Huberdeau on the Panthers winning the cup

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by dino7c

The fact that you don't even mention Forsling is telling...

The Panthers could have survived without Tkachuk...dead in the water without Barkov, Bob, Forsling.

Like Bob absolutely stole game 1...thank your lucky stars or we would be hearing all about the Oilers cup right now.

Have your opinion but to say "its not even close" is so ridiculous it destroys any argument you have. Even Cali will tell you it is at least VERY close. I wanted Tkachuk to own the Oilers, I think Lomberg did as much in the Finals.

Yes, it tells that I don't think Forsling is in the same category as Tkachuk

Cali is welcome to his opinion, but is not the final say on all things Florida. I can have an opinion, just as you can (even though yours is ridiculous and wildly biased)

And I am discussing who the best players on the team are, not who had the best SCF series. Yes, Bob was great in the series. Cool. He isn't Tkachuk.

[Solstice]

Originally Posted by Locke

Dude...I know.

I'm fluent in French and read the French version. This is a nothing-burger.

Just a hockey-player saying hockey-player things. The only thing he left out was 'get pucks in deep.'

Yeah. He is under-performing especially in light of his contract. And yes, that sucks. But as far as a Flames fan is concerned? We aren't going to be any good during the duration of the contract anyways so...who cares?

You might know but others might not lol

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Jay Random

Blowing your stack is not ‘trying too hard’, it's just stupid. Tkachuk did genuinely have to learn not to do that.

People seriously don't remember that game and how it went down.

There's a good argument to be made that Tkachuk's role and improvement in Florida is because he's doing some of what the veterans were telling him back then.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Rhett44

True. I guess what I'm saying is give me a player who is willing to go all out and have someone reel him in. Over a player who simply does not care or saves effort for another game.

The game was over. Muzzin gently lofted a puck into Tkachuk's lap. Tkachuk blew a gasket. Mission accomplished by Muzzin.

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

Yes, it tells that I don't think Forsling is in the same category as Tkachuk

Cali is welcome to his opinion, but is not the final say on all things Florida. I can have an opinion, just as you can (even though yours is ridiculous and wildly biased)

And I am discussing who the best players on the team are, not who had the best SCF series. Yes, Bob was great in the series. Cool. He isn't Tkachuk.

Mine is "wildly biased" but you not mentioning their #1 D isnt. Okay guy. You are the one saying things like "its not even close. Not me.

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by Rhett44

I see some people trying to minimize Tkachuk's effect on the Panthers. He may not be their best player, but he turned their entire culture around.

The Panthers were yearly 1st round exits when they had Huberdeau on the team. Tkachuk helped bring them to relevance in the playoffs.

Make no mistake, if you trade JUST Huberdeau for Tkachuk, the Panthers have no finals appearances and no cups in the last 2 years.

With Tkachuk if Bob doesnt do a 180 its the same thing...they were down 3-1 to Boston when he was in the bench.

The point of my post isn't to bash Tkachuk anyway...just this narrative it was Huberdeau out Tkachuk in and nothing else different and bam cup! They made multiple changes including the coach and systems. Their goalie went from one of the worst contracts in the league to one of the best playoff performances in NHL history, and then pretty much did it again the next season he just wasn't relied on quite as much.

Narrative is wrong

[butterfly]

Originally Posted by Jason14h

What was your opinion on Hubby ? I assume you watched him more than anyone here . Did you think he was a 115pt “fraud” before the trade ?

Yes. Here is the list of players who have scored 115+ points twice or more in their career, never mind beginning at age 30:

Mike Bossy
Bobby Clarke
Paul Coffey
Marcel Dionne
Phil Esposito
Wayne Gretzky
Dale Hawerchuk
Jaromir Jagr
Nikita Kucherov
Jari Kurri
Guy Lafleur
Mario Lemieux
Connor McDavid
Adam Oates
Bobby Orr
Joe Sakic
Denis Savard
Peter Stastny
Bryan Trottier
Steve Yzerman

Does Huberdeau belong amongst that crowd?

[Regorium]

Huberdeau is a classic Demar Derozan. You never win with that type of player even though they're doing and saying all the right things.

Hard to hate as a person but is completely useless from a hockey fan perspective when you want your team to actually win the championship.

[InternationalVillager]

What if Huberdeau drops 90+ points next season and the Flames finish outside the Top 10 draft picks but miss the playoffs anyway.

Then these same posters would be criticizing him for showing up in a season that doesn't matter and keeping the Flames away from a top pick and moan about how "Calgary Flames" this situation is.

He's in a no win situation and I wish some fans would just understand that and lay off him.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by dino7c

Mine is "wildly biased" but you not mentioning their #1 D isnt. Okay guy. You are the one saying things like "its not even close. Not me.

You have shown your bias towards Tkachuk (and any ex-Flame) on numerous occasions. It is here for all to see, and has been commented on by many posters.

I have no bias regarding Florida or Forsling. I think Forsling is a good player, but I don't think he's at Tkachuk's level. That's it. That isn't a bias, it's a simple opinion.

And saying it isn't close also isn't being biased, it is simply exemplifying the point.

Guy.

[Rhett44]

Originally Posted by dino7c

With Tkachuk if Bob doesnt do a 180 its the same thing...they were down 3-1 to Boston when he was in the bench.

The point of my post isn't to bash Tkachuk anyway...just this narrative it was Huberdeau out Tkachuk in and nothing else different and bam cup! They made multiple changes including the coach and systems. Their goalie went from one of the worst contracts in the league to one of the best playoff performances in NHL history, and then pretty much did it again the next season he just wasn't relied on quite as much.

Narrative is wrong

Tkachuk changed the attitude in their room. Of course you are never winning the cup with no goalie, but it's crazy to try to discredit what he did. Their franchise completely turned around the year he got traded to them, and a large part of that is because of Tkachuk himself.

How many overtime goals did he have last playoffs? And what did the Panthers win when they had Huberdeau around the same core?

Tkachuk is way more impactful than you give him credit for.

[Cecil Terwilliger]

Originally Posted by Jiri Hrdina

Can you point to anyone across media and other experts that predicted the type of fall that Huberdeau had.
I think most felt that it had some risk at the back end of the deal, but I don't think anyone predicted the greatest fall in NHL history.

If you think BT should have been able to see that - I don't know what to tell you. I don't think that's a reasonable expectation.

If BT can’t see the future, I don’t want him anywhere near my nhl team. The only reason I hired Conny is because he has a future machine like that awful Ben Affleck movie.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Rhett44

Tkachuk changed the attitude in their room. Of course you are never winning the cup with no goalie, but it's crazy to try to discredit what he did. Their franchise completely turned around the year he got traded to them, and a large part of that is because of Tkachuk himself.

How many overtime goals did he have last playoffs? And what did the Panthers win when they had Huberdeau around the same core?

Tkachuk is way more impactful than you give him credit for.

The Presidents Trophy?

[memphusk]

Originally Posted by InternationalVillager

What if Huberdeau drops 90+ points next season and the Flames finish outside the Top 10 draft picks but miss the playoffs anyway.

Then these same posters would be criticizing him for showing up in a season that doesn't matter and keeping the Flames away from a top pick and moan about how "Calgary Flames" this situation is.

He's in a no win situation and I wish some fans would just understand that and lay off him.

Nope. I would thank sweet baby Jesus. I just can't see him ever getting back to 90 points with his broken heart.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by butterfly

Yes. Here is the list of players who have scored 115+ points twice or more in their career, never mind beginning at age 30:

Mike Bossy
Bobby Clarke
Paul Coffey
Marcel Dionne
Phil Esposito
Wayne Gretzky
Dale Hawerchuk
Jaromir Jagr
Nikita Kucherov
Jari Kurri
Guy Lafleur
Mario Lemieux
Connor McDavid
Adam Oates
Bobby Orr
Joe Sakic
Denis Savard
Peter Stastny
Bryan Trottier
Steve Yzerman

Does Huberdeau belong amongst that crowd?

I forget when Huberdeau promised a second career (and record setting) season. I'd say he's more like Pierre Larouche, Johnny Gaudreau, Bobby Smith, Gilbert Perrault, Henrik Sedin, etc.

[Owen15]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

That was the worst coaching ever seen out of Sutter for some reason. And it was bad enough to make a guy known for effort like Kadri just mail it in by the end of the season. Sutter seemed pretty impatient with line combos that season, and Huberdeau wasn’t the only guy who struggled under him - look at Coleman’s year compared to last season, or Markstrom’s or Kadri’s.

####, why wouldn’t Kadri mail it in? Sutter puttin Ritchie out in a shootout over the talent on the bench? Sutter maybe making moral scores but as a player wtf would you think of the actions of your coach. Among other head scratching moments. And I like Sutter. But he does play games.

[butterfly]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

I forget when Huberdeau promised a second career (and record setting) season. I'd say he's more like Pierre Larouche, Johnny Gaudreau, Bobby Smith, Gilbert Perrault, Henrik Sedin, etc.

How else was Lindholm supposed to score 50 goals?

[SuperMatt18]

Originally Posted by Rhett44

Tkachuk changed the attitude in their room. Of course you are never winning the cup with no goalie, but it's crazy to try to discredit what he did. Their franchise completely turned around the year he got traded to them, and a large part of that is because of Tkachuk himself.

How many overtime goals did he have last playoffs? And what did the Panthers win when they had Huberdeau around the same core?

Tkachuk is way more impactful than you give him credit for.

Eeeh I think that's giving Tkachuk too much credit.

The back to back playoff losses changed the attitude of the room.

Paul Maurice changed the attitude of the room.

Tkachuk played a role too, but I also think guys like Barkov, Ekblad, Verhaghe, etc all played a role.

And in the end the biggest reason they ended up having success was because Bobrovsky finally found his elite game in the playoffs.

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by Rhett44

Tkachuk changed the attitude in their room. Of course you are never winning the cup with no goalie, but it's crazy to try to discredit what he did. Their franchise completely turned around the year he got traded to them, and a large part of that is because of Tkachuk himself.

How many overtime goals did he have last playoffs? And what did the Panthers win when they had Huberdeau around the same core?

Tkachuk is way more impactful than you give him credit for.

How many rounds did Iginla win without Kipper? There is a reason people say it should be called goaltending and not hockey.

You guys can continue with the narrative if you like but if Bob didn't go into god mode they would have gone nowhere...their franchise had totally changed when they had 93 points and were down 3-1 to Boston? Or did it change when the 10M backup they were trying to move turned into a top 5 goalie?

Bob stood on his head in game 5 against Boston, I really think some of you need to revisit that game...that was the turning point of the franchise. Multiple breakaway stops in the 3rd and OT. If not for that its out and 5 and a summer of trying to move the 10M boat anchor.

If 4th best player on the best team in the league is supposedly an insult take it as such, honestly its pretty damn good IMO.

[butterfly]

Gilbert Perreault as a Huberdeau comp, lol. Perreault put up 11 straight PPG seasons, the latter 5 of which were in his 30s, scored 500+ goals, got his number retired, made the list of 100 best hockey players of all-time, and made the Hall of Fame.

Huberdeau has 4 PPG seasons total.

Perreault he ain't.