Throw Down who is the worst Flames GM of all time

[SuperMatt18]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

I can kinda give Sutter a pass for Stralman, as he passed through a few teams’ hands before he established himself in Tampa.

But there’s no excuse for Lydman. Dealing him for a 3rd round pick, when he was already an established 2nd pairing d-man, and went on to be a really good #3D for 10 more years, was just inexplicable. One of the most under-recognized bad trades in the team’s history.

I think you’re absolutely right that Sutter had a very narrow definition of what he wanted in players, and that caused him to really over/under value a lot of guys and make bad deals.

Didn't he trade Lydman because he wanted to sign Hamrlik and it was cap constraints...maybe I'm forgetting.

He also let Conroy walk coming off of 03-04 but replaced him with Langkow which ended up probably being a positive and a bit of a walk.

I always wonder if there is no lockout and the Flames could have kept that 03-04 team together a little longer without salary cap implications.

[Jiri Hrdina]

Originally Posted by InternationalVillager

Button also traded away JS Giguere....

He lost 3 all stars for this franchise. Giguere seems to be forgotten because we ended up landing into Kipper.

All 3 of these players won the Cup i believe.

Imagine a line of MSL-Savard-Iginla......

Yup. And Giguere was another guy that Coates acquired.
Button undid a lot of the good work Coates did.

Not that it was all perfect. Coates had some blunders too:

https://www.nhltradetracker.com/user...l_Coates/163/2

But his bad moves don't stand out the same way. And most of his bad moves were ones where he was being forced to trade the player:
- Gary Roberts wasn't going to come back and play here
- Bob Reichel needed to go

Returns on those aren't great, but the Roberts deal looks way better if the Flames hang on to a future #1 goalie with J.S.

But his worst deals just aren't that bad. And he's got some really good ones on the other end.

Which is why I think he's probably my #2 GM.

[Jiri Hrdina]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

Didn't he trade Lydman because he wanted to sign Hamrlik and it was cap constraints...maybe I'm forgetting.

He also let Conroy walk coming off of 03-04 but replaced him with Langkow which ended up probably being a positive and a bit of a walk.

I always wonder if there is no lockout and the Flames could have kept that 03-04 team together a little longer without salary cap implications.

Maybe that was a factor but he was also pissed off the Lydman was hurt and didn't think he was tough enough.

[CaptainYooh]

The thread title should have been “who’s the 2nd worst GM”, because there is really no contest for THE worst.

For that, I think Jay Feaster: in his short 3-drafts time here, was awful. Trading Iginla and Boumeester was handled badly, was not needed and not called for (both players wanted to stay here). Drafting Baertshi, Jankowski, Poirier and Klimchuk in the three first rounds was absolutely atrocious. Yes, he lucked out with Johnny and, arguably, with Monahan (although, there were much better players drawn after Monahan - Ristolainen, Morissey, Horvat, Theodore). Just hate Feaster’s tenure here.

[Sainters7]

Originally Posted by the-rasta-masta

It's got to be Button for me. The Savard trade was a head scratcher the minute it was made, and was worse when Gilbert was fired almost immediately afterwards. It made no sense given the coach/player relationship was the reason Savard was traded. (Savard was traded Nov 15 and Gilbert fired Dec 3).



You then compound that with trading Giguere so that they could protect Fred Brathwaite in an expansion draft, and buying out Martin St Louis' contract. I was young and wasn't really able to provide my own opinion on a player's skill and potential at the time, but I know my Dad was livid when they let St Louis go.



Signing Turek to a large contract after a 20 game stint was also shortsighted but not the worst. Turek ended up restructuring his contract a few years later to help the team out.

Yep exactly. Wild they went to the Stanley Cup Final 1-2 years after jettisoning all that talent, no thanks to him.

He actually works out at my gym, I see him semi-regularly. I'll never say anything obviously, but I've fantasized about screaming at him about it before...

[Jiri Hrdina]

Originally Posted by CaptainYooh

The thread title should have been “who’s the 2nd worst GM”, because there is really no contest for THE worst.

For that, I think Jay Feaster: in his short 3-drafts time here, was awful. Trading Iginla and Boumeester was handled badly, was not needed and not called for (both players wanted to stay here). Drafting Baertshi, Jankowski, Poirier and Klimchuk in the three first rounds was absolutely atrocious. Yes, he lucked out with Johnny and, arguably, with Monahan (although, there were much better players drawn after Monahan - Ristolainen, Morissey, Horvat, Theodore). Just hate Feaster’s tenure here.

Wait what?

[The Original FFIV]

Originally Posted by Jiri Hrdina

Yup. And Giguere was another guy that Coates acquired.
Button undid a lot of the good work Coates did.

Not that it was all perfect. Coates had some blunders too:

https://www.nhltradetracker.com/user...l_Coates/163/2

But his bad moves don't stand out the same way. And most of his bad moves were ones where he was being forced to trade the player:
- Gary Roberts wasn't going to come back and play here
- Bob Reichel needed to go

Returns on those aren't great, but the Roberts deal looks way better if the Flames hang on to a future #1 goalie with J.S.

But his worst deals just aren't that bad. And he's got some really good ones on the other end.

Which is why I think he's probably my #2 GM.

Coates was in an impossible situation. Clean up the mess left by Riser and dealing with a weak Canadian dollar which hurt payroll, all while trying to restock the cupboards.

I'm a Coates fan, no mistaking. He did some head scratching things, like trading German Titov for Ken Wreggett. And I remember yelling at the TV "Trade the pick" when we drafted Derek Morris from out of nowhere, when it would have appeared to make sense to move down and acquire more picks as it was an off the board selection.

He did some nice work while dealing with the 3rd lowest payroll in the league (which oddly enough went up after he was fired IIRC - read into that what you will). Compared to the other major blunders others did, he's cemented as a solid #2 next to the silver fox. Hopefully Conny is able to work himself into the mix, and based on the results, he's climbing the ladder.

[CaptainYooh]

Originally Posted by Jiri Hrdina

Wait what?

I know. 😊 But I like Ristolainen. I think he could have done very well here.

[the-rasta-masta]

Originally Posted by Sainters7

Yep exactly. Wild they went to the Stanley Cup Final 1-2 years after jettisoning all that talent, no thanks to him.

He actually works out at my gym, I see him semi-regularly. I'll never say anything obviously, but I've fantasized about screaming at him about it before...

I think you could also argue that the Stillman for Conroy trade wasn’t great. It looks not bad in hindsight, because Conroy gelled with Iginla, was a fan favorite and is now our GM.

However, Stillman playing for the lightning also helped them beat us for the cup, and also indirectly led to potentially Button seeing Conroy’s success with Iggy jettisoning Savard. You never know if maybe it was Savard that took off with Iggy in that 2001 season if maybe it avoids the Savard trade altogether. I’d say Stillman stayed productive in the league longer than Conroy did and you could say that button trading Stillman and buying out St. Louis really helped the lightning beat us in 2004.

[Ba'alzamon]

Originally Posted by Paulie Walnuts

[Sutter] didn't trade for Conroy.

Yes he did. When the Flames reacquired Conroy in 2007 for Lundmark and two picks.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by CaptainYooh

The thread title should have been “who’s the 2nd worst GM”, because there is really no contest for THE worst.

For that, I think Jay Feaster: in his short 3-drafts time here, was awful. Trading Iginla and Boumeester was handled badly, was not needed and not called for (both players wanted to stay here). Drafting Baertshi, Jankowski, Poirier and Klimchuk in the three first rounds was absolutely atrocious. Yes, he lucked out with Johnny and, arguably, with Monahan (although, there were much better players drawn after Monahan - Ristolainen, Morissey, Horvat, Theodore). Just hate Feaster’s tenure here.

I agree with most of that but he did have to trade Iginla - he was absolutely going cup-hunting. But he allowed Iginla to dictate the return, and muffed the draft picks he got for Iggy and Jaybo.

You forgot the O'Reilly fiasco.

[Locke]

I dont know who I would elect but I gotta say...

The fact that there are so many candidates and such tight competition is more than slightly depressing...

[YyjFlames]

Originally Posted by CaptainYooh

The thread title should have been “who’s the 2nd worst GM”, because there is really no contest for THE worst.

For that, I think Jay Feaster: in his short 3-drafts time here, was awful. Trading Iginla and Boumeester was handled badly, was not needed and not called for (both players wanted to stay here). Drafting Baertshi, Jankowski, Poirier and Klimchuk in the three first rounds was absolutely atrocious. Yes, he lucked out with Johnny and, arguably, with Monahan (although, there were much better players drawn after Monahan - Ristolainen, Morissey, Horvat, Theodore). Just hate Feaster’s tenure here.

Jay was underqualified to be a GM, but he seemed to allow his departments to do their jobs, which was a refreshing change from how Sutter ran that side of things.

Saw this shift especially with the scouting department, as their 2011, 12 and 13 drafts had a bunch of high potential upside picks--even with Jankowski (who turned out comparatively well for that draft)--and it was the first time in a long time the Flames' prospects got me excited.

Generally, I don't mind him because he turned the page on the previous regime, but he wasn't ever going to be a great GM.

[Flamesfan05]

Risebrough was a warrior and well loved on the ice

As a GM , only Milbury was in the same league. I can’t even remember one single good move. A complete idiot.

Button is next , just slightly below. Total Incompetent

Treliving did some good things but the end product is still garbage and left a mess

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by YyjFlames

Jay was underqualified to be a GM, but he seemed to allow his departments to do their jobs, which was a refreshing change from how Sutter ran that side of things.

Saw this shift especially with the scouting department, as their 2011, 12 and 13 drafts had a bunch of high potential upside picks--even with Jankowski (who turned out comparatively well for that draft)--and it was the first time in a long time the Flames' prospects got me excited.

Generally, I don't mind him because he turned the page on the previous regime, but he wasn't ever going to be a great GM.

Jankowski turned out OK for where he was drafted. The better players who were taken behind him were real dark horses like Lindell or Stephenson. The issue is that the Flames traded down and got him, and missed out on very obvious picks Vasilevsky, Teravainen, Hertl and Wilson. hell, even if they took Scott Laughton it would have been better.

[CaptainYooh]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

I agree with most of that but he did have to trade Iginla - he was absolutely going cup-hunting. But he allowed Iginla to dictate the return, and muffed the draft picks he got for Iggy and Jaybo.

You forgot the O'Reilly fiasco.

Well, O’Reilly’s thing was just dumb, like most offer sheets, but it didn’t really hurt the Flames roster; so no harm no foul; just idiotic. But you’re wrong about Iginla. He was visibly shaken answering reporters’ questions and at some point said “I did not ask, I was asked. You want to play where you’re wanted.” So, yeah, this was on Feaster.

[Hackey]

Feaster. Guy had no business managing an NHL team.

[LIP MAN]

Originally Posted by Sainters7

Yep exactly. Wild they went to the Stanley Cup Final 1-2 years after jettisoning all that talent, no thanks to him.

He actually works out at my gym, I see him semi-regularly. I'll never say anything obviously, but I've fantasized about screaming at him about it before...

We go to the same gym. He’s a nice enough guy and man does he rock that elipicical hahah

[Dion]

Originally Posted by blankall

So many bad ones......

The Flames have had glorious luck with drafting pure superstars, but then GMs ravish the team with awful moves.

Looks at things since 1989. The team was torn apart. Then the team somehow gets Brett Hull in the fold....but he's gone. Even with the horrendous handling post 1989, the team could have recovered again with Fleury and Hull both on the team

Not so fast....... The Trade helped the Flames win the Cup and Fletcher knew what he was giving up.

“The trade gives us a chance to run at the Stanley Cup,” Flames president and general manager Cliff Fletcher said. “We felt that at this stage of the season, and in the 16 years the Flames have been in the league, this is the most legitimate we’ve been as far as having an even chance with the other good teams in the league. We decided the calculated risk was worth it.”

Fletcher’s gamble was in moving Hull, son of Hall-of-Famer Bobby Hull. The 23-year-old right winger is third in rookie scoring with 26 goals and 24 assists in 52 games and has been pegged as a future 50-goal scorer.

“We were cognizant of the risk,” Fletcher said. “Hull is going to score a lot of goals in the NHL”

https://flamesnation.ca/news/flames-...oys-the-flames

[Dion]

Originally Posted by InternationalVillager

Button also traded away JS Giguere....

He lost 3 all stars for this franchise. Giguere seems to be forgotten because we ended up landing into Kipper.

All 3 of these players won the Cup i believe.

Imagine a line of MSL-Savard-Iginla......

IIRC Giguere had a rare gastric condition that made his body difficult to absorb water. I suspect it had a hand in his trade to Anaheim

Jean-Sébastien Giguère almost had his NHL career ended in the AHL in 1997-98.

In a game with the Saint John Flames, Giguère sweated off more than 12 pounds, became violently ill and was taken to hospital. Calgary Flames physicians later discovered Giguère suffered from a rare gastric condition that made it difficult for his body to absorb water.

During the NHL season, Giguère has said he drinks as many as 10 bottles of Gatorade a day. Sometimes, in multiple overtime games, it's tough keeping up with the players' insatiable intake.

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/spor...rticle4316310/

How Anaheim treated the condition

Due to a gastric condition that caused Giguere to become more dehydrated, team training staff took to keeping an IV hooked up to Giguere - during game play.

“It’s a line and you hook up the bag to it,” he said. “You see that at the hospital. But it takes a while to poke your vein and make sure to get the needle in and all that stuff. Instead of doing it every period, we just left it in. We just taped it on my arm. I would come in after the period and the bag would be ready. All you would have to do is connect the bag to the line. That’s how it was. We’d pour a bag in and it was very refreshing.

https://www.hockeyfeed.com/nhl-news/...y-cup-playoffs