Fatal Cleaver Attack on soldier in London Caught on Camera NSFW

[jammies]

Originally Posted by undercoverbrother

Like deaths/injuries arising and/or $ value of property damage?

Yah, something like that. PETA breaking into a lab and freeing a couple monkeys isn't quite the same as flying a jet into a skyscraper.

[Senator Clay Davis]

Originally Posted by jammies

Yah, something like that. PETA breaking into a lab and freeing a couple monkeys isn't quite the same as flying a jet into a skyscraper.

I don't know, when you talk with some of these insane-o animal rights folks animal lives are superior to human lives.

[valo403]

Originally Posted by jammies

By severity? It's like a chart showing all crimes that equates shoplifting to murder. Sure, it might show you something, but the usefulness of that something is pretty poor.

Okay, then weight it by deaths. In that case I'd say that the chart is severely skewed by a single event, making it pretty much useless.

[jammies]

Originally Posted by valo403

Okay, then weight it by deaths. In that case I'd say that the chart is severely skewed by a single event, making it pretty much useless.

Well, it's already pretty much useless. Is there really a Latino terrorist threat 7 times as great as radical Islam?

I'm not an expert on statistics, but I'm pretty sure I could make a more useful chart than that just by excluding all events where no lives were lost and damage was less than, say, $10 000. Or by assigning each event a severity from 1 to 1000 depending on how much damage, number of people injured/killed, and the like.

[valo403]

Originally Posted by jammies

Well, it's already pretty much useless. Is there really a Latino terrorist threat 7 times as great as radical Islam?

I'm not an expert on statistics, but I'm pretty sure I could make a more useful chart than that just by excluding all events where no lives were lost and damage was less than, say, $10 000. Or by assigning each event a severity from 1 to 1000 depending on how much damage, number of people injured/killed, and the like.

If you lived in Puerto Rico in the 80's there was, but I've already stated that the inclusion of Puerto Rico and the label skews the data.

And yes, you could make a chart with your assigned values and it would basically be 9/11 taking up 99% of it, which sounds like a pretty useless chart to me unless your goal is to show which incidents have been the most destructive, something I'm not sure has ever been debated.

You're also pretending that unsuccessful terrorist acts simply didn't happen. The attempted car bombing in Times Sq a few years go failed and resulted in no deaths or property damage, but it sure as hell happened and it certainly had an impact on people living here.

[krynski]

Originally Posted by Senator Clay Davis

I don't know, when you talk with some of these insane-o animal rights folks animal lives are superior to human lives.

They do make some good points though. Animal welfare has been a huge issue in animal agriculture in the last few decades. Previous to that, nobody really cared and a lot of cruelty did occur.

[Fozzie_DeBear]

Originally Posted by scottish_flame

it's extremist followers of islam who bomb innocent people
Who says they don't represent Islam. Who is anyone to tell people what they believe in a religion

Do the Westboro Baptist Church do a good job of speaking for all Christians?

[jammies]

Originally Posted by valo403

And yes, you could make a chart with your assigned values and it would basically be 9/11 taking up 99% of it, which sounds like a pretty useless chart to me unless your goal is to show which incidents have been the most destructive, something I'm not sure has ever been debated.

Well I think Oklahoma City would show up in that chart, too, so I don't think 99% is at all accurate. That being said, a much better chart would be at least 3D, showing a pie with number of incidents and then the height of each piece showing incidents/deaths or something of that ilk. Then you would see an almost flat piece of "Latino" (why not label this "separatist"?) and a thin but chunky "Right Wing Gun Nuts" piece - that is, if there was such a piece, which seems to be missing somehow.

[T@T]

Originally Posted by Dion

Extremists using religion as an excuse for their actions. If religion did not exist they'd find another excuse for their actions.

Sorry can't agree, would there be suicide bombers if those people didn't believe in the after life, would extremists crash airplanes into buildings if they didn't believe in the after life or 72 virgins in heaven waiting for them. would two teenagers shoot up their school if they didn't believe that life in "hell" would be so much more fun.

How many atheists have you heard of committing mass murder while killing themselves?

There's thousands of years of proof that religion causes people to do extreme and barbaric acts of violence. As soon has people get a grip and live their life like it's their only one the better off we'll be.

[scottish_flame]

Originally Posted by Fozzie_DeBear

Do the Westboro Baptist Church do a good job of speaking for all Christians?

No they don't, but they believe their ideas are right and god backs them up

But they are part of the Christian faith

[Bagor]

Originally Posted by Zulu29

Last time replying to you, I'm a citizen of Ireland. I don't pretend to be an expert or know about the entire history of Ireland however I have more of a leg to stand on so to speak when it comes to discussing it than you.

No ..... you ...... don't.

[ernie]

I assume those with such disgust for Islam also have a healthy disgust over Catholicism and Christianity in general thanks to groups such as the IRA and the over 10,000 (I believe) bomb attacks they are responsible for.

What? No you don't? Perhaps you need to think on that then....

[undercoverbrother]

Originally Posted by ernie

I assume those with such disgust for Islam also have a healthy disgust over Catholicism and Christianity in general thanks to groups such as the IRA and the over 10,000 (I believe) bomb attacks they are responsible for.

What? No you don't? Perhaps you need to think on that then....

No I do.....

[scottish_flame]

Originally Posted by ernie

I assume those with such disgust for Islam also have a healthy disgust over Catholicism and Christianity in general thanks to groups such as the IRA and the over 10,000 (I believe) bomb attacks they are responsible for.

What? No you don't? Perhaps you need to think on that then....

Yes I do #### the IRA

There is good and bad in every religion.
I feel Islam extremists are the biggest culprit in religious sectarianism and attacks against every other religion

Like I said good and evil is everywhere

[valo403]

Originally Posted by jammies

Well I think Oklahoma City would show up in that chart, too, so I don't think 99% is at all accurate. That being said, a much better chart would be at least 3D, showing a pie with number of incidents and then the height of each piece showing incidents/deaths or something of that ilk. Then you would see an almost flat piece of "Latino" (why not label this "separatist"?) and a thin but chunky "Right Wing Gun Nuts" piece - that is, if there was such a piece, which seems to be missing somehow.

You're right, it would be 95%, which obviously creates a really meaningful display of statistics.

Again, when has there ever been a debate over what has been the most deadly terrorist attack on US soil? It's a topic that has absolutely no need to be presented in any form of chart or graph, it's basic common knowledge.

That chart accurately presents exactly what it says it presents.

[ernie]

Originally Posted by undercoverbrother

No I do.....

Well truth be told, i don't much like religion either as i find it unnecessary at best and at worst I find it is used far to easily as a cover/reason for a disgusting act. make no mistake, the conversations on this page don't actually have much to do with what is at the heart of the "offending" religions. I think the understanding has to be that these people are inflicting pain under the guise of religion when really it is politics at the heart of things.

That isn't to say religions can't do more as they can and should. But I don't believe for a second we get rid of terrorists by getting rid of religion or religious fervor becasue as someone mentioned the reason thsi exists is because they believe they are being oppressed or have been harmed etc by some certain group. Religion is just the blanket they like to wrap things up in. If it didn't exist they'd find another blanket (perhaps national identity fervor)

[PIMking]

Originally Posted by longsuffering

And to play the devil's advocate for a moment, what is fitting punishment for the tiny number of American soldiers who have run amok and killed innocents in Iraq, Afghanistan and other countries?

Well if they're doing that on their own without orders then they should be punished to the fullest extent of the law including death.

[Peanut]

Originally Posted by valo403

You're right, it would be 95%, which obviously creates a really meaningful display of statistics.

Again, when has there ever been a debate over what has been the most deadly terrorist attack on US soil? It's a topic that has absolutely no need to be presented in any form of chart or graph, it's basic common knowledge.

That chart accurately presents exactly what it says it presents.

I get what he's saying. I think if you factor in all the nutjob mass shootings over the past 15-20 years, oklahoma, etc, 9/11 is not going to be 95% of that chart.

I'm sorry, but barging into an elementary school and shooting up kindergarten classrooms with semi-automatic weapons is an act of terrorism. Colorado movie theatre, Mother's Day parades, etc. All that should be on the chart, and from what I understand most of the mass shootings in recent US history haven't been Islamic extremists.

[valo403]

Originally Posted by Peanut

I get what he's saying. I think if you factor in all the nutjob mass shootings over the past 15-20 years, oklahoma, etc, 9/11 is not going to be 95% of that chart.

I'm sorry, but barging into an elementary school and shooting up kindergarten classrooms with semi-automatic weapons is an act of terrorism. Colorado movie theatre, Mother's Day parades, etc. All that should be on the chart, and from what I understand most of the mass shootings in recent US history haven't been Islamic extremists.

I think you'd then be creating a very different chart, one that would then require a very different title.

This chart only uses data up until 2005, and is based upon acts that are deemed to be terrorist in nature by the FBI. A mass shooting is not a terrorist act in and of itself. Terrorism requires more, and the statistics this is based upon lay those definitions out very clearly.

Domestic terrorism is the unlawful use, or threatened use, of force or violence by a group or individual based and operating entirely within the United States or Puerto Rico without foreign direction committed against persons or property to intimidate or coerce a government, the civilian population, or any segment thereof in furtherance of political or social objectives.
International terrorism involves violent acts or acts dangerous to human life that are a violation of the criminal laws of the United States or any state, or that would be a criminal violation if committed within the jurisdiction of the United States or any state. These acts appear to be intended to intimidate or coerce a civilian population, influence the policy of a government by intimidation or coercion, or affect the conduct of a government by assassination or kidnapping. International terrorist acts occur outside the United States or transcend national boundaries in terms of the means by which they are accomplished, the persons they appear intended to coerce or intimidate, or the locale in which their perpetrators operate or seek asylum.

[PIMking]

Originally Posted by pylon

Reading comprehension.... not so much.

I never expressed that as my personal opinion. However, in many Countries in the world, the US is viewed as a terrorist state. That is a fact. Whether it is true or not is highly subject to debate based on what your religious and political beliefs are.

If it wasn't for the united states and it's soldiers Kuwait would be Iraq Junior, China would be part of Japan, and Europe would be mourning the death of Hitler in the 90's.

Canada isn't much different, I don't see Canada as a separate country, rather a brother of ours that lives in a colder climate. Most often Canada and the U.S are side by side along with England.

Do I agree that some things are not good like Vietnam, Iraq 2.0, however the U.S has done by far more good than it has bad