Looking at the stats: We're far, but not that far from good.

[Cali Panthers Fan]

Originally Posted by Mathgod

None of those guys are the level of a MacKinnon, Crosby, Malkin, Ovechkin, Kane, Barkov, McDavid, Eichel, Matthews, etc.

And good as Gio was, he was not on the level of Makar, Hughes, Heiskanen, etc.

Yes it's possible (though very difficult) to get elite players outside of the top few selections of the draft. But the elite of the elite players are usually found at the top of the draft.

Maybe...time will tell, but he won the Norris trophy. I'd say he was pretty damn good and worthy of being in the same conversation as those current players.

Why are we so quick to run down our own guys? It doesn't make sense.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Cali Panthers Fan

Maybe...time will tell, but he won the Norris trophy. I'd say he was pretty damn good and worthy of being in the same conversation as those current players.

Why are we so quick to run down our own guys? It doesn't make sense.

When I watch Heiskenan I sure don’t see a huge difference between him and Gio.

[VilleN]

Yeah, I think you need to take Makar out of that group... Hughes maybe as well... I think Gio and Heiskanen are comparable though.

[Itse]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

When I watch Heiskenan I sure don’t see a huge difference between him and Gio.

Heiskanen is 26, has played 8 seasons for 507 gp and 312 pts, 0.61 ppg. That's just the regular seasons. He has also played 93 playoff games for 65 pts, for 0.70 ppg. He's one of three defenseman in NHL history to score two goals in a playoff game as a teenager. He has been top 10 in Norris trophy votes 4 times and outside of an injury is pretty much a lock for a 5th time this season.

Giordano at 26 had played 123 games over 3 NHL seasons for 35 pts, or 0.28 ppg. He has scored 1 playoff goal in 41 playoff games over his whole career, and has an overall 0.27 ppg in playoffs. He has been top 10 in Norris votes 5 times in his 19 NHL seasons, the first season being 2014 when he was 31.

Yes Giordano has a Norris which is something Heiskanen might never achieve (especially since he's about the same age as Makar) and Gio was an excellent player in his prime, but let's not kid ourselves. Heiskanen is likely to completely blow Gio out of this comparison when his career is done, and when comparing these two players at the same age, the comparison looks silly.

Also: I think we can all agree that Gio was a pretty extreme anomaly in terms of career trajectory. Giordano is literally the only undrafted Norris trophy winner ever. (Well, after Bobby Orr who pre-dates the draft era.) It might literally never happen again, and it's insane to plan around that.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Itse

Heiskanen is 26, has played 8 seasons for 507 gp and 312 pts, 0.61 ppg. That's just the regular seasons. He has also played 93 playoff games for 65 pts, for 0.70 ppg. He's one of three defenseman in NHL history to score two goals in a playoff game as a teenager. He has been top 10 in Norris trophy votes 4 times and outside of an injury is pretty much a lock for a 5th time this season.

Giordano at 26 had played 123 games over 3 NHL seasons for 35 pts, or 0.28 ppg. He has scored 1 playoff goal in 41 playoff games over his whole career, and has an overall 0.27 ppg in playoffs. He has been top 10 in Norris votes 5 times in his 19 NHL seasons, the first season being 2014 when he was 31.

Yes Giordano has a Norris which is something Heiskanen might never achieve (especially since he's about the same age as Makar) and Gio was an excellent player in his prime, but let's not kid ourselves. Heiskanen is likely to completely blow Gio out of this comparison when his career is done, and when comparing these two players at the same age, the comparison looks silly.

Also: I think we can all agree that Gio was a pretty extreme anomaly in terms of career trajectory. Giordano is literally the only undrafted Norris trophy winner ever. (Well, after Bobby Orr who pre-dates the draft era.) It might literally never happen again, and it's insane to plan around that.

All I can say is that I'm never really impressed by Heiskenan. Age be damned.

[Calgary4LIfe]

Schaefer. This conversation needs more Schaefer.

[PeteMoss]

Originally Posted by Jay Random

Yup. Incredibly unlikely to draft Fox in the 3rd round, Gaudreau in the 4th round, Wolf in the 7th, to get Giordano undrafted, and if you want to go way back Fleury in the 8th (which doesn't even exist anymore). That stuff never happens, especially to the Flames.

It seems silly to me to talk about the low probability of things that have already actually happened, particularly when one of those players is actually on the team right now and is the single most valuable player on the roster.

You can do it, no one is saying you can't. You just can't do it consistently or make it an organizational strategy. The hit rate is too low.

25 years ago or whatever - everyone was thinking Detroit had figured out the draft and was smarter than everyone else, but it went away. Tampa more recently - same thing

[Mathgod]

The year Gio won the Norris, he got 74 points. Heiskanen has already had a year similar to that where he scored 73 points. The thing is, Gio's career is in the books. Heiskanen still has many years ahead of him. This year he has 29 points in 32 games, on pace for 74 points.

So outside of one brilliant year, I wouldn't put Gio on Heiskanen's level.

[Jason14h]

Originally Posted by Mathgod

The year Gio won the Norris, he got 74 points. Heiskanen has already had a year similar to that where he scored 73 points. The thing is, Gio's career is in the books. Heiskanen still has many years ahead of him. This year he has 29 points in 32 games, on pace for 90 points.

So outside of one brilliant year, I wouldn't put Gio on Heiskanen's level.

Might want to recheck that Math, God .