[News] Oilers Charity scam?

[GullFoss]

This is a wild story if Katz is taking benefiting personally from the 50/50.

[BigThief]

Was told local billionaires need a new free arena because they give so much back to the community.

[Southside]

Originally Posted by topfiverecords

Wasn’t there also suspicion around who some of the big 50/50 winners were a few years back?

I recall that being an issue in Winnipeg. They had some repeat winners in the same season.

[IamNotKenKing]

Just for fun I pulled the Corporate Search on WIN50 Ltd. just now.

The 100% voting shareholder is OHC Parent Corp.
The directors are Daryl Katz and Brad Gilewich.
Brad Gilewich is the President of Katz Group.

OHC Parent Corp. has Daryl Katz as the 99.01% shareholder.
Daryl Katz and Brad Gilewich are the directors.

[Rejean31]

Originally Posted by IamNotKenKing

Just for fun I pulled the Corporate Search on WIN50 Ltd. just now.

The 100% voting shareholder is OHC Parent Corp.
The directors are Daryl Katz and Brad Gilewich.
Brad Gilewich is the President of Katz Group.

OHC Parent Corp. has Daryl Katz as the 99.01% shareholder.
Daryl Katz and Brad Gilewich are the directors.

Shady as ####!!

[IamNotKenKing]

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

I hear you. There are too many charities that hoard cash frankly, look at the endowment that a place like Harvard has.

But honestly, $15 million in GIC's seems kind of ridiculous for the Flames foundation and if they had a longer term vision to spend that money, you'd think they would share it. My sense is that they don't actively seek uses of their funds and simply rely on the grant application process.

Your sense is incorrect.

The recent Inclusion Program was a large, internally arisen, new focus.
Also, during COVID, the then existing balance was largely used for urgent needs of entities.

There are some long-term projects as well, which have funds earmarked annually, including the Grade 6 YMCA program, APPLE Schools Foundation, and Rotary Flames House. The latter was a big one which had lots of discussion in regard to funding.

All that aside, I was surprised to see the balance as high as it is now, and anticipate (hope for) some funding announcements soon.

[Shazam]

Originally Posted by heep223

There is a TON of mismanagement, grey area and outright fraud in the “non profit” space. Way more than people realize. Don’t get me started on youth soccer clubs lol

Your issue is with the CRA IMO. They say you can donate into a foundation, get the tax deduction, and that foundation only has to donate 5% of its assets every year to maintain its status.

It's 5% because that is basically the safe withdrawal rate for indefinite income.

[Bourque's Twin]

I don't know the inner workings of the licensing fees, etc; however, one would assume that the more revenue you get, the lower the % of licensing fees would be required. The Jets, Leafs, and Habs all paid charity around 30-35% of the 100% taken in from 50-50 sales. Oilers were below 20% and did 20x the revenue. The Oilers' excuse mostly revolved around marketing, and as someone who as done all forms of advertisement (radio, newspaper, social media, etc.), a # of 21M is insane.

I also can't believe they report a 21M line item to CRA as "licensing fees" with no further breakdown.

If the Oilers weren't hiding anything, they'd share that breakdown with the public and this issue would go away. However, they are obviously hiding things as they are making excuses and not providing a breakdown.

[CalgaryFan1988]

Honestly, how does this team have any fans left?

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by IamNotKenKing

Your sense is incorrect.

The recent Inclusion Program was a large, internally arisen, new focus.
Also, during COVID, the then existing balance was largely used for urgent needs of entities.

There are some long-term projects as well, which have funds earmarked annually, including the Grade 6 YMCA program, APPLE Schools Foundation, and Rotary Flames House. The latter was a big one which had lots of discussion in regard to funding.

All that aside, I was surprised to see the balance as high as it is now, and anticipate (hope for) some funding announcements soon.

I appreciate that you seem to be involved with the foundation and so the discussion is appreciated. And you’re not just making stuff up a la pepsifree.

I have no objection to the programs that the foundation supports, the examples you mention I’m certain are worthwhile. There just needs to be more. The monies given to the programs you mention represent a fraction of the funds paid into the foundation by Flames fans. I’d also suggest that given the taxpayer support that CSEC receives and the wealth of the owners, it would be nice if CSEC made a bigger financial commitment.

Also I don’t see evidence that the surplus was largely used up during COVID. The balance has never dropped below $8 million.

Running a foundation isn’t easy necessarily. For profit businesses have a responsibility to shareholders and it is easier to be held accountable. Many not for profits have disengaged Boards and fall into the routine of doing what they always do since they aren’t challenged.

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by Bourque's Twin

I don't know the inner workings of the licensing fees, etc; however, one would assume that the more revenue you get, the lower the % of licensing fees would be required. The Jets, Leafs, and Habs all paid charity around 30-35% of the 100% taken in from 50-50 sales. Oilers were below 20% and did 20x the revenue. The Oilers' excuse mostly revolved around marketing, and as someone who as done all forms of advertisement (radio, newspaper, social media, etc.), a # of 21M is insane.

I also can't believe they report a 21M line item to CRA as "licensing fees" with no further breakdown.

If the Oilers weren't hiding anything, they'd share that breakdown with the public and this issue would go away. However, they are obviously hiding things as they are making excuses and not providing a breakdown.

Yeah the huge amount paid as a licensing fee is questionable on its own. Knowing that it is paid to a company owned by the hockey club owner is outrageous really.

[IamNotKenKing]

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

I appreciate that you seem to be involved with the foundation and so the discussion is appreciated. And you’re not just making stuff up a la pepsifree.

I have no objection to the programs that the foundation supports, the examples you mention I’m certain are worthwhile. There just needs to be more. The monies given to the programs you mention represent a fraction of the funds paid into the foundation by Flames fans. I’d also suggest that given the taxpayer support that CSEC receives and the wealth of the owners, it would be nice if CSEC made a bigger financial commitment.

Also I don’t see evidence that the surplus was largely used up during COVID. The balance has never dropped below $8 million.

Running a foundation isn’t easy necessarily. For profit businesses have a responsibility to shareholders and it is easier to be held accountable. Many not for profits have disengaged Boards and fall into the routine of doing what they always do since they aren’t challenged.

Let's move the discussion on the Flames Foundation itself to a different location, and keep this one focused on the No Goods and their clear No Goodness.

But, a couple of minor tidbits:

The Flames Foundation year end follows the season (June fiscal), so financials have overlap between seasons which does confuse things a bit in regard to receipts and disbursements during the COVID years.

Also, things changed massively in regard to receipts in 2020 due to the advent of online 50-50, and for a few years post its implementation the Flames Foundation remained cautious on "out kicking the coverage" in regard to making promises of funds based upon the then known income, to ensure it could continue to do what it promised. Slower increases in disbursements were thought to be more prudent due to that. I cannot say what is currently ongoing in regard to future pledges.

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

And you’re not just making stuff up a la pepsifree.

I thought we could disagree without saying things like this?

[Robbob]

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

I appreciate that you seem to be involved with the foundation and so the discussion is appreciated. And you’re not just making stuff up a la pepsifree.

I have no objection to the programs that the foundation supports, the examples you mention I’m certain are worthwhile. There just needs to be more. The monies given to the programs you mention represent a fraction of the funds paid into the foundation by Flames fans. I’d also suggest that given the taxpayer support that CSEC receives and the wealth of the owners, it would be nice if CSEC made a bigger financial commitment.

Also I don’t see evidence that the surplus was largely used up during COVID. The balance has never dropped below $8 million.

Running a foundation isn’t easy necessarily. For profit businesses have a responsibility to shareholders and it is easier to be held accountable. Many not for profits have disengaged Boards and fall into the routine of doing what they always do since they aren’t challenged.

I would imagine that all the Flames owners make charitable donations outside the Flames foundations. Does it really matter whether they funnel the donations through the foundation or through other avenues?

[TheIronMaiden]

All funds acquired through lotteries, draws or games are monitored by the AGLC. There are strict parameters on how funds are used. It is my understanding that these funds can never be used for staffing

. https://aglc.ca/forms/use-proceeds-u...key-principles

[Rejean31]

Originally Posted by TheIronMaiden

All funds acquired through lotteries, draws or games are monitored by the AGLC. There are strict parameters on how funds are used. It is my understanding that these funds can never be used for staffing

. https://aglc.ca/forms/use-proceeds-u...key-principles

But you know damn well that if any organization is going to find a way to bend the rules it will, without a doubt, be the Edmonton Oilers.

[SportsJunky]

Speaking of Katz, has anyone seen him recently? The last photos I remember seeing of him was 5 or 6 years ago when his nose and face was caving in.

[PaperBagger'14]

Makes you wonder if Katz is helping fund the McWifes high end furniture store / bar. That’s such a weird business idea that having Katz fund it to “supplement” the McDavids would make some sense.

[Funkhouser]

Guys, lets not over-react here. These funds are essential to fund such community endeavors as:

-a retail store/bar for Mrs. McDavid
-salaries for essential community guardians Mike Smith & Duncan Keith, who both LTIRetired early to relieve cap pressure off the Oilers.
-a personal urinal station for head propaganda agent David Staples.
-a personal defribulator for Bob Stauffer.
-a personal tanning bed for Gene Principe.