Hart, McLeod, Dube, Foote, Formenton charged with sexual assault

[Yamer]

Originally Posted by OptimalTates

Lol. this whole mess started because someone wanted to do a driveby against the Oilers for a joke but saying lol is wrong. They don't have to release a public statement. They didn't with Kylington. They didn't need to with Dube. It was a choice. One I, and others, disagreed with.

It actually started here, when for some strange reason you decided to go to bat for the Oilers:

Originally Posted by OptimalTates

Meanwhile the Flames are just hoping they get through this difficult time on their mental health.

Glass houses bro.

[taxbuster]

Originally Posted by OptimalTates

Good thing about laws is they are available for review. Where is it stated that you have to provide a specific message for an alleged rapist about to be charged? No, the Flames did not have to make a public statement.

Lawsuits against errant employers say that.
Courts say that in those cases.
Why? Because privacy laws (among others) say that.
That's where.



Give up while you're behind.

[OptimalTates]

Originally Posted by taxbuster

Lawsuits against errant employers say that.
Courts say that in those cases.
Why? Because privacy laws (among others) say that.
That's where.



Give up while you're behind.

What? You're saying privacy laws force someone to disclose private information? It's the opposite.

"Dube is on leave from the team. No further comment."

Again, multiple posters on this site had heard the "rumours" he was being named prior the Flames releasing the statement. And it was obvious when Dube's agent was threatening to sue anyone who alleged wrongdoing took place years earlier. The Flames should have not brought up mental health or anything with Dube. Grant his leave, give him his cheque, and let him #### off.

[taxbuster]

Originally Posted by OptimalTates

What? You're saying privacy laws force someone to disclose private information? It's the opposite.

Just stop. You've degraded this thread into idiocy.

[OptimalTates]

Originally Posted by taxbuster

Just stop. You've degraded this thread into idiocy.

Yeah cause we're now saying the Flames were legally obligated to say he had mental health issues. I will agree with you on the idiocy there lol.

What do you think the legal ramifications would have been if the Flames released this statement:

"Dube is on leave from the team. No further comment."

Or none at all?

Yamer, this is what I mean by criticizing the Flames handling. You have fans who make up laws to avoid it.

[dissentowner]

Originally Posted by Yamer

It actually started here, when for some strange reason you decided to go to bat for the Oilers:

If this guy isn't an Oilers fan I am Vanna White. There sure are a lot of sheep in wolves clothing on here.

[Calgary4LIfe]

Originally Posted by OptimalTates

Yeah cause we're now saying the Flames were legally obligated to say he had mental health issues. I will agree with you on the idiocy there lol.

What do you think the legal ramifications would have been if the Flames released this statement:

"Dube is on leave from the team. No further comment."

Or none at all?

Yamer, this is what I mean by criticizing the Flames handling. You have fans who make up laws to avoid it.

The Calgary Flames have an experienced legal department and an experienced PR team. Do you really believe that they would expose themselves in this manner if they knew that charges were imminent, but chose to show support for Dube and disclosing his leave to be mental health issues? That doesn't really align with anything plausible to me.


You aren't interested in plausible, it seems. You are more interested in your own personal story-line that you have created. You are assuming a number of things, while completely disregarding a number of things to arrive at the conclusion here. It just doesn't add-up.



There is absolutely no way that the legal team or the PR team would have made that statement had they known. Plus, you are also assuming that the Flames knew for sure that Dube was in the room to begin with, and/or was involved in wrongdoing. How were they to know? If they did know, when was the appropriate time to LEGALLY cut bait? You are working off of assumptions and nothing more.


What we do know is that, from the Flame's standpoint, they legally cut bait with him at the first point in time after Dube was charged. I bet that they didn't know the details of this case until they became disclosed during the trial, which was after. That's the most plausible line of thinking.

[OptimalTates]

We're in a thread where a player sent a text to his team of two weeks about having a threesome with a woman and half the team showed up. There's a problem with hockey culture. It's not a single team. And certainly the team that acquired Gilmour and Huselius months after they were alleged to have been rapists isn't a team with any moral high ground - there isn't one. As long as we defend them and give them money they won't change. They have no reason to because they don't have morals.

So call me an Oiler fans for disagreeing with the Flames handling of the Dube situation. But then don't ask why hockey culture isn't changing.

[CliffFletcher]

The Flames had to state that Dube was leaving for mental health reasons to cover their ass legally - it wasn’t their place to determine his mental condition. And the fact they probably knew he was a prime participant in the incident changes nothing.

You may have felt deceived because for a few weeks you felt sympathy for someone you later learned was an accused rapist. But mental health has nothing to do with whether people are sympathetic or not. A drunk driver can suffer anxiety or depression severe enough that they can’t work, just the same as the family member of someone killed by that drunk driver. It’s an assessment of someone’s mental capacity, not their moral worthiness.

[Scroopy Noopers]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

The Flames had to state that Dube was leaving for mental health reasons to cover their ass legally - it wasn’t their place to determine his mental condition. And the fact they probably knew he was a prime participant in the incident changes nothing.

You may have felt deceived because for a few weeks you felt sympathy for someone you later learned was an accused rapist. But mental health has nothing to do with whether people are sympathetic or not. A drunk driver can suffer anxiety or depression severe enough that they can’t work, just the same as the family member of someone killed by that drunk driver. It’s an assessment of someone’s mental capacity, not their moral worthiness.

This is all it is. People feel slighted because they felt sympathy.

[Jiri Hrdina]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

The Flames had to state that Dube was leaving for mental health reasons to cover their ass legally - it wasn’t their place to determine his mental condition. And the fact they probably knew he was a prime participant in the incident changes nothing.

You may have felt deceived because for a few weeks you felt sympathy for someone you later learned was an accused rapist. But mental health has nothing to do with whether people are sympathetic or not. A drunk driver can suffer anxiety or depression severe enough that they can’t work, just the same as the family member of someone killed by that drunk driver. It’s an assessment of someone’s mental capacity, not their moral worthiness.

Very well said.

[Jiri Hrdina]

Originally Posted by OptimalTates

We're in a thread where a player sent a text to his team of two weeks about having a threesome with a woman and half the team showed up. There's a problem with hockey culture. It's not a single team. And certainly the team that acquired Gilmour and Huselius months after they were alleged to have been rapists isn't a team with any moral high ground - there isn't one. As long as we defend them and give them money they won't change. They have no reason to because they don't have morals.

So call me an Oiler fans for disagreeing with the Flames handling of the Dube situation. But then don't ask why hockey culture isn't changing.

I'm all for a bigger conversation about hockey culture. But your blame in this case is miss-placed.

[Locke]

What the hell happened in here??

[WhiteTiger]

Originally Posted by Locke

What the hell happened in here??

Somone picked one hell of a hill to die on in an inappropriate thread instead of necro'ing any of the old threads this was hashed to death in.

[Locke]

Originally Posted by WhiteTiger

Somone picked one hell of a hill to die on in an inappropriate thread instead of necro'ing any of the old threads this was hashed to death in.

I wasn't expecting anything because the verdict isnt going to rendered for a month or something and then I'm pages behind and then....it just started sledding downhill.

[taxbuster]

Originally Posted by Locke

I wasn't expecting anything because the verdict isnt going to rendered for a month or something and then I'm pages behind and then....it just started sledding downhill.

This is what happens when someone hijacks a discussion thread and devolves into the lunatic conspiracy theory world I guess.

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by Locke

What the hell happened in here??

The Oilers lost last night so one of their fans had to come here to release their NG rage on the Flames.

[Macindoc]

If Dube didn’t tell police the truth about this incident, why would anyone think that he told the Flames the truth? Given that everyone frim Hockey Canada who was aware of this was trying to cover it up, the most likely scenario is that Dube told the team he had to be off for mental health reasons.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by taxbuster

He was NOT "accused" at the time, nor did anybody have any concrete evidence that he was "involved". Yes...he (allegedly AT THE TIME) was "present" at the hotel room...but he was NOT named publicly as an "accused" person until the London Police filed charges.

In 2018 there was an investigation into a variety of unnamed players NONE OF WHOM were charged at the time. Some time later Hockey Canada paid a settlement under terms that WERE NOT DISCLOSED PUBLICLY. So...until the charges were filed against the five, there was NO public "accusation".




You can't just make crap up to suit your case.

IIRC the players didn't even know about the settlement.

[Locke]

Originally Posted by taxbuster

This is what happens when someone hijacks a discussion thread and devolves into the lunatic conspiracy theory world I guess.

Hey, I'm all for a good lunatic conspiracy theory, some of those are really entertaining, but this though?