[Trade] PHI/ANA Trade: Drysdale and a 2025 2nd for Cutter Gauthier

[Boreal]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

I honestly can't think of an example where a top 5 pick wouldn't be signed after 1 year of college and burn a year of the ELC.

Cooley is a recent example but that's because there were questions on if he wanted to sign, not the other way around.

The CHL and international guys get drafted within a month of being drafted, so that's not really an example.

College guys all generally sign to burn that year of their ELC. Flames have done it with Coronato, Gaudreau, tried to with Fox, etc. Happened with Kent Johnson in Columbus.

I honestly can't really think of a time where a player wanted to sign and turn pro after the college season was done and it was the team that went "No, we don't want to sign you"

Further to this, burning the 1st year isn’t as big of a deal as it used to be, depending on the player.

With the current CBA signing a second contract without arbitration rights is an advantage to the team. Numerous factors are at play. Lack of negotiating power with offer sheet restrictions, evidence to prove worth of a term & $, and lastly if the contract turns sour the buy out is 1/3 not have when signed under than age of 25, giving the team more flexibility.

Coronato not being a Calder candidate this year is a great example.

If anything, signing after the season is a bit of an advantage to Gauthier.He could get 3 full years of NHL service on his ELC and be offersheet eligible, giving more negotiating power. Guess that will happen in Anaheim now.

[timun]

Originally Posted by dino7c

Come on now

I am saying the points are basically equal, Lindros had something that no other generational star ever had though which would have potentially put him ahead

That was a response to a post that was supposedly shutting me down because Lindros had one less point

This was all in response you being incredulous at SixtySix's suggestion that "Flyers gave up the best player in that trade": by insinuation, Peter Forsberg. You started arguing that Lindros was one of the all-time greatest players and was cut down injury, and pointed to his 1995-96 season as "one of the greatest seasons of all time."

I pointed out that you picked a stupid example, because that wasn't even far and away the best personal season of anyone in 1995-96. And you can argue 'til you're blue in the face about "dominance", but to even suggest that Lindros's '95-'96 season is among the all-time greats is patently ridiculous.

Originally Posted by dino7c

IMO and I can't stress this enough IMO he would have been the most dominant player of all time without the concussion issues

I watched him live in the mid 90s and I have never seen a player dominate like that.

I have seen all the others live too, I'm guessing some of you are just going by hockey DB

Likewise I can't stress this enough: in my opinion, your opinion of the matter is dumb. And the insinuation that anyone who disagrees with you is "just going by HockeyDB" is dumb.

I'm old enough to have watched both Lindros and Forsberg play their entire careers, and your opinion that Lindros was "on another level" is silly.

[cam_wmh]

Originally Posted by Aarongavey

I know I am in the minority but I have no problem with individuals having a say on where they work. It seems antiquated to me that a 18 year old has to move to this city because that team owns their rights. It is even worse in the CHL where some 16 year old child from North Battleford had to go to Portland because that is the city that owns his rights. Seems to me that you should have some say on where you live. It is only the best players that have the leverage though in either scenario to dictate where they live.

I mean your example really resonates, but could you…. imagine?

…..from Portland to North Battleford.

Originally Posted by MegaErtz

You have to play for the team that owns your rights, and and when someone like this Gauthier kid pushes the issue and advocates for his right to determine is own economic situation, I have to read through ten pages of old white guys complaining about how kids these days need to get in line and be appreciative of the players that came before them.

May I kindly implore you to post more often, and share more of your opinions.

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

Ironically, having your career shortened by injusry actually HELPS your career PPG stats, because you miss out on the later years that pull the average down. Forsberg and Lindros both benefitted from that.

As did Bobby Orr.

I might be the biggest Orr fan here, but his being 4th on that list is aided by the fact that he only played 36 games after the spring that he turned 27.

Bossy retired young as well (at 30).

Orr was alsoplaying on the knees of a 50 year old in the latter part of his career. And the fact that he is even on these lists speak for itself.

Greatest to ever lace them up.

As for this Gauthierkid, the Flyers sure seem to be going out of their way to assassinate his character. IMO you kind of cede the high road after that.

[Aarongavey]

Originally Posted by dino7c

nobody is forcing anyone to play in the NHL

its a kids game for millions of dollars, draft protects the integrity of the league

If you want to play in the NHL follow the league rules if not go to the highest bidder in europe or whatever

It is probably a good thing that Gauthier followed the league rules and will likely play in the NHL then. Worked out for everyone.

[iloveicedhockey]

Torts annihilated the reporter who said it had something to do with Kevin Hayes in his post game presser.

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by Aarongavey

It is probably a good thing that Gauthier followed the league rules and will likely play in the NHL then. Worked out for everyone.

Never said he didn't if that's what you are implying

as a fan I can think he is a ###### though

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by timun

This was all in response you being incredulous at SixtySix's suggestion that "Flyers gave up the best player in that trade": by insinuation, Peter Forsberg. You started arguing that Lindros was one of the all-time greatest players and was cut down injury, and pointed to his 1995-96 season as "one of the greatest seasons of all time."

I pointed out that you picked a stupid example, because that wasn't even far and away the best personal season of anyone in 1995-96. And you can argue 'til you're blue in the face about "dominance", but to even suggest that Lindros's '95-'96 season is among the all-time greats is patently ridiculous.




Likewise I can't stress this enough: in my opinion, your opinion of the matter is dumb. And the insinuation that anyone who disagrees with you is "just going by HockeyDB" is dumb.

I'm old enough to have watched both Lindros and Forsberg play their entire careers, and your opinion that Lindros was "on another level" is silly.

Well a few others have agreed with me so maybe just accept that people can have a different opinion and move on

Lindros at 100% > Forsberg at 100% IMO its not like I am saying Forsberg was bad for christ sake

Their numbers are almost even and one guy is way bigger and stronger so this idea that it's an asinine opinion is odd to say the least

Iginla had a career high of 99 points but was one of the most dominant power forwards in hockey history in his prime

[activeStick]

Originally Posted by iloveicedhockey

Torts annihilated the reporter who said it had something to do with Kevin Hayes in his post game presser.

It was awesome. Good for Torts.

https://twitter.com/user/status/1745290685148725435

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by MegaErtz

In any other industry this would be an open and shut case for anti-trust. Individuals, regardless of age or race, should be permitted to seek employment in the field of their choice with any employer, and should be allowed to negotiate compensation without arbitrary caps that they had no input on setting.

Man some of this really flies over the heads of some of you. This isn't an industry. It's a private league that chooses who can own a team (we have seen rich men try to buy themselves in only to get rebuffed), who can manage, coach, and play in the league. When you agree to play in this league, you agree to the league rules which like every other north american sport includes a draft process to disperse talent entering the league. If a player doesn't like the NHL cities, there are pro leagues all around the world where they can play as the NHL does not control professional hockey just their own private league. For a person that has a strong opinion on this topic it's crazy how little you understand about the business.

[VilleN]

Originally Posted by MegaErtz

If they want to play in the world's top league, they're forced to play for the team that owns their rights, and their earnings are capped.

In any other industry this would be an open and shut case for anti-trust. Individuals, regardless of age or race, should be permitted to seek employment in the field of their choice with any employer, and should be allowed to negotiate compensation without arbitrary caps that they had no input on setting.

Ummm... I can't make a million dollars a year in my chosen field. I had no input on this 'arbitrary' cap. What an oppressive system.

I also worked for government at one time. They had caps on earnings depending on the band you fit in. Negotiating a salary wasn't even an option.

[The Cobra]

Originally Posted by dino7c

nobody is forcing anyone to play in the NHL

its a kids game for millions of dollars, draft protects the integrity of the league

If you want to play in the NHL follow the league rules if not go to the highest bidder in europe or whatever

He certainly followed all league rules.

And NHL hockey is a multi-billion dollar business. It's not a kids game LOL.

The cap protects the integrity of the league.

He's not the first player to force a trade, he won't be the last.

[The Cobra]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

Man some of this really flies over the heads of some of you. This isn't an industry. It's a private league that chooses who can own a team (we have seen rich men try to buy themselves in only to get rebuffed), who can manage, coach, and play in the league. When you agree to play in this league, you agree to the league rules which like every other north american sport includes a draft process to disperse talent entering the league. If a player doesn't like the NHL cities, there are pro leagues all around the world where they can play as the NHL does not control professional hockey just their own private league. For a person that has a strong opinion on this topic it's crazy how little you understand about the business.

He didn't break any league rules. He chose not to play for the Flyers which is his right. The Flyers chose to trade him.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by The Cobra

He didn't break any league rules. He chose not to play for the Flyers which is his right. The Flyers chose to trade him.

Who said he did break any league rules? If he didn't want to play for the Flyers that's his decision. They can't force him to play there. That's not what anyone is arguing here. It's how he and the agent conducted themselves, ghosting the organization that drafted him that's drawn the ire of many around the league. Not very professional.

[BigRed]

Originally Posted by ComixZone

The Flyers are a loser organization. They've wandered in mediocrity for an eternity with a once every decade underdog playoff run.

...this stuff matters.

(also, Philly doesn't seem like a "pretty" city...so I definitely can't blame the kid)

Wrong there. Philly is a great city, loaded with amazing history and architecture and the PA countryside is beautiful. Also less than an hour to NYC.


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[TrentCrimmIndependent]

Originally Posted by iloveicedhockey

Torts annihilated the reporter who said it had something to do with Kevin Hayes in his post game presser.

I love Torts. What a treasure.

[BigRed]

Originally Posted by The Cobra

He didn't break any league rules. He chose not to play for the Flyers which is his right. The Flyers chose to trade him.

The point is, it’s NOT his right to choose who to play for. That’s counter the ethic of a draft-based league for parity and talent-dispersion purposes.

Some players torque the rules to the max to give themselves leverage to force teams to take action. That may not be breaking any ACTUAL rules, but it violates the spirit of a draft-based league. And it’s BS.

I’m personally a fan of letting the kid sit. I’d like some kind of regulation that requires players to play out AT LEAST their entry level deals with the team that drafts them or they can’t become UFAs etc (that NCAA rule cripples teams in ways that are completely insane). That way players can demand a trade and the team can move them based on fair value (see: Fox ).

To sum up: Screw Cutter. And Fox, while we’re at it.


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[topfiverecords]

Originally Posted by BigRed

The point is, it’s NOT his right to choose who to play for. That’s counter the ethic of a draft-based league for parity and talent-dispersion purposes.

Some players torque the rules to the max to give themselves leverage to force teams to take action. That may not be breaking any ACTUAL rules, but it violates the spirit of a draft-based league. And it’s BS.

I’m personally a fan of letting the kid sit. I’d like some kind of regulation that requires players to play out AT LEAST their entry level deals with the team that drafts them or they can’t become UFAs etc (that NCAA rule cripples teams in ways that are completely insane). That way players can demand a trade and the team can move them based on fair value (see: Fox ).

To sum up: Screw Cutter. And Fox, while we’re at it.


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Fox is worse than Gauthier though. Fox made it publicly clear he wouldn't play anywhere other than NY.

Gauthier didn't choose Anaheim. He just said he wouldn't play for the Flyers. He could have been traded to anywhere.

[TrentCrimmIndependent]

Nothing sports-related justifies death threats.

It's just a ####ing game.

[rohara66]

Originally Posted by TrentCrimmIndependent

It's just a ####ing game.