Craig Conroy Needs to Pick a Lane

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Jason14h

They didn’t get younger. If they didn’t make the trade and traded Kuz for the 3rd they wouldn’t have any of those guys , would have 2 more prospects , and 10 mil in extra cap room (which doesn’t really matter this year but is still real
Money and may matter in coming years )

If the lane is “build through the draft” you aren’t making the move Conroy has .

I guess the lane is get younger and hope middle 6 players break out . It may work - we’ll see

And if the plan is to trade Frost and Farabee in future years for picks ….. what was the point in the first place ? Make us just good enough to get worse picks , and push the eventual arrival of those draft picks out multiple years ?

Every team that has built through the draft has also traded a pick or two if they thought it made sense.

And you assume someone wanted Kuzmenko for a 2025 3rd. He was a cap dump/throw in when Calgary traded Lindholm (for a 1st, 4th and two prospects, one of which is looking really good). He was making $5.5M and scoring at a 3rd line pace. Philly liked him so much they traded him to LA along with a 2025 7th in exchange for a 3rd in 2027 (speaking about pushing the draft picks out multiple years).

[howard_the_duck]

For the most part I'm aligned with Conroy's plan.

He's acquiring picks, keeping the picks, and overhauling the system. That's a big step that previous regimes have failed at. It's not a small victory either and I don't take it lightly.

Where I disagree with the current strategy is acquiring the 25 and under talent right now. The most valuable asset(s) in this re-something are the Flames picks. The deals to acquire Frost, Farabee etc. are elevating our floor and decreasing the value of our own picks.

We can point to all these picks they've had in the first few years of the Conroy era, but if we can't accumulate at least 1-2 top 10 picks I fear we'll be disappointed that the top end of the team isn't as good as it needs to be to win.

[Aarongavey]

Originally Posted by Jason14h

That’s because you’re a Flames fan and WANT it to work out (nothing wrong with optimism).

Philly clearly saw a 3rd option where they were not worth keeping over a 2nd and 3rd (Plus the salaries they are paid which is a big part)

Farabee got 6!! Points in 33 games here making 5$ million for 3 more seasons

Frost got 12 in 33 games

These are horrible numbers for what they are getting paid , and realistically they aren’t in development years - they are reclamation projects

If they reproduce what we saw in almost half a season here this year they are untradeable contracts, and both would just be gone when their contracts expire

The money for the Flames is almost irrelevant unless they have an internal cap. The Flames will be nowhere near the cap at any time during those two players contracts. The money was always going to be relevant the Flyers, they are right up close to the cap this year, knew they had to sign Brink and Drysdale next year and now have to sign Zegras (who they somehow blew more draft capital on acquiring than the Flames theoretically did on acquiring Frost and Farabee).

To say that Frost at 12 points in 33 games is untradable basically means that the Zegras trade should never have happened. These guys will be tradable if the Flames decide they want to trade them. Traceable at their current contracts or trade able with retention. Given that the Flames are in a full blown rebuild either option will not be difficult.

[Macindoc]

Originally Posted by howard_the_duck

For the most part I'm aligned with Conroy's plan.

He's acquiring picks, keeping the picks, and overhauling the system. That's a big step that previous regimes have failed at. It's not a small victory either and I don't take it lightly.

Where I disagree with the current strategy is acquiring the 25 and under talent right now. The most valuable asset(s) in this re-something are the Flames picks. The deals to acquire Frost, Farabee etc. are elevating our floor and decreasing the value of our own picks.

We can point to all these picks they've had in the first few years of the Conroy era, but if we can't accumulate at least 1-2 top 10 picks I fear we'll be disappointed that the top end of the team isn't as good as it needs to be to win.

You can't push the draft picks too far down the road. Wolf is entering his prime now. You can't waste a prime Wolf in the hopes of possibly drafting and developing a player who in 7-8 years will be as impactful as Wolf is now. With Wolf and Parekh where they are right now in development and age, the window opens in about 2 seasons and remans open for about 5 seasons. Any additions need to be ready to join the team in 2-3 seasons, or need to be in their prime between 2 and 7 seasons from now. So adding players currently age 20-25 fits the plan well, as long as you aren't giving up other assets that will be in their prime during the contention window.

[Locke]

Originally Posted by puffnstuff

I thought this was going to be about bowling...

I never once thought this thread was going to be about bowling. But I kind of wish it was...

[FanIn80]

Originally Posted by Aarongavey

Given that the Flames are in a full blown rebuild either option will not be difficult.

I see both sides.

I'm on board with Conroy and I share the same vision he has. I'm not always on board with how it translates to the ice, but that's more on coaching and identity than anything else.

Having said that, we are absolutely NOT in a full-blown rebuild. Don't be fooled by all the vets we've traded away. We tried everything we could do to keep those players, and only eventually traded them as an absolute last resort.

- Tanev wanted out, but there was a report that he would have stayed if we paid him extra.
- Lindholm wanted out and wouldn't even sign the contract that he asked for when we tried to give it to him.
- Zadorov wanted out becuase he was fed up with the mentality of the team/dressing room/organization/etc (ie. he hates losing and our room at the time seemed ok with it).
- Hanifin wanted out and told us he wasn't going to re-sign with us. We still kept him all year and tried to extend him right up until the deadline.
- Marktsrom was done with us. He was mad about something I can't remember and wanted out.

Toffoli and Mangiapane are probably the only two instances where an argument could be made that it was our decision to trade them. Mangiapane for sure, Toffoli is a bit more grey, as he says he told Tree that wanted to stay, but then Conny never talked to him about extending so he asked Conny to move him.

So... I think "full-blown rebuild" is a bit of a stretch. A much more apt term would be "as-blown-as-we're-allowed-to-be-and-only-because-everyone-wanted-out reconfiguration".

[dash_pinched]

Originally Posted by Locke

I never once thought this thread was going to be about bowling. But I kind of wish it was...

Well, if you think about it, Conroy has no time left to spare to make a decision on the direction the team should pursue and the time to strike is now. Otherwise, he will look like a turkey.

[Mathgod]

I believe he has picked a lane: try to make the playoffs.

You look at the run this team went on to end the season. Got to within a tiebreaker of making the playoffs despite Sharangovich playing hurt, Andersson playing hurt, and no Parekh. Now you get everyone back healthy and add Parekh to improve what was the team's most glaring weakness last season: the powerplay. And suddenly you're looking at what could be a playoff team.

If half way through the season you look at the standings and things aren't working out, you deal Andersson and possibly others and see if you can re-tool with younger players.

Other than that, I don't know what you can realistically expect Conny to do. He's doing the best he can, in my opinion, with the cards he's been dealt.

[Freeway]

The Flames actively negotiated with the majority of the pending UFAs.
They had terms they weren't going to go past, though, and that's primarily what drove a lot of the departures.

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by FanIn80

I see both sides.

I'm on board with Conroy and I share the same vision he has. I'm not always on board with how it translates to the ice, but that's more on coaching and identity than anything else.

Having said that, we are absolutely NOT in a full-blown rebuild. Don't be fooled by all the vets we've traded away. We tried everything we could do to keep those players, and only eventually traded them as an absolute last resort.

- Tanev wanted out, but there was a report that he would have stayed if we paid him extra.
- Lindholm wanted out and wouldn't even sign the contract that he asked for when we tried to give it to him.
- Zadorov wanted out becuase he was fed up with the mentality of the team/dressing room/organization/etc (ie. he hates losing and our room at the time seemed ok with it).
- Hanifin wanted out and told us he wasn't going to re-sign with us. We still kept him all year and tried to extend him right up until the deadline.
- Marktsrom was done with us. He was mad about something I can't remember and wanted out.

Toffoli and Mangiapane are probably the only two instances where an argument could be made that it was our decision to trade them. Mangiapane for sure, Toffoli is a bit more grey, as he says he told Tree that wanted to stay, but then Conny never talked to him about extending so he asked Conny to move him.

So... I think "full-blown rebuild" is a bit of a stretch. A much more apt term would be "as-blown-as-we're-allowed-to-be-and-only-because-everyone-wanted-out reconfiguration".

This is a weird recounting of events, most of these things never happened.

Tanev and Lindholm both would’ve stayed for more money that was never offered… so how can you say they decided whether they moved or not?

Lindholm specifically came out and said he would have stayed, so I don’t know where you heard we met his ask and he still said no.

Zadorov, like Toffoli, requested a trade because the Flames didn’t offer them a contract. Zadorov specifically said he requested it because he thought it was disrespectful other guys got one and he didn’t.

And the reason Markstrom was mad (that you can’t remember) is he specifically asked not to hear about trade talks and he kept hearing about it while he was actively being shopped lol.

The only guy on your list the Flames were essentially forced into trading was Hanifin, who it seems like they did want to keep.

I seriously have no idea why people bend over backwards and make things up to reframe the Flames clearing house as anything less than it was. They tried to get guys for contracts that would have worked for the team, which the guys didn’t accept, so they traded them. Acting like the players forced them into it when the Flames could’ve gone and met those offers or kept those players that had contracts remaining is bizarre.

[Calgary4LIfe]

If you go around the league at "full blown rebuilds", Calgary is right up there in terms of vets traded out for futures. This team responded by out-working every other team that expected a rebuilding team to show up. Let's see what happens this year.

[Party Elephant]

My favourite genre of FOI posts is getting mad about trades/signings that Conroy didn't make, but imagine if he had?

[dammage79]

Originally Posted by Party Elephant

My favourite genre of FOI posts is getting mad about trades/signings that Conroy didn't make, but imagine if he had?

"But he wanted to! We are Lucky the players wanted out!"

[dammage79]

I don't think this is revisionist history I'm about to say here but in regards to Elias Lindholm, he was never going to sign back in Calgary. The second Johnny signed in Columbus he was done. His garbage bag day presser said it all. Nothing that was said after (including that he said he would've re-signed) could've changed my mind on that.

Media ran Markie out of town.

Tkachuk did about as much as he could do right by the Flames outside of staying.

The two players I regret seeing leave the Flames are Minny and Bennett.

[GreenLantern2814]

Originally Posted by kehatch

Craig Conroy has been GM of the Flames for just over two years now, and it feels like he’s been letting the situation make the decisions for him. The team calls it a “retool,” but let’s be real—that’s just code for not fully committing to anything. They’re not rebuilding, but they’re also not trying to be competitive right now.

That kind of in-between approach has left the Flames stuck. Not terrible, not great—just a bit below average—a position fans are pretty used to.

To be fair, Conroy was busy in his first year. He had to deal with a bunch of expiring contracts and a crowded goalie situation. But since trading Markstrom before the 2024 draft he has made one move. One. A midseason trade that brought in Frost and Farabee—a smart gamble regardless of direction, but that’s it. One trade over two summers and a full season.

Last season was a weird one. The team overachieved, played above expectations, and came within a point of the playoffs. It was exciting for the fans and good for development, but it might’ve been the worst outcome long-term. It gave the illusion that this roster is better than it really is. The truth? They were propped up by strong goaltending and a relatively injury-free season. That’s not sustainable.

Now, don’t get me wrong—Conroy has done some solid work. He’s drafted well, hasn’t thrown money around recklessly, and hasn’t made any long-term moves that will come back to bite the team. You could nitpick a few signings or trades, but overall, he’s been smart and he has a few gems on his resume.

But at some point, he has to make a choice. Waiting around to see if the bottom falls out isn’t a plan. It’s time for Craig Conroy to stop reacting and start leading.

With respect, Minister, Craig Conroy 'needs' to do nothing.

They have the most cap space in the league, or very near it.

They're assembling a team, and so far they've got a #1G, #1D and #1 RW.

I vote Craig continues with his masterly inactivity.

[Knut]

Did not realize that Conroy is a Left lane struggler. For shame.

[VilleN]

I think if they were set on a true rebuild Naz and Ras would be gone. I understand that Conroy hasn’t gotten his asking price on Ras, but the longer we hold onto him and Kadri, the more our own rebuilding capital decreases. Had we been completely out of the playoff picture I assume one or both of those guys would be gone - I would like to see the organization make a strong commitment to the rebuild, ignore the standings, trade more of our valuable veterans for draft capital and/or young, promising players. To me it feels like they let the standings dictate what their plan is… which in my opinion is a mistake.

[FanIn80]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

Tanev and Lindholm both would’ve stayed for more money that was never offered… so how can you say they decided whether they moved or not?

Lindholm specifically came out and said he would have stayed, so I don’t know where you heard we met his ask and he still said no.

Zadorov, like Toffoli, requested a trade because the Flames didn’t offer them a contract. Zadorov specifically said he requested it because he thought it was disrespectful other guys got one and he didn’t.

And the reason Markstrom was mad (that you can’t remember) is he specifically asked not to hear about trade talks and he kept hearing about it while he was actively being shopped lol.

Linholm wanted 8M/yr, and when we offered it, he still said no. Conroy himself even said that we finally offered him what he wanted, but he still wanted out.

I agree that Tanev would have stayed for more money. That's literally what I said.

The tweet from Zadorov's agent about wanting to go to Toronto was posted right after a bad loss, and at the time he went off the people in the room who wanted Sutter gone are the ones who are happy with losing.

Thanks for reminded me why Markstrom was mad. He told the team he was open to either being traded or extended, and then got mad and actively wanted out when it was leaked that he was being shopped.

Don't know what your point is though. Trading vets for youth/picks is the hallmark of a rebuild... but vets wanting out and the team trying to convince them to stay but eventually relenting and trading them for youth/picks is not a rebuild.

What if Lindholm accepted the 8M/yr offer? What if we did pay more for Tanev to stay than what his value was? What if Hanifin had been the one that relented and accepted one of our offers that we kept coming to him with during the 7 months we tried to sign him? What if no one leaked that we had phone around about Markstrom, and he never got mad enough to demand a trade, and since Tanev, Lindholm and Hanifin all re-signed it made more sense to keep Markstrom and make Wolf his backup? What if Lindholm accepted his offer right away, so we knew how much money we had left for the others, and were able to get to Zadorov before he got mad?

The reality is that the only reason we even look like we're rebuilding is becuase the core that we had didn't want to stay. It's not becuse the Flames decided to move on from them.

The reason I'm behind Conroy is because Tre would have replaced those guys with other vets, but Conny didn't want to do that. The facts are that he tried to keep the vets, failed and refused to replace them with other vets. Those are the facts. The part I choose to make up in my own head is that it was ownership that told him to try to keep the vets, and Conny was happy that they all turned us down becuase it allowed him to force ownership to move on.

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by FanIn80

The reality is that the only reason we even look like we're rebuilding is becuase the core that we had didn't want to stay. It's not becuse the Flames decided to move on from them.

Said another way: the only reason we look like we’re rebuilding is because we are.

The reality is that the Flames very much did decide to move on from them and you’ve admitted yourself that almost all of them wanted to stay lol. If they wanted to stay until the Flames didn’t want to do enough to keep them… who made the decision?

I just don’t see the point in putting effort into making your narrative seem plausible. It’s certainly not “reality.”

Tanev, Lindholm, Toffoli, Zadorov, and Markstrom all wanted to stay, but then we’re for some reason going to ignore that the Flames weren’t willing to offer the money or even a contract at all to keep them (and for Markstrom, actually wanted to move him), and suddenly they were the ones in the driving seat making the Flames do things they didn’t want to do? You can see how that sounds a bit silly.

[Wastedyouth]

Paging the "This Post Sucks" guy.