Canadian Federal Politics Thread v5

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by calgarygeologist

Yeah, we need smaller government and more focus on all encompassing issues and less focus on pet projects. But I'm not a traditional liberal voter and the Liberal government over the last ten years has been making huge inroads with the sub sets to win their votes. Is Carney throwing away all the goodwill established by Trudeau? Will the sub sets come out to support and vote for Carney? Unions seem to be pretty upset as well because Carney has eliminated the Minister of Labour which is an odd move. They are calling him a leader for big business and not the workers by dumping that Ministry.

The Minister of Labour position was eliminated 4 months ago, well before Carney, and the portfolio is under the responsibility of the Jobs and Families Minister… who is the same person that was the Minister of Labour 4 months ago.

Why can’t y’all just tell it straight? Why is the plain truth so scary to cons?

[calgarygeologist]

Originally Posted by surferguy

Where are those votes going to flee to? The NDP maybe but they are definitely not headed to PP. I don’t think the Liberals are that worried about losing them.

The couch on election night. Neither the CPC or the Liberal party can be pissing away any potential vote in the upcoming election. They need to do everything possible to get ballots cast in their favor.

[Fuzz]

Not defending anything here, but just curious if the details of all these cabinets matters much if he is calling an election soon. I assume these are more caretaker rolls, and if Mark wins, would perhaps be different people and more positions. Once an election is on, is cabinet going to be working on a lot of initiatives, or just keeping things running?

[calgarygeologist]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

The Minister of Labour position was eliminated 4 months ago, well before Carney, and the portfolio is under the responsibility of the Jobs and Families Minister… who is the same person that was the Minister of Labour 4 months ago.

Why can’t y’all just tell it straight? Why is the plain truth so scary to cons?

Great, Trudeau eliminated it and Carney didn't bring it back because the Liberal party is not focused on the working class.

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by calgarygeologist

Great, Trudeau eliminated it and Carney didn't bring it back because the Liberal party is not focused on the working class.

“Didn’t bring it back”

He put the portfolio under a different Minister title and put the same Minister who was in charge of it in charge of it again.

You’re either being ignorant on purpose or lying. Which is it?

[Mr.Coffee]

Originally Posted by Roughneck

Well, how did you feel when the Conservatives did that?


https://www.cbc.ca/radio/asithappens...s-pm-1.3339782

I didn’t know that happened and, yes, I do feel the same way about it. Why can’t we just have people who do the right thing?

[calgarygeologist]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

“Didn’t bring it back”

He put the portfolio under a different Minister title and put the same Minister who was in charge of it in charge of it again.

You’re either being ignorant on purpose or lying. Which is it?

Up until Friday, Steven MacKinnon was the Minister of Employment, Workforce Development and Labour. Now, under Carney, he is now the Minister of Jobs and Family. Why drop the Labour part from the title unless it is something that they don't want to focus on or put an emphasis on?

[Ped]

It's been one day. Why not just give it more than 26-ish hours to see what it means?

[Locke]

Originally Posted by Ped

It's been one day. Why not just give it more than 26-ish hours to see what it means?

But I want to be angry NOW tho!!

[Zulu29]

F-35 purchase might be limited to 16 planes. Kind of interesting development.

[Locke]

Originally Posted by Zulu29

F-35 purchase might be limited to 16 planes. Kind of interesting development.

How does that affect our 2% NATO commitment?

[2Stonedbirds]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

You’ll never guess who the very first poster to come to Harper’s defence over this was at the time.

I’ll give you a hint: name starts with J… rhymes with Sacks.



Strangely absent: no suggestions Harper was “scummy,” a “dirt bag,” or a “piece of trash.”

LOL

Was it bad when Harper did it?

[sharkov]

Maybe it may be better to have a combo fleet of 16 stealth jets and 72 4.5 jets as the 4.5 gen jets would be more suitable for routine missions while stealth fighters are more suitable for specialized missions given how expensive they are to operate

[Harry Lime]

Originally Posted by Locke

How does that affect our 2% NATO commitment?

If you were to buy the 16 F-35s, you would then turn around and get 200 Gripens for the same original price, including the 16 f-35s. The original order was for 88. It's also less cost to fly and maintain the Gripens, and all building/maintenance/operations/upgrade abilities would be moved to Canada.

The only problem the Air Force has with that arraignment, is that they really don't want a split force plane situation. The training ect ect all doubles.

I mean, we could take control of the first 16 and then sell them at a loss, and still come out ahead financially (over keeping them long term). The only issue with that is that the Americans have the last say on any sale of their product.

[#-3]

Originally Posted by calgarygeologist

Carney's cabinet decisions are not sitting well with some groups in Canada.


https://www.ctvnews.ca/politics/arti...net-positions/

People really need to get over their victim complexes, we are standing on the edge of global economic disaster, and it's people who are more concerned about virtue signaling that results who have gotten us here, not because of the Nazi's themselves but the people who can't help themselves by find something to cry about when we get a not Nazi in power, so that the stupid struggle to see the difference between the Nazi's and the not Nazi's

I don't think PP is as bad as Drumpf, I also don't even thing he has internalized racisms as deeply as Drumpf, but we already have a leader in Alberta who is actively selling off the state to private interests in the most corrupt ways possible, has attacked and is directly complicit in the death of minorities, and I really don't believe PP will be much better than her.

Sure the liberals have their stupid corrupt scandals, but at least they have the intent of leaving the state with assets for the future, rather than selling them off to rent seekers who intend on squeezing society into submission. Sure they don't always find a way to make everyone feel warm and included, but at least they aren't actively driving people to suicide with their policies.

[Roughneck]

Apropos of very little; Some fun history on the evolution of the Minister of Labour (and others).

The Department of Labour was amalgamated with the Department of Employment and Immigration in 1996. It was a process started by Kim Campbell to reduce the size of cabinet and the government. Didn't know she had time to do anything, but seems like she got the ball rolling on that process.

The Department of Employment and Immigration has a bit of a wild history. It was 'Manpower and Immigration from 1966-77. Before that it was Citizenship and Immigration (1950-66), Department of Mines and Resources (1936-50), Department of Immigration and Colonization (1917-36) and Department of the Interior (1873-1917).

So anyway, as part of this reorganization, Labour would be amalgamated into Employment and Immigration, which would become 'Human Resources Development Canada, and would see Immigration get shifted into Multiculturalism and Citizenship (which would become Citizenship and Immigration in 1994).

Human Resources Development Canada was created to try and reduce the size of cabinet and portfolios, but that didn't really work out. We went from:

Minister of Labour (Department of Labour)
Minister of Employment and Immigration (Department of Employment and Immigration)
Minister of Multiculturalism and Citizenship (Department of Multiculturalism and Citizenship)

to:

Minsiter of Labour (Human Resources Development Canada)
Minister of Human Resources Development (Human Resources Development Canada)
Minister of Citizenship and Immigration (Citizenship and Immigration)

Then in 2003, Human Resources Development Canada was split into Human Resources and Skill Development Canada, and Social Development Canada. Back to two ministers for two departments (Minister of Labour for Human Resources and Skill Development Canada, Minister of Social Development for the other).

In 2006 the departments would be merged again into Employment and Social Development Canada (still the department's name today). However it would still have two ministers, because parties just can't seem to give up those portfolios. For some name history of the ministers attached to ESDC:

Minister of Labour (1909-2004), Minister of Labour and Housing (2004-2006), Minister of Labour (2006-2015), Minister of Employment, Workforce Development and Labour (2015-2019), Minister of Labour (2019-2024)

Minister of Social Development (2003-06), Minister of Human Resources and Social Development (2006-2008), Minister of Human Resources and Skill Development (2008-2013), Minister of Employment and Social Development (2013-15), Minister of Families, Children and Social Development (2015-2025).

But also:
in 2011, the Minister of State for Seniors was created. It was dissolved in 2015 as the responsibility was given to the Minister of Families, Children and Social Development. In 2018 it was revived and given a promotion to Minister of Seniors.

In 2019, the Minister of Diversity and Inclusion and Youth was created, with name changes to 'Housing and Diversity and Inclusion' (2021-23) to 'Diversity, Inclusion and Persons with Disabilities' (2023-2025).

In 2023, Minister of Citizen's Services was created for some reason.

Now, fulfilling the dream of the Kim Campbell PCs who wanted to go from three ministers to two with the reorganizing of departments, we will now go from:

Minister of Labour
Minister of Employment and Immigration
Minister of Multiculturalism and Citizenship

to

Minister of Labour
Minister of Families, Children and Social Development
Minister of Seniors
Minister of Citizen's Services
Minister of Diversity, Inclusion and Persons with Disabilities
Minister of Immigration, Refugees and Citizenship

to

Minister of Jobs and Families
Minister of Immigration, Refugees and Citizenship

Only 30 years later. That's progress right there.

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by calgarygeologist

Up until Friday, Steven MacKinnon was the Minister of Employment, Workforce Development and Labour. Now, under Carney, he is now the Minister of Jobs and Family. Why drop the Labour part from the title unless it is something that they don't want to focus on or put an emphasis on?

Why keep the portfolio as part of his responsibilities if they don’t want to focus on it?

You’re putting more emphasis on the wording of the title than the responsibilities that title includes, but I guess expecting more would be asking too much.

[TorqueDog]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

You’re putting more emphasis on the wording of the title than the responsibilities that title includes, but I guess expecting more would be asking too much.

Man, calgarygeologist sounds like the easiest employee ever. In lieu of an actual substantive promotion, just make the title sound better. "We're promoting you from Geologist to Super Geologist."

[iggy_oi]

I actually agree in principle with calgarygeologist’s criticism of lumping the role in with other portfolios. I was equally critical of when the UCP did the same thing at the provincial level.

Where I do take issue with his argument though is that he’s trying to make it look like he cares about the majority of working class people while supporting parties that somehow manage to shockingly exceed the anti-labour sentiment of the liberals. He’s also generally critical of the only organizations that do give a rats ass about the best interests of working class people.

I don’t know whether the worst part or the part that hurts the most is the lack of respect, or the hypocrisy.

[rubecube]

Ekos tends to lean Liberal, but not by this much.

https://www.ekospolitics.com/index.p...behind-carney/