2024/2025 Season trade rumours and speculation thread

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by Monahammer

no, the plan is to make the playoffs every year and see what happens.

The plan should be to build a long term contender, in my opinion. I don't think ownership shares this opinion, and thus my long term disagreement with the team.

For the record, there are many things the team can do and does that make me happy. I have been really enjoying Wolf this season. They are going to try Kerins at centre (though seemingly further down the lineup than I think they should). They are giving rookies bigger roles. Those are all good.

But if they were committed to the better plan, they would have pulled out at least one more leg before the season started. Trading one of Andersson or Weegar would have us bottom 10, no doubt. Now I am not sure there's enough runway left.

With 20M in cap space, a rookie goaltender, and 2 NHL defensemen with significant experience?

It's like you're arguing against the existence of gravity at this point.

[Wolven]

Originally Posted by Monahammer

no, the plan is to make the playoffs every year and see what happens.

What show are you watching? You saw all of the transactions that the team made last season and last offseason and said "this team is definitely trying to make the 2025 playoffs".

Kudos to you for figuring that out. I hope you bet money on it. Personally, we are sitting in a playoff spot in January and I STILL think the team's management is wanting to get into the top 10 of the draft.*

Conroy & Co. are not willing to punish the team for finding a way to succeed when everyone (except you) expected them to be a bottom feeder.

*Note: We've actually dropped to be tied for 16th OA in the standings, only 6 spots or 3 points separate the Flames from being in a top 10 draft pick.

[gvitaly]

Originally Posted by Monahammer

Well,
- they signed a bunch of garbage beginning of season like Mantha, Bean and Barrie. These guys are all filler and we could have just played rookies.
- They keep saying they want to make hockey trades instead of building for the future.
- They keep saying they want to sign a 28 year old to a long term contract.
- Conroy has openly talked about potentially moving out one of the 1sts in the next few years
- Constant references to the unaccetability of rebuilding (the naughty R word!!)

- The Flames actually had to hit the cap floor before the start of the season!
- The Flames only signed players that would sign for 1-2 year deals, so that they could flip them and keep roster flexibility, and spots open for prospects.
- The Mantha signing was pretty good IMO. He would've been an asset at the TD.
- Bean is a young guy and a Kylington replacement, he's not a bad get for the 3rd pairing.
- Barrie is on popcorn duty, hindsight 20/20 they didn't need to sign him.
- I don't see you complaining about the Lomberg signing, and signing a 28 year-old AHL goalie in Cooley.

- The Flames want their young guys to grab spots, and neither Pelletier, nor Schwindt did so.
- Pelletier getting his confidence, and game back in the AHL was the best thing that could've happened.
- Losing Schwindt on waivers lead to a great Kirkland story to start the year.
- We started the year with Honzek, Wolf, and Klapka grabbing roster spots
- Coronato, Kirkland, Pelletier, Duehr, Kerins all joined them and got a decent opportunity.

- The Flames have a hard time getting good players through free agency, so they prefer to keep their 28 year old assets.
- Andersson would still have value in a trade if he's signed, similar to Weegar.

- You build by both making hockey trades and drafting well or at some point you get more prospects than roster spots, and you physically can't give all of them an opportunity at the same time.
- The Flames are in a position where they have a lot of good assets, they're looking at getting a potentially great asset. If the Flames manage to turn quantity into quality I'm all for it, regardless of how it's accomplished.

[Jiri Hrdina]

Originally Posted by Monahammer

- they signed a bunch of garbage beginning of season like Mantha, Bean and Barrie. These guys are all filler and we could have just played rookies.

Mantha was savvy move to use as a trade chip later if he worked out. And he was playing decently. Bean plays every game almost and replaced Kylington. Barrie? Who cares. You want a young player sitting in the press-box.

Originally Posted by Monahammer

- They keep saying they want to make hockey trades instead of building for the future.

No they don't. Plus judge them on their actions not what they say.

Originally Posted by Monahammer

- They keep saying they want to sign a 28 year old to a long term contract.

The horror!

Originally Posted by Monahammer

- Conroy has openly talked about potentially moving out one of the 1sts in the next few years

If you could use a 1st to acquire a young centre why wouldn't you? Why would you want a GM so narrow minded that they wouldn't consider all available options to improve their franchise?

Originally Posted by Monahammer

- Constant references to the unaccetability of rebuilding (the naughty R word!!)

Again, judge them by actions not what they say.

Originally Posted by Monahammer

Those are some of the reasons. Basically, listening to the team talk publicly it sounds like they have no intention of properly building the club and think they can squeek in. The best is that Maloney said this straight up beginning of the year and I got called an idiot for pointing that out and wanting him gone.

it's a pretty poor list if that's your proof.

[FlamesAddiction]

The Flames have jostled between second most and most cap space all season. You don't go into a season with that much cap space and expect to make the playoffs.

Now that a wild card spot is more likely than a top 10 pick, the goal may have shifted at least for this season. Honestly, I think you could trade Andersson and Coleman, and this team still wouldn't tank hard enough to matter at this point. The young guns and Wolf won't allow it. If it is going to be mushy middle with playoffs or mushy middle without the playoffs, might as well try to make the playoffs and then re-evaluate in the offseason.

I am not saying we should get rentals, but keep the status quo. Don't pull the rug out from under them after busting their butts all year to exceed expectations. The damage to the culture and goodwill between players and management wouldn't be worth the relatively small asset gains.

Guys like Andersson and Coleman are not going to lose their value in the offseason. If anything, trading players with contract term is easier in the offseason than at the trade deadline. Most playoff teams are looking for rentals and don't want to over commit. Meanwhile most non-playoff teams are selling and don't want veterans at all.

If a team wants to overpay, then sure, go for it. But selling just to sell when time is still on your side, nah.

[Aarongavey]

Originally Posted by Bingo

How many weeks in a row do we have to rehash this?

Trade 7 UFSs
Deal your goaltender with 2 years left
Carry 20M in unused cap space into the season
Start the year with only 2 defenseman with any kind of NHL experience

The team has exceeded expectations.

The organization didn't set them up for success.

I think in 4-5 years during what will likely be the Flames window if the Flames do not follow that game plan we can definitely conclude that they are not trying to win. In a hypothetical future scenario like that in 2029 we should expect the Flames to

1) Trade 5 or more of their top players. Right now that would look like trading Wolf, Coronato, Zary, Parekh and Weegar

2) Fill out your backend with waiver wire pickups and low cost UFA's

3) Barely scrape to make the cap floor by signing one or two UFA's to one year deals. Ensure that you leave at least 25% of the available cap space unused.

Then compete for a playoff spot and the Stanley Cup.

If they don't follow this obvious blueprint to compete in 2029 I will definitely question whether they truly are trying to win.

[The Cobra]

Originally Posted by Bingo

With 20M in cap space, a rookie goaltender, and 2 NHL defensemen with significant experience?

It's like you're arguing against the existence of gravity at this point.

I don't think the plan before the season was to try and make the playoffs and see what happens.

But I do think that having Lindholm, Hanifin and Tanev indicating they would look elsewhere factored into that decision.

But Wolf (along with Zary, Coronato and Bahl) changed all that.

I think they now realize finishing bottom 5 is not in the cards.

So, now it's business as usual, but within reason. What choice to they really have?

[TOfan]

@Monahammer

What does ‘properly building the club’ mean? You make it sound like there one way to do it which I would argue, is not exactly right.

Pretty sure if you asked 32 GM’s you would probably get 32 different answers. Every single team has its unique set of circumstances and that is constantly changing from season to season.

Not too sure what your idea of ‘proper’ is but another you can say about each and every team is that there is more than one way to do it.

It seems like you like to believe that you know more than Conroy et all.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by Monahammer

It's weird that all of us said the rookie goalie would have made last season worthwhile, but "Wolf needed to wait and develop" (Dino this is you) and now he's the only reason we're winning games. It's almost as if we should have traded markstrom sooner to allow him to play in the NHL and start making an impact/difference when it mattered a bit more for the franchise.

Or maybe rushing him would have been a bad idea, and could have set him back significantly.

To my mind, they have handled Wolf perfectly, and he is rewarding them with stellar play. But to you, that is somehow a failure for the franchise.

[All In Good Time]

Originally Posted by TOfan

@Monahammer

What does ‘properly building the club’ mean? You make it sound like there one way to do it which I would argue, is not exactly right.

Pretty sure if you asked 32 GM’s you would probably get 32 different answers. Every single team has its unique set of circumstances and that is constantly changing from season to season.

Not too sure what your idea of ‘proper’ is but another you can say about each and every team is that there is more than one way to do it.

It seems like you like to believe that you know more than Conroy et all.

This is just like all the "Tankers", inflexible. Pinder was tying himself in knots yesterday because he couldnt pick a lane.

This team sold almost everyone last year. Nobody believed that we would be in this position right now. It looks like an extremely high draft pick isnt in the cards so we need to re-evaluate some how.

Monapinder

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by The Cobra

I don't think the plan before the season was to try and make the playoffs and see what happens.

But I do think that having Lindholm, Hanifin and Tanev indicating they would look elsewhere factored into that decision.

But Wolf (along with Zary, Coronato and Bahl) changed all that.

I think they now realize finishing bottom 5 is not in the cards.

So, now it's business as usual, but within reason. What choice to they really have?

That's a rational response.

At some point you have to let the players decide their fate.

Don't destroy the future to chase a slim chance at a playoff run, but let them finish it out as is.

It's hockey. It's sports. You're supposed to try and win.

They removed the obvious spinning your wheels mechanism but now what the hell ... go with it.

[stemit14]

I do wonder how everyone would feel if the flames got Catton in the draft last year instead of Parekh. Obviously he was selected by Seattle before the flames had a chance to take him but I wonder if the flames had a skilled young centre in the system, would there be less concern about bottoming out this year and next year? Only because the flames would still have other skilled defencemen (though likely none as highly skilled as Parekh) like Mews and Brz but would have a skilled centre to fill that hole… with the hope he turns into a legit #1 one day. That would have made it so the flames have Catton and Zary as the potential top 2 centres going forward. It just feels like such a big hole in the team’s future that everyone wants to fix - and many think drafting top 10 is the best way to do it. Which could be true.

[TOfan]

Originally Posted by All In Good Time

This is just like all the "Tankers", inflexible. Pinder was tying himself in knots yesterday because he couldnt pick a lane.

This team sold almost everyone last year. Nobody believed that we would be in this position right now. It looks like an extremely high draft pick isnt in the cards so we need to re-evaluate some how.

Monapinder

Ha, yeah, I heard that. The mental gymnastics he was attempting there was impressive.

[FlamesAddiction]

The only way to actually tank for top 3-5 draft picks is to not play Wolf. Or you could trade him which for obvious reasons, wouldn't be wise. With Wolf's emergence, tanking is just not on the menu anymore. Mushy middle though? Quite possibly unless they find a different way than just building with high draft picks.

[Wolven]

Originally Posted by The Cobra

I think they now realize finishing bottom 5 is not in the cards.

I don't think the team really thought that bottom 5 was realistic anyway. That would have meant trying to bottom out harder than the Sharks, Blackhawks, Sabres, Ducks, and Canadiens*. It would be more accurate to suggest that the plan was bottom 10.

*The Canadiens have managed to get themselves out of the bottom 5 but the Preds spectacular failure of a season has essentially replaced the Canadiens.

[dammage79]

Ahhh, there's plenty of season left. Still a ton of possibilities to play out.

Can't fault the roster for defying expectations of almost everyone given the roster turn over from a season ago.

Wolf is just doing what he's always done, absolutely defy and ridicule the majority's opinion of him every single step of his development path. And I don't expect that to change, ever.

[Macindoc]

Originally Posted by Tbull8

Just since there was discussion in here about going after Pettersson, what would it realistically take to pry Barzal out of New York? I've always thought he's a guy being held back by the organization he's in. 6 more years at 9.15. 27 years old RHC from Western Canada.

With them potentially trading Nelson, maybe they're gonna end up going down the rebuild route. Tough to say

Hopefully the plan is to slot Zary as the 2C in the. next year or two. Barzal is just another 2C, on an expensive, long-term contract, which makes him hard to move, so I'm not sure if he's even desirable as a trade chip. I don't see him as having the potential to be a 1C on a contender, he's a 70 point player. We need to trade for easily movable assets or top picks/propspects.

[traptor]

If we make the playoffs this year and have a decent showing I will be pleasently shocked if the flames don't try to fill some holes in the summer either via trade or UFA.

Specifically a Center and top 4 D.

I can definitely see them signing Geekie, frederic or roslovic type if they don't trade for a younger center.

[Tbull8]

Originally Posted by Macindoc

Hopefully the plan is to slot Zary as the 2C in the. next year or two. Barzal is just another 2C, on an expensive, long-term contract, which makes him hard to move, so I'm not sure if he's even desirable as a trade chip. I don't see him as having the potential to be a 1C on a contender, he's a 70 point player. We need to trade for easily movable assets or top picks/propspects.

Agree to disagree, I see him as a 1C that would absolutely explode in another organization

[SuperMatt18]

Originally Posted by Bingo

That's a rational response.

At some point you have to let the players decide their fate.

Don't destroy the future to chase a slim chance at a playoff run, but let them finish it out as is.

It's hockey. It's sports. You're supposed to try and win.

They removed the obvious spinning your wheels mechanism but now what the hell ... go with it.

Yeah, sometimes you can't swim upstream and trying to tank this season would 100% be this team trying to swim upstream at this point.

They really tried to suck this year, and it just hasn't worked. Had you told me that Kuzmenko and Sharangovich had 10 combined goals at this point in the season and we were in a playoff spot I'd have called you crazy.

It doesn't mean the rebuild is over, it just means the team won't be drafting as high as we wanted this year...and that's okay.

Here are my general rules for a rebuild:

Maximize the value of your aging assets: For the most part the Flames have done okay in this space on pieces like Markstrom, Lindholm, etc...but still maybe didn't maximize pieces like Hanifin by making the move earlier (and now with Andersson/Coleman etc).

Don't trade Long Term Assets for Short Term Assets It doesn't mean you can't trade draft picks, but any picks you trade should be for younger players with team control.

Just don't trade for rentals, or give up assets for short term pieces that aren't impact players or that don't fit the age of your core (ie the Travis Hamonic deal).

Draft For Potential Elite Skills Take the best player available with a focus on people that have even a single skill that potentially transfers as elite..."no safe picks". Last year with guys like Mews, Misa, Parekh the Flames really seemed to do that...and it doesn't mean that size/defensive skill isn't a priority either...because if they have "Elite Defensive Skills" then that might get them to the NHL too (Eric Jamieson might be an example of this).

Lean Into The Bad Seasons This is generally the one the Flames have failed historically, they always try to salvage seasons. But if you're having a bad season don't try to make moves that will stop the bleeding. If it's not your year, it's not your year, and lean into it to get the early draft picks.

This is actually more what teams like Colorado and Tampa Bay did...they didn't plan on being bad or even commit to a re-build. But once the bad season started they just leaned in.

Don't Accept A Culture of Losing / Indifference This is probably what is determining things the most this year. You don't have to go and make a win now trade, but if your team is working hard and playing good, and your young guys are a big part of it (Wolf, Coronato, Zary, etc) then you need to keep pushing for the playoffs.

Now if you have UFAs you aren't planning to re-sign you should still move them (ie. Glencross in 14/15) but you don't need to rush to sign guys with term because you could still move them at the draft.

And it also shouldn't change your long term plans - don't overreact to either a positive or negative season - stick to the long term plans because a lot of luck or bad luck can really impact a single season.