Francis: Tire Fire

[dammage79]

You only trade Gaudreau if it lands you pieces that can spread out the offensive load a bit more evenly throughout the top nine. I think you can do that and get a 1st round pick as well. It's too easy to stymie the offense

May not be a top six type pick but a decent one.

The problem.with the forward group as assembled is it's very unbalanced. You have Gaudreau and Monahan as the go to offensive grouping. Tkachuk makes the Backlund productive and that's it. And Bennett and Janko desperately need another skilled player on their wing as well. I could live with slotting Shore into that RW slot. But I feel like you can replace Frolik, Ferland, Brouwer.

I really do believe Treliving if he keeps his job is going to really overhaul the fw group. If he can get that by making room on the d corps for Andersson and say hitting a really great trade for Gaudreau, the Flames will look a lot healthier moving into the future.

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by Teroy

Suggesting that a player be traded because he doesn't always compete or because he probably gets us the most in return is not dumb. Criticising because you think you have all the correct answers is dumb. Laying the blame on the 4th line is equally dumb. All season we've heard how we need to bring up this player or that. Where has that gotten us. We haven't seen that magic RW scorer emerge. Nor have we seen any other players emerge from the farm. The only way to get that RW is to be prepared to move someone of value. Gadreau fits the bill regardless of whether you think that's dumb or not.

We need a RW scorer to play with JG...not to trade him for one.

Anyway I said it was dumb to trade him for 2 firsts which is what was suggested.

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by dammage79

You only trade Gaudreau if it lands you pieces that can spread out the offensive load a bit more evenly throughout the top nine. I think you can do that and get a 1st round pick as well. It's too easy to stymie the offense

May not be a top six type pick but a decent one.

The problem.with the forward group as assembled is it's very unbalanced. You have Gaudreau and Monahan as the go to offensive grouping. Tkachuk makes the Backlund productive and that's it. And Bennett and Janko desperately need another skilled player on their wing as well. I could live with slotting Shore into that RW slot. But I feel like you can replace Frolik, Ferland, Brouwer.

I really do believe Treliving if he keeps his job is going to really overhaul the fw group. If he can get that by making room on the d corps for Andersson and say hitting a really great trade for Gaudreau, the Flames will look a lot healthier moving into the future.

See this is a reasonable post about trading your best player...some of you take notes

Multiple quality players and picks you look at. Personally I still deal from the defense to uprade the forward depth...right side in particular. Get JG some linemates he doesn't need to carry.

[Psytic]

Originally Posted by dino7c

See this is a reasonable post about trading your best player...some of you take notes

Multiple quality players and picks you look at. Personally I still deal from the defense to uprade the forward depth...right side in particular. Get JG some linemates he doesn't need to carry.

If it was me I would be trading Gio because you can get a kings ransom for him ie. higher end RW and a 1st probably and we avoid the back end of his deal. Look at Poile sometimes you have to trade big names Like Jones and Weber to get big names back. We keep trading garbage we will get garbage back.

[Jeff Lebowski]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

Any player, regardless of size or skill, can forecheck and backcheck hard. If they want to. If they've come to understand it's as important to winning as putting the puck in the net. It has nothing to do with grittiness or hitting. Just look at all the times an international Finnish or Swedish team has beaten a bigger, more talented Canadian team because they have total buy-in.

If a guy like Henrik Zetterberg can play a committed, two-way game, so can Gaudreau and Monahan.

Gaudreau played incredibly hard this season IMO. People get on him because of turnovers at blue lines during tied games but he's trying to win. He handles the puck a lot and he's trying to make things happen.

He's not going to bang on the forecheck to get a turnover but he's very relentless and gets turn overs like Datsyuk used to. I have no problem overall with Gaudreau - of course he's not going to be on all the time.

Early on when he was on a 100+ pt pace he was just hustling and making plays all over the ice.

In terms of his back check and compete read Detroit's Blashill (I'm including more praise because Johnny gets too much ridiculous criticism).

Red Wings coach Jeff Blashill had the chance to coach Gaudreau in the world championships this past spring and liked him even more than he had before.

"I loved him," Blashill said. "I didn't know how hard he worked every single day. His track, he's been well-coached, his track is awesome. He works so hard on the back check. I knew he had real good ability, I'd seen him play since he was a youngster going back to midgets but then in Dubuque for sure. I was so impressed with his work ethic and his will to win. It's awesome. Can't say enough good things about him."

In 2010-11 with the USHL's Dubuque Fighting Saints, Gaudreau had 36 goals and 36 assists in 60 games.

Last season, Gaudreau had 18 goals among 61 points in 72 games.

With Team USA in the world championships, Gaudreau was tied for sixth in scoring with six goals and five assists in eight games.

Dylan Larkin had two goals and eight assists in those eight games.

"You learn how good he is," Larkin said. "I played with him both at the world championships and the World Cup. He's so good at seeing the ice and moving around and cutting back. He's probably one of the best at cutting back and kind of self-cycling. He's a dangerous player every time he's on the ice. What amazes me is his stick is so short that guys try and reach and go stick on puck and he just finds a way to pull it so close to his body and go underneath their sticks. It's amazing. Fun player to watch."

What is less fun is trying to find a way to defend Gaudreau.

"You got to skate with him, you've got to move your feet to defend," Larkin said. "I've seen him avoid tons of hits, you can't really get a hold of him. But you got to skate to defend him."

Said Justin Abdelkader: "It's tough. You want to make sure you're staying above him and making it hard, try and take his time and space away, not giving him room like players like."

Gaudreau has four assists in five career games against the Wings.

The Flames are 5-0-0-0 when Gaudreau collects two or more points.

"I think just his shiftiness, being a smaller guy, bigger guys have a real big problem kind of getting in front of him and playing physical on him," Scott Wilson said. "The style he plays, that's really one of the only things that would frustrate a guy like that is to play physical on him. You just got to be careful when he's out there, kind of like most of the other top guys in the league, have kind of a second awareness when somebody like that is on the ice."

https://www.nhl.com/redwings/news/no...au/c-292798194

[dino7c]

I am certainly not against trading one of our top players...deal has to make sense though. "I'm mad because we missed the playoffs so trade everyone for magic beans" is where I get annoyed.

[Erick Estrada]

Tough thing about trading Gaudreau is that you will be giving up the best player in the deal in his prime. He's done great on the Flames but playing out east with better line mates he could easily win the Art Ross trophy. That would be hard to take especially if the picks or prospects you get don't turn out as hoped. I just don't see that as something you do until he's a year away from free agency.

[Barca]

Originally Posted by Psytic

If it was me I would be trading Gio because you can get a kings ransom for him ie. higher end RW and a 1st probably and we avoid the back end of his deal. Look at Poile sometimes you have to trade big names Like Jones and Weber to get big names back. We keep trading garbage we will get garbage back.

Kings ransom?

he's 34 not 24, 3 more years at 6.75m

Tre would be lucky to get a 1st let alone a higher end RW.

[wired]

Originally Posted by dino7c

Nobody is being "attacked" for making an actual trade proposal. Saying "trade him" every three posts about the teams best offensive player is dumb. Suggesting to trade players for far less than market value just to get a rise isn't an opinion it's straight up trolling.

JG isn't moving for a couple picks, Hamilton isn't going for Krieder...point per game and league leading goal scorers under 25 dont move unless the offer is astronomical.

Ya, you make a point of doing that every time I post.
Take it for what it is dino, a post from a fan who isn't happy.
And, if I read the other posts, I am not the only fan who has this opinion.
But that's cool if you feel the need to keep bashing me for "trolling".

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by wired

Ya, you make a point of doing that every time I post.
Take it for what it is dino, a post from a fan who isn't happy.
And, if I read the other posts, I am not the only fan who has this opinion.
But that's cool if you feel the need to keep bashing me for "trolling".

I have yet to see anyone agree that trading him for two picks is a good idea...you think the team is bad now how bad would it be with 40% less offence.

Like I said make realistic proposals or your spade is gonna be called out as a spade.

[Monahammer]

I wouldn't trade johnny.

If we have to, the only thing that makes sense is a 1 for 1 for a similar caliber of player. We will lose any trade with gaudreau in it, and we will lose it even worse if it's for a package

[Monahammer]

Originally Posted by blender

There is nothing wrong with this team that Tavares couldn't fix.

This. Throw him 13 mil x 7 and Pray he says yea

[Buck Murdock]

I think trading Gaudreau would be a mistake, but expecting him to be the leader/captain of the team like a Jonathan Toews is a mistake as well. We need other high end forwards to shoulder some of the offensive responsibility, and let Johnny just play his game.

[Lanny_McDonald]

Originally Posted by Monahammer

This. Throw him 13 mil x 7 and Pray he says yea

No. Just no. John Tavares is not a $13M player. That contract would destroy the Flames. How the hell do you justify that contract? Tavares is barely a PPG player and is a minus player! He is no way near the same caliber as McDavid, and you're suggesting paying him more? That's a recipe for disaster as a franchise.

[blender]

Originally Posted by New Era

No. Just no. John Tavares is not a $13M player. That contract would destroy the Flames. How the hell do you justify that contract? Tavares is barely a PPG player and is a minus player! He is no way near the same caliber as McDavid, and you're suggesting paying him more? That's a recipe for disaster as a franchise.

Not necessarily.

Flames would have to shed some salary and rely on ELC contracts and hope that their 3 top D prospects can perform while they are cheap.

Tavares would instantly upgrade the whole team by pushing every center down one spot.

[dino7c]

McDavid contract is irrelevant when it comes to a UFA like Tavares.

[Flamenspiel]

Originally Posted by wired

Wow, a person cannot have an opinion on this board anymore. I would say to you, dino7c, take your own advice.
I have soured on the kid big time.
I am not the only one on the board either, you going to tell every one of them to get lost as well?

Well come on, trading Johnny Hockey for a couple of picks is absurd..Think about it.

[djsFlames]

Originally Posted by blender

Not necessarily.

Flames would have to shed some salary and rely on ELC contracts and hope that their 3 top D prospects can perform while they are cheap.

Tavares would instantly upgrade the whole team by pushing every center down one spot.

And give the Flames two elite pairings which is a lot harder to shut down than one. Could even shelter Johnny to feast the opposition. You can build around that structure for a number of years.

Backlund isn't the most ideal 2nd line C due to the lack of finish but as a 3C he would win his matchups and not have to worry about producing like a top 6 center.

It's really the quickest and most effective 'fix' that could be made to the problems up front. I'd draw up a competitive offer in the 9-10M range and just see where the chips falls.

[dino7c]

13M sounds crazy...its gonna take a massive overpay to get him here though

JG and JT under 20M doesn't sound so bad to me though with the cap going up

Stajan gone, get rid of Brouwer somehow...that is over 7M right there

[Roof-Daddy]

Originally Posted by djsFlames

And give the Flames two elite pairings which is a lot harder to shut down than one. Could even shelter Johnny to feast the opposition. You can build around that structure for a number of years.

Backlund isn't the most ideal 2nd line C due to the lack of finish but as a 3C he would win his matchups and not have to worry about producing like a top 6 center.

It's really the quickest and most effective 'fix' that could be made to the problems up front. I'd draw up a competitive offer in the 9-10M range and just see where the chips falls.

Tkachuk - Tavares - ________
Gaudreau - Monahan - ________
________ - Backlund - ________

Basically running two legit #1 lines and then you have a very strong two way 3rd line center to anchor line 3.

Shouldn't be hard to fill in the blanks there and have an elite top 9.

Now just need to hypnotize JT and make him sign here.