the return includes two college kids that can choose to be UFA's at the end of the season. And the first round pick is no guarantee either.
Putrid.

[SHOGUN]

I'd rather have Joe Morrow + 1st...

[Quincy Egg]

^
I would rather have Joe Morrow alone. Sad that B. Morrow got a better return.

[Captain_Obvious]

Based on what's been said, if we're speculating on anything I think the safe bet is that Iginla had several teams that he was considering but ultimately wanted final say when he'd arrived at a final decision.

I think it's also safe to conclude the organization felt obligated to respect his wishes based on his long tenure here and ultimately dealt him to where he wanted to go. Both out of respect, and at the end of the day, the terms of the contract they gave him.

Talk about forcing him to accept a trade etc just seems really disingenuous imo.

[MrMastodonFarm]

Originally Posted by SHOGUN

I'd rather have Joe Morrow + 1st...

I'd rather have a bj and a steak, but neither are currently being offered.

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by MrMastodonFarm

I'd rather have a bj and a steak, but neither are currently being offered.

no kidding, a lot of assuming going on here

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by Quincy Egg

I still can't believe the return includes two college kids that can choose to be UFA's at the end of the season. And the first round pick is no guarantee either.
Putrid.

you expected guarantee's for a 35 year old UFA?

[Quincy Egg]

Originally Posted by dino7c

you expected guarantee's for a 35 year old UFA?

No, I meant there is no guarantee of that first round pick amounting into an NHL'r