[Rumour] Andersson confirms he turned down a "very good" offer from another team

[Badgers Nose]

My guess is that we get a 2nd a prospect and a conditional pick; another 2nd if Ras signs, a 4th if he does not.

It’s provably that last bit that is the hold up. The ‘just that little bit extra’ that CC likes to get once the offers are all in.

Ras won’t return the 1st or young centre CC covets though.

[getbak]

Originally Posted by Badgers Nose

My guess is that we get a 2nd a prospect and a conditional pick; another 2nd if Ras signs, a 4th if he does not.

You can no longer include conditions on a trade based on the player re-signing with the new team.

[Badgers Nose]

Originally Posted by ForeverFlameFan

It is times like this that I wish conditional picks could be available if a player re-signs with the team. I hate that they took that away. It may skew the value of the player, but at the same time it at least was a safety net for the buyer if the player only played there as a rental.

Gah! Forgot about that!

[Toonage]

So at this point in time can we say it’s more of a Lindholm situation than a Hanifin one?

[Badgers Nose]

If CC can get a Lindholm-like return that would be exceptional work.

[Monahammer]

This focus on future contract is another reason we should have traded him last season. The future contract was not being counted as a key part of his value then, because it couldn't be signed.

[Mr.Coffee]

Q for the masses.

Are you better off asking for 1 quality asset (1st) vs multiple lower quality assets (2nd + prospect)?

Do GMs think this way? I’ve never understood asking for 3-4 assets if it means watering down the quality to get a bunch of long shots that will never make the NHL. Just get the 1 higher quality asset, no?

Presumably GMs aren’t willing to even do that, but I have seen rumours in the past on various trades where a GM (not necessarily Conroy) will say I want X plus Y plus Z and I just don’t understand the thinking there. Maybe more magic beans is better than less but probability wise maybe Calgary was better off getting 1 higher quality asset for Iginla then beans and Hanowski, for example. A guy who never really was going to make it outside of a long shot chance.

[Macho0978]

I would be happy with a prospect that is near the bottom of the top 100 in the league or just outside most lists and a 2nd. Hoping for 2 2nds, but can live with 1.

I would be ok with a lessor prospect to get a 1st, but in the end a late 1st vs a 2nd isn't that much different. Prospects who improve after their draft year, scouts usually have a better idea of how good the player will be when they are 20 vs 18.

[Macindoc]

Originally Posted by Macho0978

You list the Red Wings, Canucks and Kings? That is it. Why is that the list?

Kings - I doubt they are sellers, but if they were Doughty has 1 year after this year remaining. If they sold, would they retain salary to get more for Doughty? I think they would.

Canucks - if they made Hronek available, he would be ahead of Ras by a fair amount. He is 27 and his contract expires when he is 35. Ras likely signs to he is 38 and gets more per year. I'll take Hronek

Red Wings - aren't trading Seider

NYI - why are they not on the list? Pulock and Mayfield might be good adds for cheaper and have better contracts

Seattle - Larsson and Dunn? If they decide to tank, both could be available. Dunn is a lefty, but he can play his offside

Preds - Josi? If they tank will Josi move at some point. He plays both sides

Ducks - Trouba could be a cheap pick up

Pens - Karlsson

Flyers - Risto is almost a UFA

There will be more than Ras available at the deadline. Right now, it seems only Ras is available right now with at least 3-5 teams interested.

It's almost certain that Andersson will be the best D available for 2.275M (with 50% retained). Many of the above are on multi-year contracts and won't have salary retention (except at a very high cost). Maybe Josi or Kerlsson, but how many teams will be able to fit their salaries in, even with retention? Risto is the closest match with Andersson, but only played 2/3 the minutes and only scored 2/3 of the points that Andersson did, at a higher cap hit. Trouba is a straight cap dump, he had just one goal last season; who wants to pay even $4M (at 50% retained) for that?

[Mr.Coffee]

Originally Posted by Macho0978

I would be happy with a prospect that is near the bottom of the top 100 in the league or just outside most lists and a 2nd. Hoping for 2 2nds, but can live with 1.

I would be ok with a lessor prospect to get a 1st, but in the end a late 1st vs a 2nd isn't that much different. Prospects who improve after their draft year, scouts usually have a better idea of how good the player will be when they are 20 vs 18.

Yeah but if you hang onto the deadline you can probably get 1 mid range 1st for a team trying to fight for a playoff spot (subject to Andersson’s list I guess, not knowing what that is).

I think CGY is better off just going for a middle 1st pick like in the 15-22 range kinda thing and #### adding more. Then you have 3 1sts next draft.

I say this because it seems fairly obvious that the ask to this point has been too high for the market of teams he’s willing to go to and I just wonder if that has to do with asking for multiple pieces many of which are likely useless / will never materialize into anything anyway. The real value (probably) is in the 1st where you control the selection.

I say above also because CGY’s drafting under Conroy has been I think one of the best in the NHL so the Flames should lean into and leverage that strength.

[SuperMatt18]

He'd easily return a 1st - especially at $2.275M. He'd get that right now without requiring a new contract from any of the suitors.

I think the problem is Conroy might be looking for more than that, and also looking for more NHL ready pieces...which makes a trade much harder.

[Macho0978]

Originally Posted by Mr.Coffee

Q for the masses.

Are you better off asking for 1 quality asset (1st) vs multiple lower quality assets (2nd + prospect)?

Do GMs think this way? I’ve never understood asking for 3-4 assets if it means watering down the quality to get a bunch of long shots that will never make the NHL. Just get the 1 higher quality asset, no?

Presumably GMs aren’t willing to even do that, but I have seen rumours in the past on various trades where a GM (not necessarily Conroy) will say I want X plus Y plus Z and I just don’t understand the thinking there. Maybe more magic beans is better than less but probability wise maybe Calgary was better off getting 1 higher quality asset for Iginla then beans and Hanowski, for example. A guy who never really was going to make it outside of a long shot chance.

Iginla trade was awful.

IMO Ras for quality assets would have been more likely to happen this draft.

Now, nobody is trading an unprotected 1st in 2026 right now for Ras. Teams that want Ras are more likely to be picking 20-32 OV.

So a 20 year old prospect who is around top 100 in the league and a 2nd is more valuable, unless you think you can get a 1st that ends up in the 11-19 range.

Unprotected 1st in 2027 is a maybe, but only top end teams will consider that.

[Macho0978]

Originally Posted by Mr.Coffee

Yeah but if you hang onto the deadline you can probably get 1 mid range 1st for a team trying to fight for a playoff spot (subject to Andersson’s list I guess, not knowing what that is).

I think CGY is better off just going for a middle 1st pick like in the 15-22 range kinda thing and #### adding more. Then you have 3 1sts next draft.

I agree, Ottawa is a team I would look at. But they don't have their 2026 1st. 2027 top 10 protected could be 11-19 OV. But if it isn't, you took less.

A prospect in the 80-120 range in the league, often these players are former late 1sts. Add a 2nd or 2, IMO that value is more than a late 1st by quite a bit.

I'm ok to roll the dice to try and get a pick in the 11-19 range or an unprotected 1st in 27 though as the Flames have depth and need top end.

[Johnny Makarov]

Originally Posted by Badgers Nose

If CC can get a Lindholm-like return that would be exceptional work.

Teams aren't falling for that 'bait and switch' again! lol

Unless their GM is an idiot.

[midniteowl]

Originally Posted by Johnny Makarov

Teams aren't falling for that 'bait and switch' again! lol

Unless their GM is an idiot.

Mind you, there are still quite a few idiots in the league.

[Wolven]

Originally Posted by Macho0978

You list the Red Wings, Canucks and Kings? That is it. Why is that the list?

Kings - I doubt they are sellers, but if they were Doughty has 1 year after this year remaining. If they sold, would they retain salary to get more for Doughty? I think they would.

Canucks - if they made Hronek available, he would be ahead of Ras by a fair amount. He is 27 and his contract expires when he is 35. Ras likely signs to he is 38 and gets more per year. I'll take Hronek

Red Wings - aren't trading Seider

NYI - why are they not on the list? Pulock and Mayfield might be good adds for cheaper and have better contracts

Seattle - Larsson and Dunn? If they decide to tank, both could be available. Dunn is a lefty, but he can play his offside

Preds - Josi? If they tank will Josi move at some point. He plays both sides

Ducks - Trouba could be a cheap pick up

Pens - Karlsson

Flyers - Risto is almost a UFA

There will be more than Ras available at the deadline. Right now, it seems only Ras is available right now with at least 3-5 teams interested.

To be fair, I've posted my lists and analysis numerous times and most people blow by them or disregard the list because of a generic unknown. Re-typing my same thoughts over and over means I am doing the work while other people are speaking in generic terms and absolutes with no back up. I listed 3 teams to get you started and then said "etc".

Anyway, I am glad that you engaged in a productive way. Thanks.

The Kings may want to move Doughty but his NTC is a 7 team trade list. That limits the market a lot and gives Doughty most of the control.

Canucks - Hronek would be a good target but I doubt the Canucks trade him, especially with his full NMC. They would keep him and move guys like Forbort instead. Also, the Canucks are going to need Hronek even more if Hughes does not stick around.

Red Wings - agreed

NYI
- I do not see the Islanders throwing the season, they were a bubble team that was in the playoff hunt for most of last season and got super fortunate with the draft lottery. All indications are they are going to view last draft as a lucky dip and try to keep going as a playoff team.
- Pulock and Mayfield have full NTCs which will make them impossible to move without their consent. They are also 2-4 years older than Andersson and I would argue that Mayfield isn't comparable to Andersson. Pulock is good but I highly doubt they try and move him.


Seattle
- Seattle wants to win. Their season would really need to be off the rails for them to look at selling.
- Larsson and Dunn - Larsson has a full NTC this season and Dunn has a 16 team NTL. Dunn could play on his off side but CapWages shows he played 100% of last season as a LD. I doubt either of these guys move and my guess would be that Oleksiak (also has a 16 team NTL) is on the market to make room for Evans. However, Oleksiak is not competition for Andersson in the market.

Preds
- Preds are interesting. They obviously thought last year was going to be a good year after bringing in Stamkos and Marchessault. You have to think that Trotz is soul searching to figure out what went wrong and then decide if this team should be blown up or built upon. My guess is that they are building and trying to get to the playoffs.
- Josi only moves if he wants to. Captain of the team and has a full NMC. At 35 he has to be thinking about whether he wants to retire a Pred or chase a cup. He should hit 1000 games with the Preds this season and I expect that he will stay a Pred for this year and next year and look for a trade in his final year if things are not turning around.

Ducks
- Ducks are trying to pull out of their rebuild, they will not want to sell
- Trouba could go to market again. The Rangers just dumped him last season. I do not think he would change the market for Andersson.

Pens
- Pens are definitely looking ready to tank this season and I think they are just waiting for Crosby's decision before they blow it up.
- Karlsson is great (offensively). He is also 7 years older than Andersson and way more expensive. If you are the Stars, do you view Karlsson as a top 4 solution that makes their D group stronger? The +/- people would point out how his -24 is pretty scary compared to his 53 points last season. Also, they cannot fit his cap hit in this season even with full retention.

Flyers
- After the Frost trade I think they are looking to tank this season and can see them selling.
- Ristolainen is interesting but I do not think he lives up to his draft pedigree and he hasn't played top line minutes in 6 years. Andersson has 240 less games played than Ristolainen but is only 9 goals behind.

Overall, I think the market for Andersson will stay very strong and Conroy should stick to his guns for asking price. Either they manage a sign and trade for max value or they make a trade where they assume the extension will occur because of the new team has the CBA leverage (8 year extension vs. 6 year UFA contract). With that in mind Conroy should assume the extension happens and force the other GM to pay up front. Then it is on the other GM to not fumble the opportunity.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Johnny Makarov

Teams aren't falling for that 'bait and switch' again! lol

Unless their GM is an idiot.

Soooo, Edmonton or Vancouver.

[Badgers Nose]

I don’t think retention is as valuable right now.

Also sure that CC has used that lever and it still didn't get him what he was after.

It’s just a bad point in time to be moving this particular asset. It happens sometimes.

[dissentowner]

Originally Posted by Badgers Nose

My guess is that we get a 2nd a prospect and a conditional pick; another 2nd if Ras signs, a 4th if he does not.

It’s provably that last bit that is the hold up. The ‘just that little bit extra’ that CC likes to get once the offers are all in.

Ras won’t return the 1st or young centre CC covets though.

Ras will fetch a 1st. Let's not get all pessimistic just because this taking time. Worse D men have fetched 1sts even as a rental.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Mr.Coffee

Q for the masses.

Are you better off asking for 1 quality asset (1st) vs multiple lower quality assets (2nd + prospect)?

Do GMs think this way? I’ve never understood asking for 3-4 assets if it means watering down the quality to get a bunch of long shots that will never make the NHL. Just get the 1 higher quality asset, no?

Presumably GMs aren’t willing to even do that, but I have seen rumours in the past on various trades where a GM (not necessarily Conroy) will say I want X plus Y plus Z and I just don’t understand the thinking there. Maybe more magic beans is better than less but probability wise maybe Calgary was better off getting 1 higher quality asset for Iginla then beans and Hanowski, for example. A guy who never really was going to make it outside of a long shot chance.

Thing is, if you are not offered 1 high quality asset, you try to make it better by adding longer shots. There were two offers for Iginla, neither were good and he vetoed the slightly better one.

Teams that want Andersson as a rental don't have much to offer as far as high picks go. And neither do longer term options, frankly. The best bet is an Anaheim - a team that's trying to take a big step. And might roll the dice on an unsure extension.