The Blue Jays Thread.

[JiriHrdina]

Originally Posted by CaramonLS

He can opt out next year, not this one.

As for BJ Ryan, there is nothing you can do with him. Nothing. No one is going to touch a closer making 10 m per coming off TJ surgery, without at least 1 full year of success back.

Anyways, I'd look at moving Accardo, a young closer with another 4 years or so under contract, is going to fetch a king's ransom in return if you can find the right buyer. Might be able to plug some of our major holes with that.

What are the holes for next season you think?

Short-stop: Johnny Mac is great but not a starter.
LF: Do you give Reed another shot a full-time job?
Catcher: I like Zaun but he's had a bad year at the plate and can't seem to throw out runners.

What else are we looking at? Depends of course on what other moves are made but for now what holes would one ideally like to plug?

[FLAMESRULE]

Originally Posted by JiriHrdina

Catcher: I like Zaun but he's had a bad year at the plate and can't seem to throw out runners.

For me thats it right there. The pitchers will get better in there moves to home plate, side steps, shorter quicker deliveries next year. They are all pretty young and that can be taught. Zaun brings some leadership to the table, but I just dont like him behind the plate. We need a cannon back there right now. KC had about 10 stolen bases in that series and thats unacceptable.

I'd also add some better LH batters, specifically in the DH spot. A LH instead of Thomas would help balance out the hitting and keep the opposing pitchers on there toes a bit more.

[flambers]

Originally Posted by JiriHrdina

What are the holes for next season you think?

Short-stop: Johnny Mac is great but not a starter.
LF: Do you give Reed another shot a full-time job?
Catcher: I like Zaun but he's had a bad year at the plate and can't seem to throw out runners.

What else are we looking at? Depends of course on what other moves are made but for now what holes would one ideally like to plug?

I believe the main hole is at Short stop. The pitching is all but set for next year. I believe the Jays will have Reed as their every day Left Fielder. The Catcher position will stay with Zaun and Thigpen. Thigpen will start to take over.

As for SS position JP will have to trade for one in my view.

[Machiavelli]

Well, they need a really good, reliable left-handed hitter, and a veteran catcher to help mentor Thigpen.

EDIT: A GOOD veteran catcher.

[CaramonLS]

Originally Posted by JiriHrdina

What are the holes for next season you think?

Short-stop: Johnny Mac is great but not a starter.
LF: Do you give Reed another shot a full-time job?
Catcher: I like Zaun but he's had a bad year at the plate and can't seem to throw out runners.

What else are we looking at? Depends of course on what other moves are made but for now what holes would one ideally like to plug?

SS.

Now, next year ideally a LF platoon of Johnson/Stairs next year will likely out-perform anything else you can find on the open market, but here is how I view it. If they kept their numbers from this year with their current split rates, you'd be looking at the Reed/Stairs platoon putting up a combined OPS of around .950. Amazing production from that position. You can't really upgrade that.

There is only one upgrade from Zaun on the market who will help your team next year and that is Posada - Catchers/SSs are almost all right handed, and I refuse to blame the teams SB woes on Zaun. Our pitchers refuse outright to throw out of the stretch with runners on base, most of the time they steal runners right off of the pitchers, not zaun. He doesn't have a great arm, but it is decent. Even Pudge in his prime would be having trouble throwing guys out with this pitching staff. Holding the runners is a team game. Barrett would be a pretty big risk, he is having a bad year, and he has always been LHP heavy on his numbers. Not to mention what kind of team guy he is remains to be seen.

One of these positions: DH/3B/RF/CF needs to be filled with a real left handed power threat, because finding a Lefty to fill the C/SS positions is near impossible. The only way you can accomplish that without removing someone established from one of those 4 positions I mentioned is if you were able to add 2 guys like Arod/Posada, guys with virtually no splits to speak of (even though Arod bats right handed). That is a pipe dream. The thing is JP has really pushed himself into a corner filling ALL their power positions with a righties or a lefty who isn't really a power guy (even though Overbay when healthy, I really do like him and he is very good). Simply replacing overbay with another left hander, would be 3 steps forward and 2 steps back IMHO - you need a lot more balance in this lineup.

[habernac]

I really don't have a problem with SS. Johnny Mac is hitting around .275 and is unreal in the field. Left field and Centre field have been mediocre this year. Overbay hurt has definitely impacted first base. It could be a totally different deal if we're healthy. I don't know....

[Sylvanfan]

Well if you view the lineup as simply having a hole to plug, the two area's are shortstop and catcher. Although I think Zaun would be okay in a platoon role....the injury he suffered seemed to affect him quite a ways into the season.

I look at that Jays lineup and the players they have, and I think it needs a lot of tweaking. As has been mentioned numerous times too many power hitting right handed guys. They need to mix in a left handed everyday bat with a bit more pop, and they need to replace one of Thomas or Glaus with a contact hitting on base guy. A big problem is that they have Rios, Wells, Thomas, and Glaus as the guys you'd ideally slot into the 3-4-5-6 spots and they're all right handed hitters. Somehow you have to replace one or two of them with a left handed bat. Than go out and find a short stop who can hit effectively left handed as well.

From what I've seen this year....this lineup needs significant work.

If possible I would trade off Glaus for a prospect, move Hill back to third base, than sign a guy like Castilla to play second base. Than see if the Yankees will give you Abreu for Vernon Wells....okay, thats a dream...sorry.

vs. RH pitching
Castilla
Rios
Abreu
Thomas
Overbay
Hill
Stairs
Zaun/Thigpen
SS

vs. LH pitching
Castilla
Rios
Abreu
Thomas
Hill
Overbay
Zaun/Thigpen
SS
Reed Johnson

[JiriHrdina]

Originally Posted by CaramonLS

SS.

Lots of stuff.

Good analysis.

With Zaun you are probably right. Though often when he throws he's offline anyways but that could be because he's trying to rush the throw. Heck at times he's even just held on to it because he knows he has no chance. A sad commentary on the pitcher's ability to hold runners. Watching McGowen the other night was painful.

Was Stairs deal a one or two year deal?

[Sylvanfan]

I think Stairs was a one year deal. But the guy seems to like playing in Toronto, if the team is willing to be fair to him I don't think signing him will be a big problem. I don't think he's a guy who's going to demand 5 million or something crazy.

[CaramonLS]

Originally Posted by JiriHrdina

Good analysis.

With Zaun you are probably right. Though often when he throws he's offline anyways but that could be because he's trying to rush the throw. Heck at times he's even just held on to it because he knows he has no chance. A sad commentary on the pitcher's ability to hold runners. Watching McGowen the other night was painful.

Was Stairs deal a one or two year deal?

He was just one a 1-year deal. However, I remember him making comments about always wanting to play in Canada, so I think if the Jays do want him back, he'll stay. I'm not sure how many teams are going to try to break the bank for Matt Stairs, but I doubt it will be too many.

If JP offers him a 1 year at ~ 2 million, I could see the guy taking it before free agency even opens up, which is really reasonable for the production he brings.

Anyways, MLB4u.com has a good list of upcoming free agents. On the SS market, you really aren't going to find many upgrades, besides Arod - David Eckstein is the top of the class for SSes, which isn't that much of an upgrade at all over what McDonald brings - and he is probably going to get a nice contract out of it.

[habernac]

Originally Posted by JiriHrdina

Good analysis.

With Zaun you are probably right. Though often when he throws he's offline anyways but that could be because he's trying to rush the throw. Heck at times he's even just held on to it because he knows he has no chance. A sad commentary on the pitcher's ability to hold runners. Watching McGowen the other night was painful.

Was Stairs deal a one or two year deal?

Darrin Fletcher had some pretty good analysis the last few games. He blamed it all on the pitcher having too high a leg kick.

I keep forgetting about our lack of decent left handed bats.

[Sylvanfan]

Well the one thing the Jays have that is solid is their pitching. Roy Halladay has a nice game going the distance allowing 5 hits and a single run. After the first inning only one hit to the outfield as well and gets it done in less than 100 pitches.

I wonder if the Jays can get Chacin back into the lineup come September and give him a few starts to drum up some potential trade interest for the offseason. Having a couple of pitchers to dangle on the trade market would certainly open up a few trade options me thinks. Last I saw with Chacin he was optioned to Syracuse rather quietly and declined the option. So anyone know what his story is?

[calculoso]

Originally Posted by Sylvanfan

Last I saw with Chacin he was optioned to Syracuse rather quietly and declined the option. So anyone know what his story is?

07/27/2007: http://mlb.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?...=.jsp&c_id=tor

07/30/2007: http://mlb.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?...=.jsp&c_id=tor

"On second thought: Gustavo Chacin's stint as a member of the Triple-A Syracuse Chiefs was a short one. Two days after Toronto optioned the left-handed starter to the Chiefs, the club reversed the transaction by voiding the option used on Chacin. Instead, the Jays placed the lefty back on the 15-day DL.

Chacin, who was originally placed on the DL with a shoulder injury on April 28, has gone 0-1 with an 11.12 ERA in two rehab outings at Triple-A. By being placed back on the DL, Chacin remains on the Major League roster, which means he's still eligible to receive his big-league salary, and can continue to build up his service time while rehabbing with Syracuse. "

[rubecube]

I heard there's a LH hitter out of San Francisco who's looking to DH next year...

[JayP]

Originally Posted by rubecube

I heard there's a LH hitter out of San Francisco who's looking to DH next year...

And then what do you do with Thomas.

It's not like Bonds is an upgrade on Thomas either.

[flambers]

At Thomas price tag, he is not going anywhere. The Jays line-up is not to shabby. The key is can they stay healthy? They have lost a crap load of players to fluke injuries. At some point that bad luck has to turn around.

[Bobblehead]

At the start of the season I don't think I was alone in thinking the Jays would need to score runs to win. Yet the youngsters have come through and they Jays are living by the pitching staff.

Kind of makes you wonder if BJ Ryan isn't expendable.

[Jiggy_12]

The game tonight was one of those that seemed the Jays were destined to lose. Stranding runners, striking out at in-oportune times, and grounding into DP's. But they pulled it off with a 2-1 win.

5.5 games back of the wildcard now, with 7 in a row at home. They are 16-4 in the last 20 home games. They have to keep this up.

How great is the rotation looking for next year?

Halladay
Marcum
Burnett
McGowan
Litsch

[CaramonLS]

Originally Posted by Jiggy_12

The game tonight was one of those that seemed the Jays were destined to lose. Stranding runners, striking out at in-oportune times, and grounding into DP's. But they pulled it off with a 2-1 win.

5.5 games back of the wildcard now, with 7 in a row at home. They are 16-4 in the last 20 home games. They have to keep this up.

How great is the rotation looking for next year?

Halladay
Marcum
Burnett
McGowan
Litsch

Litsch really shouldn't be pitching at the ML level right now. A good deal of smoke and mirrors, poor K/BB ratios, everything that says he will not be having this kind of season.

He should be in AAA, he does have potential to be a decent 4/5 guy in the future. Ideally I'd like to see them sign someone with a real track record of success to round out the rotation. Injuries are inevitable and Litsch might be a good plan B or C next year.

Say... Bartolo Colon? No one is going to risk giving him more than a 1 year deal coming off 2 poor, injury plagued seasons - before that though, this guy is a legitimate ace pitcher, one of the most consistant guys around. You might have to give him 5 + incentives, maybe as high as 7-8, but it would be worth it on a 1 year deal. If he can stay healthy, he'd be an amazing addition. That is the type of move the jays need if they plan on getting over the hump next year... in addition to plugging their holes in the batting order.

[habernac]

maybe if he lost about 100 pounds.