Hart, McLeod, Dube, Foote, Formenton charged with sexual assault

[Paulie Walnuts]

Yeah but most consensual acts our between 2 people. This is much different these guys saw a vulnerable girl and thought it was a free for all and they could do what they wanted.

Why the video of her after? Why set up the group text so everyone gets their story straight?

You don’t walk around slapping someone’s ass.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by GullFoss

I'm always curious as to who reads those walls of text

For the people who seem to be afraid of a 'wall of text', I always wonder... have you ever read a book? Have you ever read anything? How did you get through school?

Seriously, you should try this reading thing - sometimes you actually learn stuff, and it is often entertaining, and sometimes informative.

[Amethyst]

Originally Posted by Hackey

Exactly. No one is asking for consent for each action. That's just weird.

Why? If it's someone you regularly have sex with, you probably don't, because you already know these things.

Just because someone agrees to have sex, doesn't mean you can do whatever you want to them.

If it's weird to make sure the person you are having sex with wants to do the things you are doing, you should not be having sex with other people.

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by Locke

I dont like the use of AI in a lot of Professional settings, largely because I dont trust it, but also because the grunt work involved in completing these tasks is a huge element in training up-and-coming Professionals.

If you dont train people in these skills you're putting a lot of trust in that AI algorithm and you're going to have an upcoming generation of 'Professionals' who dont have the require skills to determine if something is or isn't right because they never acquired those skills and experiences because it was automated and done for them.

Getting your hands into the much and doing the dirty work? Thats how you learn. It sucks, but thats life.

This ship has sailed for the most part. Look at most professional services firms and the work of new college grads is being offshored more than ever before. That is some of the work that is now being replaced by AI. Fortunately the global economy has grown at such a rapid pace that it is not affecting employment.

I don’t believe in the extreme outcomes and don’t see AI as replacing humans in knowledge work. But it is changing the nature of such work and making workers far more efficient. Human in the loop AI is a powerful productivity tool that is growing exponentially.

I could replace “AI” with the word “computer” and written your post 40 years ago. People get smarter and the smartest and most nimble learn how to leverage all the tools available to do things faster and make huge leaps of progress.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Amethyst

Why? If it's someone you regularly have sex with, you probably don't, because you already know these things.

Just because someone agrees to have sex, doesn't mean you can do whatever you want to them.

If it's weird to make sure the person you are having sex with wants to do the things you are doing, you should not be having sex with other people.

Yeah, and especially if something actually physically hurts. Who just assumes someone wants to be slapped? Or would like it?

No matter how this turns out legally, I think these guys had a distorted view of sex.

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

For the people who seem to be afraid of a 'wall of text', I always wonder... have you ever read a book? Have you ever read anything? How did you get through school?

Seriously, you should try this reading thing - sometimes you actually learn stuff, and it is often entertaining, and sometimes informative.

I'm taking zero offence, but my perceived ADHD makes a really long paragraph tough to read.

Almost defeats me.

Shorten up the paragraphs and I can rip through almost anything.

[fotze2]

Originally Posted by Bingo

I'm taking zero offence, but my perceived ADHD makes a really long paragraph tough to read.

Almost defeats me.

Shorten up the paragraphs and I can rip through almost anything.

It is a daunting task but depends on the poster. Itse i will do it and come out better for having read it. Finnish guy who is more eloquent than I and 95% of the posters here somehow fascinates me. Some walls o text, not a chance.

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

Yeah, and especially if something actually physically hurts. Who just assumes someone wants to be slapped? Or would like it?

No matter how this turns out legally, I think these guys had a distorted view of sex.

And, the thing most people trying to make that clumsy point about consent are totally forgetting: especially if that person is a stranger who you just met.

If people think it’s “weird” to go around smacking to hurt, choking, or otherwise being rough with their partners (and especially strangers during their first encounter) and asking for consent before they do, then I’m sorry, those people have some very distorted, concerning views on sex and consent and are probably not good people.

[Bingo]

Yeah I think you can be as kinky as you want to be, but you'd better make sure the other person is on the same page.

It's been a long running movie/tv/meme, but don't they establish safe words for things like this?

No safe word for someone you don't know. But her saying stop pretty much achieves the same thing.

[Paulie Walnuts]

Originally Posted by Bingo

Yeah I think you can be as kinky as you want to be, but you'd better make sure the other person is on the same page.

It's been a long running movie/tv/meme, but don't they establish safe words for things like this?

No safe word for someone you don't know. But her saying stop pretty much achieves the same thing.

That why the BDSM community has their own rules and safe words as you said. A total stranger is not going to know anything about that.

A baseball player had this happen, the lady consented to the sex but not to get choked and spanked and stuff.

[Jason14h]

Originally Posted by Paulie Walnuts

That why the BDSM community has their own rules and safe words as you said. A total stranger is not going to know anything about that.

A baseball player had this happen, the lady consented to the sex but not to get choked and spanked and stuff.

Not exactly - 2 different cases with him and both have serious issues with false acquisitions and blackmail

https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2024/04/23/s...rged-fraud-spt

https://www.latimes.com/sports/story...4/trevor-bauer


And you wonder why athletes would get consent videos after

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by Bingo

I'm taking zero offence, but my perceived ADHD makes a really long paragraph tough to read.

Almost defeats me.

Shorten up the paragraphs and I can rip through almost anything.

LOL, fair enough.

[Matt Reeeeead]

Originally Posted by Whynotnow

When you’ve just met the girl and you’ve brought a room full of strong, drunk, young men who are complete strangers and now it’s turned into something far different than a one night stand you might want to be a bit cautious.

It’s stunning to me none of these clowns had the moxie to stand up and say guys this needs to stop, wrap her up in a blanket and protect her.

I don't really know how anyone could read past this post and defend these guys.

This is a really concise and reasonable view of what transpired here.

Mikey had a vulnerable girl and saw opportunity to take advantage of the situation. A number of his teammates jumped at the opportunity without knowing her or checking in on her comfort level in a trustworthy way. A bunch of other guys were around but didn't think to stand up in any credible way.

Who in any kind of ethical, legal way acts this way towards other people? I would say criminals, and immature people that want to pump their own ego and make social headway in a toxic group of people.

[InternationalVillager]

Originally Posted by MBates

This is the type of ruling that can be the subject of a prosecution appeal and could lead to an order for a new trial in the event of an acquittal.

How does this relate to double jeopardy? What would need to be the scenario in which that gets bypassed?

[Monahammer]

Originally Posted by Matt Reeeeead

I don't really know how anyone could read past this post and defend these guys.

This is a really concise and reasonable view of what transpired here.

Mikey had a vulnerable girl and saw opportunity to take advantage of the situation. A number of his teammates jumped at the opportunity without knowing her or checking in on her comfort level in a trustworthy way. A bunch of other guys were around but didn't think to stand up in any credible way.

Who in any kind of ethical, legal way acts this way towards other people? I would say criminals, and immature people that want to pump their own ego and make social headway in a toxic group of people.

Sorry, I strongly disagree. Society today is rife with examples of exactly this. We even have a term for it: The bystander effect. https://www.psychologytoday.com/ca/b...stander-effect


It happens pretty frequently, you see videos of people getting assaulted in broad daylight and most people just continue walking by (though some of course will stop to video tape it.) Very few offer any assistance to victims while incidents occur.

[Dan403]

Originally Posted by Paulie Walnuts

That why the BDSM community has their own rules and safe words as you said. A total stranger is not going to know anything about that.

Most just use a Red Light / Yellow Light / Green Light system.

The top checks in frequently and the bottom gives a signal.

Stop / Proceed with Caution / All is good.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by InternationalVillager

How does this relate to double jeopardy? What would need to be the scenario in which that gets bypassed?

Double jeopardy doesn't apply to an appeal. It's if you get tried for the same crime in a brand new proceeding.

[blankall]

Originally Posted by Amethyst

Why? If it's someone you regularly have sex with, you probably don't, because you already know these things.

Just because someone agrees to have sex, doesn't mean you can do whatever you want to them.

If it's weird to make sure the person you are having sex with wants to do the things you are doing, you should not be having sex with other people.

I do think you should be getting consent between major steps, for example, between oral and penetration.

However, no one asks for consent for every action. How would you even go about that? Where does one act end and another begin?

There is, however, an implied set of "normal" activities. If you're doing anything extreme or outside of the norm, for example, using toys or hitting someone you should ask for consent. Most people aren't going to ask for consent, for example, between sexual positions. Generally, inviting your buddies into the room to participate is very far outside of the realm of normal activities and 100% an act that would require additional consent ahead of time.

Also, you should be in tune with your sexual partner and give them enough space to be able to say no at any time, as initial consent doesn't mean ongoing consent. You also shouldn't be putting people in situations where they are too afraid, pressured or intoxicated to say no.

[Wormius]

Originally Posted by blankall

I do think you should be getting consent between major steps, for example, between oral and penetration.

However, no one asks for consent for every action. How would you even go about that? Where does one act end and another begin?

There is, however, an implied set of "normal" activities. If you're doing anything extreme or outside of the norm, for example, using toys or hitting someone you should ask for consent. Most people aren't going to ask for consent, for example, between sexual positions. Generally, inviting your buddies into the room to participate is very far outside of the realm of normal activities and 100% an act that would require additional consent ahead of time.

Also, you should be in tune with your sexual partner and give them enough space to be able to say no at any time, as initial consent doesn't mean ongoing consent. You also shouldn't be putting people in situations where they are too afraid, pressured or intoxicated to say no.

Essentially this. If your partner suddenly doesn’t seem into whatever you’re doing, I feel like this obvious just from the change in body language, becoming tense, no emotion. Unless you’re really unable to get a read on people, this is when you should back up and reevaluate everything going on.

[blankall]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

But in practice, it’s not really, is it? I’d be surprised if more than a fraction of the sexual ass-smacking that will place in Canada today has consent provided.

If you were to ask a woman for consent before sexual ass-smacking, she'd probably get up and leave immediately.

The issue with Dube, potentially, was that he was doing it in a way designed to hurt, and he didn't have consent for the intercourse in the the first place.