Canadian Federal Politics Thread v5

[Point Blank]

Originally Posted by Titan2

Very interesting. Shows how dumb they are. This is working for now, and since nothing ever changes it should be fine forever.

What is your sister doing now?

She’s a private contractor. One of the companies that she’s working for is a startup media company that focuses on basic economics. She describes the company as what conservatism used to be before populism took over, without all the culture war and misinformed bs that it is now.

She’s a big believer of the free market and said she didn’t have a party that aligned with her when Trudeau was PM, but that’s changed since Carney took over.

[Codes]

Originally Posted by Mr.Coffee

I’m not super well informed on Brexit, how it all worked and what all the benefits / drawbacks were etc. but doesn’t the logic flow through that if Britain was better off as an EU member then Canada is better off with the USA as one North American “continental free trade zone” (if you believe it would be a free trade setup) and the spin off ancillary benefits of that union?

You mean...like the North America Free Trade Agreement?

[afc wimbledon]

Originally Posted by Mr.Coffee

I’m not super well informed on Brexit, how it all worked and what all the benefits / drawbacks were etc. but doesn’t the logic flow through that if Britain was better off as an EU member then Canada is better off with the USA as one North American “continental free trade zone” (if you believe it would be a free trade setup) and the spin off ancillary benefits of that union?

It might, Canada's situation is substantially different than the UK/EU dynamic though, the great thing about the EU was the separate countries complimented each other, Germany made things, France grew things, the UK did the paperwork.

If you turned NAFTA into a wholly open border free trade zone all manufacturing would be sucked down into Mexico in a week just because of wages, also you need a largely complementary set of laws and standards, it would be hard to keep free healthcare here

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by Mr.Coffee

I’m not super well informed on Brexit, how it all worked and what all the benefits / drawbacks were etc. but doesn’t the logic flow through that if Britain was better off as an EU member then Canada is better off with the USA as one North American “continental free trade zone” (if you believe it would be a free trade setup) and the spin off ancillary benefits of that union?

Unfortunately logic isn't a feature of the Trump administration, so here we are.

[Mr.Coffee]

Originally Posted by Codes

You mean...like the North America Free Trade Agreement?

Ya but that’s obviously broken so…but ya! Like that?

[Mr.Coffee]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

Unfortunately logic isn't a feature of the Trump administration, so here we are.

I think that’s what Trump means with the 51st state stuff but it has always been weird to me.

So we are now part of the USA, what really is the difference (economically, which I presume is all he cares about) if you have a free trade / NAFTA or Canada is literally a state now?

[SebC]

Originally Posted by Mr.Coffee

I’m not super well informed on Brexit, how it all worked and what all the benefits / drawbacks were etc. but doesn’t the logic flow through that if Britain was better off as an EU member then Canada is better off with the USA as one North American “continental free trade zone” (if you believe it would be a free trade setup) and the spin off ancillary benefits of that union?

Of course Canada benefits from being part of NAFTA/CUSMA. That's why everyone's pissed at the dotard who wants to destroy it.

[Codes]

Originally Posted by Mr.Coffee

Ya but that’s obviously broken so…but ya! Like that?

My point was that yes, when such an agreement is in place, things are objectively better for all parties involved. Like Brexit, the breaking of NAFTA/USMCA, is obviously extremely detrimental for Canada.

[Mr.Coffee]

Originally Posted by SebC

Of course Canada benefits from being part of NAFTA/CUSMA. That's why everyone's pissed at the dotard who wants to destroy it.

But is NAFTA / CUSMA REALLY free trade when we have exceptions for things like Quebec dairy, etc.?

I’m also pointing out the flawed logic of some posters here. Britain were morons for Brexit but not a chance in #### we’d join the States or give up our trade protectionism!

[puffnstuff]

Do you know about how the dairy tariff works? Yes, its 270% but only after a certain amount of 0% tariff dairy products are imported. They have never shipped enough to hit that limit and trigger the 270.

[Codes]

What flawed logic? Being part of the EU is not the same thing as Canada joining the USA.

[woob]

Originally Posted by Mr.Coffee

But is NAFTA / CUSMA REALLY free trade when we have exceptions for things like Quebec dairy, etc.?

I’m also pointing out the flawed logic of some posters here. Britain were morons for Brexit but not a chance in #### we’d join the States or give up our trade protectionism!

Are we not comparing apples to oranges here? Also I’m not fully versed on what took place to form the EU but I’m guessing there were negotiations that took place. Nothing that’s been said around the 51st rhetoric, suggests Trump would let Canada have any say on how we’d become the 51st state. Heck I don’t even think we’d get to vote in elections.

[PeteMoss]

Feels like the Conservatives lean too far into their political image consultants or whatever they are and it makes their candidates feel inauthentic.

They had both O'Toole and Pierre turn into 'casual t-shirt guys' and now they've clearly told Pierre to smile and trying to crack jokes - and its just not a fit for the guy.

[Codes]

Originally Posted by woob

Are we not comparing apples to oranges here? Also I’m not fully versed on what took place to form the EU but I’m guessing there were negotiations that took place. Nothing that’s been said around the 51st rhetoric, suggests Trump would let Canada have any say on how we’d become the 51st state. Heck I don’t even think we’d get to vote in elections.

We'd definitely get the Puerto Rico treatment; either that, or we'd be given severe underrepresentation within the US as to not be able to meaningfully influence electoral results. A sham either way.

[SebC]

Originally Posted by Mr.Coffee

But is NAFTA / CUSMA REALLY free trade when we have exceptions for things like Quebec dairy, etc.?

I’m also pointing out the flawed logic of some posters here. Britain were morons for Brexit but not a chance in #### we’d join the States or give up our trade protectionism!

Dairy is like 0.3% of our GDP. It's high profile because we see it in the grocery stores but a small carve out compared to the volume of trade that was free.

And I don't see anything wrong with saying that free trade is good but annexation is bad. Surely that can be the right level of integration given we might want to keep things like gun control, universal healthcare etc.

[PeteMoss]

Originally Posted by Mr.Coffee

But is NAFTA / CUSMA REALLY free trade when we have exceptions for things like Quebec dairy, etc.?

I’m also pointing out the flawed logic of some posters here. Britain were morons for Brexit but not a chance in #### we’d join the States or give up our trade protectionism!

You can agree or disagree with it, the US has duties on lumber and other things as well.

The US subsidizes their dairy farmers - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dairy_...upport_Program
so they produce way more then the market wants which makes it hard for our dairy famers to compete with theirs.

[Johnny Makarov]

hahahah did you see the smug deplorable talk about his crowd sizes again today? hahaha

Harpy needed to custom fit a muzzle on him. Nice to see the worst PM in Cdn history with the worst candidate in Cdn history on stage together in front a yuge crowd! hahahaha

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by SebC

And I don't see anything wrong with saying that free trade is good but annexation is bad. Surely that can be the right level of integration given we might want to keep things like gun control, universal healthcare etc.

There’s definitely nothing wrong with it.

I’m not sure if it’s an attempt to troll or just play devil’s advocate without thinking about it at all, but comparing a trade agreement to being annexed and calling them the same is like saying there’s no difference between having a regular 9 to 5 job and being owned as a slave.

Basically, nobody real who had actually thought about it for one second would ever think those are the same thing.

[Muta]

Apparently Mark Carney's event tonight in Calgary was sold out, so much so they were turning away people. Lots of them.

[Geraldsh]

Originally Posted by Muta

Apparently Mark Carney's event tonight in Calgary was sold out, so much so they were turning away people. Lots of them.

I have been told the Liberals use mirrors to make their rallies look bigger.