Calgary Company Refuses To Donate Troop Decals To City

[jolinar of malkshor]

Originally Posted by Agamemnon

Well, we can certainly disagree on this point... I think writing a letter/filling a giftbox/volunteering your time with veterans is a LOT better than slapping a sticker on your bumper. A bumper sticker is the laziest kind of support I could imagine.

Like I said, all those things you mentioned are very good things to do. But to think that giving public support to our troops is any LESS than what you suggested is wrong.

[jolinar of malkshor]

Originally Posted by alltherage

Displaying GO FLAMES GO on a car is a far cry from SUPPORT OUR TROOPS. There are no political implications, and they are not likely to divide their support with a flames sticker.

Personally I don't know enough about this war and why our troops are over there to have made a decision on who I support and where- but I appreciate to the death that our troops are taking the ultimate risk to protect the rights of others and to maintain peace and freedom in our world.

I wouldn't sport a ribbon on my car though. Too many political agendas are mixed in and being persued in this war, in other countries (USA, Britain, etc) and perhaps our own. Our troops being out there in the first place is a testiment to that.

It's not about supporting the "WAR"....it is about supporting our troops....the people that fight for our freedom and sovereignty. People that are currently serving in more than 40 countries world wide....not just Afghanistan

[Burninator]

Originally Posted by jolinar of malkshor

There are organizations already selling the decals with proceeds going to the families. The fact is the people down at idiot hall do not have the guts to say, yes lets put them on our vehicles, they are giving them to us free so lets show our support. They are to worried that they will offend someone by supporting the troops.

It is not just about financial support, it is about public support and showing that in public. Like I stated before, many families said that they would greatly appreciate this gesture. By your argument, why even have Rememberance day???? Lets just send the money to the military families because that would help them more.

There is a lot more to it than financial support......

Did you just compare Remembrance Day and stickers on a car? That wasn't my logic at all. What are you talking about? Perhaps you are assigning more significance to the "support our troops" stickers than I am because I agree with Agamemmon. It is better than nothing, but I liked what Captain Crunch suggested, and I think he knows what makes soldiers feel supported.

[jolinar of malkshor]

Originally Posted by Burninator

Did you just compare Remembrance Day and stickers on a car? That wasn't my logic at all. What are you talking about? Perhaps you are assigning more significance to the "support our troops" stickers than I am because I agree with Agamemmon. It is better than nothing, but I liked what Captain Crunch suggested, and I think he knows what makes soldiers feel supported.

Ya...that is what I said . You might want to reread. It was your logic that brought that out. Now you didn't say it in so many words but by putting it in the form of a question, one can only assume that you were not asking a rhetorical question but implying that financial support is better than public support.

I have not said either is better or worse. I have said that public support is just as important as anything else. Not to mention that it is a constant reminder of where our troops are, what they do and the sacrifice that they make.

As for your comment "it is better than nothing"...ok sure...anything is better than nothing, accepting free stickers and putting them on all the vehciles is better than making a bureaucratic system to try and sell some stickers and send some of the proceeds to the family members. What would be best is both.

As for your comment about Captain Crunch....what are you trying to say??? That Captain Crunch knows more about this than the family members and solidars that came down to city hall to support this inititive??? Thats not what your saying...is it?

[Agamemnon]

Originally Posted by jolinar of malkshor

Like I said, all those things you mentioned are very good things to do. But to think that giving public support to our troops is any LESS than what you suggested is wrong.

Well... I can't really figure out what you're saying here, my only point is writing letters/filling gift boxes/donating your time to veterans>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>putting a bumper sticker on your car.

I just think its dumb for anyone to argue about stickers... its the laziest form of support in existence (well, except for not having a sticker but supporting them on message forums I suppose...).

[PsYcNeT]

Nationalism is for weenies.

[jolinar of malkshor]

Originally Posted by Agamemnon

Well... I can't really figure out what you're saying here, my only point is writing letters/filling gift boxes/donating your time to veterans>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>putting a bumper sticker on your car.

I just think its dumb for anyone to argue about stickers... its the laziest form of support in existence (well, except for not having a sticker but supporting them on message forums I suppose...).

Oh...ok...I get it. If the support is not up to your standards....then it isn't worth anything at all and you might as well not even bother because you will be labled lazy. I see.

Like I said before, soldiers and there family have said that they appreciate the fact that people would put these on their vehicle.....I quess you know more than them...ok....

[Addick]

Originally Posted by jolinar of malkshor

There are organizations already selling the decals with proceeds going to the families. The fact is the people down at idiot hall do not have the guts to say, yes lets put them on our vehicles, they are giving them to us free so lets show our support. They are to worried that they will offend someone by supporting the troops.

It's not about having the guts to put the stickers on the vehicles but not having the mandate to support the war, which the placement of stickers is heavily associated with. There is nothing stopping them from supporting the members of the Armed Forces so they have found a way to accomplish this in a clear and unambiguous manor. The folks down at Silly Hall aren't trying to avoid pissing off voters they are simply trying to avoid actions that are not part of the mandate that those voters have given them. The only one trying to shore up votes is Dr. No, and before you go cast your vote for him you should find out how he got is aforementioned nickname...

Btw, Remembrance Day is a national holiday not municipal.

[jolinar of malkshor]

Originally Posted by Addick

It's not about having the guts to put the stickers on the vehicles but not having the mandate to support the war, which the placement of stickers is heavily associated with. There is nothing stopping them from supporting the members of the Armed Forces so they have found a way to accomplish this in a clear and unambiguous manor. The folks down at Silly Hall aren't trying to avoid pissing off voters they are simply trying to avoid actions that are not part of the mandate that those voters have given them. The only one trying to shore up votes is Dr. No, and before you go cast your vote for him you should find out how he got is aforementioned nickname...

Btw, Remembrance Day is a national holiday not municipal.

Thanks.....I didn't realize that.... The fact that it is a holiday has nothing to do with it.....I am not even going to comment on the rest of your post because of this statement....wow

[Flame On]

The outcome of the vote, as tabled by Bronco, is far better than a few tired and forced flimsy stickers.
I like the idea of actual support rather than a sticker that allows one to absolve themselves of thinking about the issue further becasue they have a tiny sticker they toss on the a$$ end of their car.
I also agree with troutman.

[Agamemnon]

Originally Posted by jolinar of malkshor

Oh...ok...I get it. If the support is not up to your standards....then it isn't worth anything at all and you might as well not even bother because you will be labled lazy. I see.

I never established standards for supporting the soldiers because I don't care to... just because I think stickers are the laziest form of support in existence doesn't mean you can't think they're the greatest things in the world. Whatever floats your boat. My labeling stickers/you as lazy shouldn't really affect you at all, so don't worry about it!

Like I said before, soldiers and there family have said that they appreciate the fact that people would put these on their vehicle.....I quess you know more than them...ok....

No need for the juvenile sarcasm, we can talk about this without needing that. I guess I'll take your word for it that the soldiers and their families truly appreciate these stickers, my guess it that they'd appreciate a lot of other (tangible) things a whole lot more. If you think a sticker on your bumper is an adequate level of support then thats your call to make.

[Burninator]

Originally Posted by jolinar of malkshor

Ya...that is what I said . You might want to reread. It was your logic that brought that out. Now you didn't say it in so many words but by putting it in the form of a question, one can only assume that you were not asking a rhetorical question but implying that financial support is better than public support.

I said it shows more support to the troops in this instance to give money to a military support group than putting stickers on vehicles. I don't see how you are making the connection to a national day to honour fallen soldiers.

I have not said either is better or worse. I have said that public support is just as important as anything else. Not to mention that it is a constant reminder of where our troops are, what they do and the sacrifice that they make.

Oh I see, you are the only that can extract what people are saying "in so many words" without directly saying it? I think you've made your opinion pretty clear as to what you think is better when you said:

I am completely disgusted with Calgary's city council. These people have no balls whats so ever. I hope all of them exept McIver gets voted out in the next election.

obviously not everyone supports the troops. If they did, they would have accepted the FREE stickers and put them on the vehicles.

Yes, those are all good things that one can do to show their support, but I disagree that it is better.

I think both options with the stickers are showing public support. And whether you like it or not, showing support for the troops often gets tied up with support the war. I don't think it's fair, but that is just how things are these days. I can understand why City council changed their position on the stickers. I can't say I agree with it, but I understand why they don't want to get mixed up with all the political agendas associated with it. They should have just stuck with their first plan and not caused all this fuss. With that said, I don't think the switch to the new plan is as bad as people are making it out to be. I don't want this country to be the US where if you are slightly opposed to something supporting the troops (perhaps in favour of another sign of support) you are labelled a terrorist/traitor/french.

As for your comment "it is better than nothing"...ok sure...anything is better than nothing, accepting free stickers and putting them on all the vehciles is better than making a bureaucratic system to try and sell some stickers and send some of the proceeds to the family members. What would be best is both.

I agree both would be better. But as far as I know that isn't one of the options.

As for your comment about Captain Crunch....what are you trying to say??? That Captain Crunch knows more about this than the family members and solidars that came down to city hall to support this inititive??? Thats not what your saying...is it?

Well seeing as Captain Crunch is former military I figure he has a pretty good understanding of what support soldiers like. And stop trying to get people to say things they aren't. Stop trying to set up traps. Only one question mark is needed at the end of a sentence.

[mykalberta]

Originally Posted by RedHot25

Off topic, but still....isn't this to kind of be expected to an extent? He kind of does that whole "mayor thing" .

Yes he is the mayor but unless my Grade 6 Social Studies is failing me he has one vote just like everyone else - I believe mayors also have the tie breaking vote as well (not sure exactly). The problem in Calgary is that no Alderman (apart from maybe McIver) has the backbone to go against him because of his precieved popularity within Calgary. He isnt the president of Calgary, he has one vote just like everyone else and I dislike him because he is a wannabe NDP without the courage to run under an NDP banner.

MYK

[PowerPlayoffs06]

Apparently city unions may defy the vote of City Council and put decals on vehicles of their own accord.

http://calsun.canoe.ca/News/Alberta/...66324-sun.html

It's a pretty stupid issue to get so riled up about. Stickers. Weee...

[mykalberta]

Originally Posted by PowerPlayoffs06

Apparently city unions may defy the vote of City Council and put decals on vehicles of their own accord.

http://calsun.canoe.ca/News/Alberta/...66324-sun.html

It's a pretty stupid issue to get so riled up about. Stickers. Weee...

I dont disagree with that, but how can employees defy the wishes of the company that owns the said vehicles? Unless I am mistaken, the vehicles are owned by the city and should not have any non-apporved decals placed on by employee groups.

I watched the interview the union head had on Global, he made it sound as if the vehicles belonged to the union to do with as they like. - strange.

Normally I would be all over in support of the Unions but I can see the road this goes down and 9/10 times I wont like it.

MYK

[RedHot25]

Originally Posted by mykalberta

Yes he is the mayor but unless my Grade 6 Social Studies is failing me he has one vote just like everyone else - I believe mayors also have the tie breaking vote as well (not sure exactly). The problem in Calgary is that no Alderman (apart from maybe McIver) has the backbone to go against him because of his precieved popularity within Calgary. He isnt the president of Calgary, he has one vote just like everyone else and I dislike him because he is a wannabe NDP without the courage to run under an NDP banner.

MYK

But he is still "the mayor". And like it or not, "the mayor" in any city (not just Bronco and Calgary) is the figure head and an extremely influential figure (one vote or not).

Also, I believe Bronco is a Liberal, not NDP.

[Addick]

Originally Posted by jolinar of malkshor

Thanks.....I didn't realize that.... The fact that it is a holiday has nothing to do with it.....I am not even going to comment on the rest of your post because of this statement....wow

The fact that it is a national holiday has a lot to do with it! Let's go back to what you said:

Originally Posted by jolinar of malkshor

By your argument, why even have Rememberance day???? Lets just send the money to the military families because that would help them more.

Remembrance Day is a day that the Federal government selected to remember all Canadians who died in a war that the nation supported. Therefore, they can do things that can be associated with supporting the war as they had a mandate to. The City of Calgary on the other hand has no such mandate, but they can support the members of the troops. In this case, doing so through financial support is the best method.

[jolinar of malkshor]

Originally Posted by Addick

The fact that it is a national holiday has a lot to do with it! Let's go back to what you said:



Remembrance Day is a day that the Federal government selected to remember all Canadians who died in a war that the nation supported. Therefore, they can do things that can be associated with supporting the war as they had a mandate to. The City of Calgary on the other hand has no such mandate, but they can support the members of the troops. In this case, doing so through financial support is the best method.

Holy cow....

It is not about the holiday and who has the authority to delcare it as such. It was about the suggestion that just showing ones respect by simply waving a flag, having a moment of silence or putting a sticker on your vehcile amounts to nothing as it is laziness.....according to him it isn't even worth doing unless you send money to the families......he says that is way more meaningful. So...if that is way more meaning ful...lets just scrap Remeberance day and send all the money that we use on that event to the families.....that would be much more meaingful to them....

[Burninator]

Originally Posted by jolinar of malkshor

Holy cow....

It is not about the holiday and who has the authority to delcare it as such. It was about the suggestion that just showing ones respect by simply waving a flag, having a moment of silence or putting a sticker on your vehcile amounts to nothing as it is laziness.....according to him it isn't even worth doing unless you send money to the families......he says that is way more meaningful. So...if that is way more meaning ful...lets just scrap Remeberance day and send all the money that we use on that event to the families.....that would be much more meaingful to them....

Quite putting words in my mouth! Do you even read my posts? Or do you just pick out words and invent what I said? Holy christ...it's like talking to a wall. I am done with this thread.

[Agamemnon]

Originally Posted by jolinar of malkshor

Holy cow....

It is not about the holiday and who has the authority to delcare it as such. It was about the suggestion that just showing ones respect by simply waving a flag, having a moment of silence or putting a sticker on your vehcile amounts to nothing as it is laziness.....according to him it isn't even worth doing unless you send money to the families......he says that is way more meaningful. So...if that is way more meaning ful...lets just scrap Remeberance day and send all the money that we use on that event to the families.....that would be much more meaingful to them....

Well, you must think I'm a real freak then, because I honestly believe donating money to veterans associations/soldier's families is WAY more support than a bumper sticker. I know you're tied to the notion that these are all equally respectable forms of support... just an FYI that not everyone agrees. Please, if you're going to respond, skip the condescending emoticons, it sounds like you have half decent points, but then make a jerk out yourself with this roll-eyes crap. Act like an adult and save the emoticons for a less respectable board.