American Politics 4.0 - Orangeyou Glad He’s Back?

[Harry Lime]

UsAid needed an overhaul, but not elimination. Sudan, amongst other similar countries, desperately needed food and water aid, but also did nothing over decades to fix just horribly run governments and education programs.

Instead of using the leverage UsAid provided to institute positive change for Sudan, they just cut it off, resulting in starving children and the same #### government.

Originally Posted by Fuzz

Never forget how Musk celebrated his callous murderous actions.

[Fuzz]

Did UsAid need an overhaul? Where did that analysis come from? I don't think that should be accepted as fact. Maybe it did, but given this is how they downplay what was done, I would have to see that coming from somewhere respectable.

[Plett25]

Originally Posted by Yamer

... he became the most divisive Canadian that ever lived for telling the 5-10% of ignorant loudmouths in the population to knock it off and take your medicine.

Great post Yamer. I was going to respond to Old Dutch, but once I got to your post, you did it better than I could have.

But I have something to expand on this part of your post.

I have a minor health problem (that could turn major) that precipitated from a cancer diagnosis (and subsequent treatment)

I met a RN to discuss the next step, but I just didn't understand the point she was trying to make. She brought in the surgeon to talk to me and he led with "This is not a preference based decision"

I stopped him right there and agreed to the course of action as presented by the RN.

Anyway, IMO, that's a large part of the problem with politics and society these days. There's a pervasive belief that "the customer is always right" which is ironic because a fuller quote is something like "assume the customer is right until it is plainly clear that he is not"

Getting vaccinated during COVID wasn't a preference based decision. In retrospect, even if it wasn't as effective or as safe as reported, according to the evidence at that time, getting vaccinated was the only reasonable course of action. But in a culture where the customer is always right, few people are capable of accepting when their belief has been shown to be plainly wrong.

I believe people are basically good and that everyone wants the world to be a better place. More precisely, they want the world to be better and for their opinions to be right. Unfortunately, when people are forced to choose between a better world and being right, many people can't bring themselves to admit they were wrong.

Similar to the Upton Sinclair quote "It is difficult to get a man to understand something when his salary depends upon his not understanding it." Just replace salary with sense of self or tribal affiliation.

[missdpuck]

I’d never heard anything about USAID needing an overhaul. Granted, I’m not associated in any way, but I’ve never heard any news of vast corruption in the organization, certainly not more than in any other.

I’m sure there have been instances of food /drugs not being distributed as they should. Same thing happens with disaster relief in the US. I remember hearing about bottled water sitting in an airfield to the point it was no longer safe to drink due to the plastic in the heat.

I’m to the point now where I just truly believe the only people they want to survive are their little circle of rich circle jerkers.

If you’re wealthy enough to recover from some natural disaster without any aid, you’re in.
If you’re from a poor Black country, you’re out. Shoulda pulled yourselves up by your own bootstraps.

Oh well, back to sewing.

[Harry Lime]

Sudan had 50 years to build some self sufficientcy in clean water and food supply, create a sustainable education system (the primary building block toward raising quality of life) and institute some kind of birth control and women's health policy.

They used UsAid as a crutch, and it opened the door for radical MAga cuts, like what Elon did. I don't know how you would assign blame, but there are two parties harming a third.

I'm not sure of a media source, but public stats, the eyeball test and passage of time are all right there.

Not excusing Trump and Elon, but this should not be hitting this hard. Its been 40 years since live aid brought the worlds attention to this.

[missdpuck]

Originally Posted by Harry Lime

Sudan had 50 years to build some self sufficientcy in clean water and food supply, create a sustainable education system (the primary building block toward raising quality of life) and institute some kind of birth control and women's health policy.

They used UsAid as a crutch, and it opened the door for radical MAga cuts, like what Elon did. I don't know how you would assign blame, but there are two parties harming a third.

I'm not sure of a media source, but public stats, the eyeball test and passage of time are all right there.

Not excusing Trump and Elon, but this should not be hitting this hard. Its been 40 years since live aid brought the worlds attention to this.

Good point.

Then there is the corruption within the countries themselves, warlords, etc.

[Fuzz]

But that's not a UsAid issue, it's a humanity issue. So you either do your best with aid, intervene politically, or let a huge chunk of humanity suffer and die. Elon and Trump chose the third. The second is rife with challenges, which leaves the first as the only humane option. And remember, this isn't about money. If you think it is, you are greatly mislead.

[puffnstuff]

"The customer is always right, in matters of taste." Is the real quote that last bit always gets cut off

[Engine09]

For every example of USAID funds being misused there are countless examples of lives being saved, this is just an excuse by people who don't care for the less fortunate in other countries. It's worse than not caring, they willingly push misinformation.

The average American believes that foreign aid accounts for 25% of the federal budget, in reality it's less than 1%. People who supported getting rid of USAID are under the assumption the saved money will vastly improve their own lives, when that doesn't happen in the least I wonder if they'll even think of the amount of deaths that program could have saved.

[indes]

Originally Posted by Engine09

For every example of USAID funds being misused there are countless examples of lives being saved, this is just an excuse by people who don't care for the less fortunate in other countries. It's worse than not caring, they willingly push misinformation.

The average American believes that foreign aid accounts for 25% of the federal budget, in reality it's less than 1%. People who supported getting rid of USAID are under the assumption the saved money will vastly improve their own lives, when that doesn't happen in the least I wonder if they'll even think of the amount of deaths that program could have saved.

Definitely not.

[Ped]

If they're not rich white american lives they don't give a ####

[#-3]

USaid wasn't a humanitarian program, it was a defense program. The US built an entire world order on ensuring problems remained simmering below the surface of public attention, making sure there wouldn't be the desperation for mass movements against them. Ripping out apart the way they have undermines the true core purpose of the program, which is to make people's lives better so they don't create defense problems.

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by #-3

USaid wasn't a humanitarian program, it was a defense program. The US built an entire world order on ensuring problems remained simmering below the surface of public attention, making sure there wouldn't be the desperation for mass movements against them. Ripping out apart the way they have undermines the true core purpose of the program, which is to make people's lives better so they don't create defense problems.

Yeah, it's more of a tool to project power and influence rather than a display of altruism. You project power by either being feared or loved.

There is a reason why countries put their name and symbols on all those big boxes of food and medicine and why it's better for you to do it than your adversaries. Or how when you build schools in a foreign country, you also get to influence the curriculum and therefore influence how people view your nation (and your adversaries). The fact some people get fed, healed, and educated is great, but it was never the main purpose of those programs.

[Mathgod]

Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction

Yeah, it's more of a tool to project power and influence rather than a display of altruism. You project power by either being feared or loved.

There is a reason why countries put their name and symbols on all those big boxes of food and medicine and why it's better for you to do it than your adversaries. Or how when you build schools in a foreign country, you also get to influence the curriculum and therefore influence how people view your nation (and your adversaries). The fact some people get fed, healed, and educated is great, but it was never the main purpose of those programs.

Ok, so now that the people of these countries are going to be fed Russian/Chinese propaganda instead of being taught western liberal values, can we agree that the outcomes are likely to be disastrous?

[Itse]

Originally Posted by Mathgod

Ok, so now that the people of these countries are going to be fed Russian/Chinese propaganda instead of being taught western liberal values, can we agree that the outcomes are likely to be disastrous?

Okay first of all, teaching other countries "our values" is extremely texbook propaganda. Also, the West has for the most part been a terrible influence on everyone.

Russia has no real values, but China... I'm genuinely not sure if increased Chinese influence will make the world better or worse. At least they seem a lot more serious about green energy.

It is extremely dumb for Trump to dismantle the empire, but that empire currently sucks extremely bad.

In any case, I'll likely live to see this question answered.

[Senator Clay Davis]

I don't actually expect much more than a temporary bucking from the cult, but this is also the biggest betrayal so far so maybe this will send more people to the America Party now. But with Trump obviously heavily involved with Epstein, this was always how it was going to end.

https://twitter.com/user/status/1942023706328420837

[Fuzz]

Epstein was actually a real stand up guy. Dedicated his life to bringing children out of poverty to be so close to wealth. Threw some banger parties, too. History had him all wrong.

[missdpuck]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

Epstein was actually a real stand up guy. Dedicated his life to bringing children out of poverty to be so close to wealth. Threw some banger parties, too. History had him all wrong.

Like all pimps he was just misunderstood.

And yeah I know, he was worse…

[Yamer]

They shouldn't have killed him, then.

[SutterBrother]

Given that we live in Bizarro world, probably safe to take the above as the exact opposite of what reality is.