The bolded is clear, because in addition to not knowing who owns the oil, how import and exports work and who has jurisdiction over what, you’re wrong about the constitution.
As stated, exports of natural resources falls under federal jurisdiction. Crown corporations or other entities, whether owned by the provincial government or not, are not exempt from any export taxes on those resources.
Alberta already owns the natural resources. No paper transactions are required to put ownership in their name. They already own it. And provincial crown corporations, while immune from federal income tax and have some tax immunity generally, lose part of that immunity when they operate as commercial entities as opposed to activities integral to the functional of the government. Among the federal taxes they are not immune to are both the GST/HST and, you guessed it, export taxes, as that is the sole jurisdiction of the federal government.
Perhaps ideology is blinding you a bit and causing confusing between what is true and what you want to be true, but sorry, the facts are not on your side.
Whether you are correct, or Smith has a workable solution by doing this is what we will find out. Her gov't seems to have been very effective at finding these loopholes solutions. Her wording was carefully non-specific.
They’re looking at creating a public body that would buy all private oil and gas intended for export to the U.S.
That would inoculate Alberta petroleum products against a federal export tax, because one Canadian government can’t tax another.
“It’s ridiculous that we have to worry so much about Liberal Ottawa in a situation like this, but it’s the way things are,” said one official.
If it was so easy to just slap an export tax on oil, without severe political and legal consequences, the feds would have done it long ago. Well, they tried it twice and failed.
I can’t imagine a scenario where she would have put some sort of an offer out and not made that public if it had been rejected by the provinces. Not having made it public would be dropping the ball again.
I don’t think bringing up reducing transfer payments would have been helpful. The boost in transfer payments other provinces would see through a stronger Alberta economy is one of the best selling points. Especially at a time like this with so much uncertainty.
Big missed opportunity for Alberta.
The basis for her position hasn't been one of negotiation at all. I don't think she has negotiated. I believe she talked to Trump's advisors and was told that there would be no oil tariffs. She then pivoted to the threat that Ottawa would use Alberta has fodder in the negotiation.
She's almost certainly right. The Liberals are in a bad position, and probably would find it very useful to limit the impact of the tariffs on their Ontario/Quebec base by throwing Alberta's economy under the bus. The Liberal part, and most of their base would not care one bit about a massive recession in Alberta, while also being able to deploy their strongest weapon in the fight.
There is nothing team oriented about the Liberal/Ontario approach to the "Canada First" tariff fighting mentality. They have repeatedly demonstrated what they think of Alberta and the oil industry.
Ontario/Quebec and the Liberal party are willing to fight.... to the last Albertan.
Whether you are correct, or Smith has a workable solution by doing this is what we will find out. Her gov't seems to have been very effective at finding these loopholes solutions. Her wording was carefully non-specific.
If it was so easy to just slap an export tax on oil, without severe political and legal consequences, the feds would have done it long ago. Well, they tried it twice and failed.
Except they have taxed province-owned natural resources successfully. Of course it was taken to the courts, but unfortunately for Smith and people who believe her secret plan is just so simple, the Supreme Court found otherwise. Nobody has described slapping an export tax on oil as easy or without consequence or resistance. It would meet plenty of it. Those are your descriptors. I prefer facts.
Quote:
Moreover, there is no principle of provincial Crown immunity from federal legislative authority, whether regulatory authority or tax authority, once a provincial Crown purports to enter the export field and engage in international transactions. That is this case. Indeed, the national government would become hostage to Crowns in right of the province if the latter could transcend general federal control of international trade simply by asserting that it was bringing Crown properties into the international market.
Quote:
There is no doubt of the federal government’s constitutional right to impose export taxes on any commodity. To deny this is to attempt to extend provincial powers well beyond their present constitutional limits. The federal government imposed an export tax on electricity for 38 years, from 1925 to 1963. Similarly, the federal government established a tax on oil exports in 1973. It continues to impose this tax.
A tax on natural gas exports is not discriminatory. These exports have earned enormous economic rents as their price has soared due to OPEC’s price increases. Taxation based on the ability to pay is in accord with long-established principles.
But sure, I guess we’ll find out. Not everyone has the maturity to admit when their wrong, so I understand why you won’t, but you really should have some understanding of the basics before dressing your opinion up as facts, as it’s only you you’ll embarrass.
The UCP is no stranger to attempting and failing at things they can’t do, attempting and failing to act outside of their jurisdiction, and blowing significant tax payer dollars on half baked schemes. But who knows, maybe they’ll get one right.
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Yes, I'm scared of someone who has done nothing to differentiate himself from the party that might not even get official party status in the next election.
Great take again but the Liberal apologists who now seem to think Carney is their saviour.
Except they have taxed province-owned natural resources successfully. Of course it was taken to the courts, but unfortunately for Smith and people who believe her secret plan is just so simple, the Supreme Court found otherwise. Nobody has described slapping an export tax on oil as easy or without consequence or resistance. It would meet plenty of it. Those are your descriptors. I prefer facts.
But sure, I guess we’ll find out. Not everyone has the maturity to admit when their wrong, so I understand why you won’t, but you really should have some understanding of the basics before dressing your opinion up as facts, as it’s only you you’ll embarrass.
The UCP is no stranger to attempting and failing at things they can’t do, attempting and failing to act outside of their jurisdiction, and blowing significant tax payer dollars on half baked schemes. But who knows, maybe they’ll get one right.
They have successfully litigated against the federal government in the past.
In either case, I believe Smith and co were careful when they said "government body". Feel free to litigate the constitutionality of a plan she has not yet revealed. It's unfortunate for them that your comments here were unavailable to them, as I'm sure they would never have put any consideration into the idea if they had seen them.
Yes, I'm scared of someone who has done nothing to differentiate himself from the party that might not even get official party status in the next election.
Great take again but the Liberal apologists who now seem to think Carney is their saviour.
Defend your dear leader. what the eff has he done other than just whine and bitch at the status quo.
You think the yappy Pomeranian could have navigated Canada out of the 2008 financial crisis. Or controlled Brexit rather than be a proponent of it? haha
Be scared. you should be.
__________________ Peter12 "I'm no Trump fan but he is smarter than most if not everyone in this thread. ”
Yes, I'm scared of someone who has done nothing to differentiate himself from the party that might not even get official party status in the next election.
Great take again but the Liberal apologists who now seem to think Carney is their saviour.
He wasn't part of the Liberal government, and he just announced his candidacy today. How is he already a disaster? Because he hasn't differentiated himself less than 12 hours in?
They have successfully litigated against the federal government in the past.
In either case, I believe Smith and co were careful when they said "government body". Feel free to litigate the constitutionality of a plan she has not yet revealed. It's unfortunate for them that your comments here were unavailable to them, as I'm sure they would never have put any consideration into the idea if they had seen them.
You’re right, they’re known for being experts on the legal system. I’m sure their secret plan is secret because it’s SO amazing. And it sounds even better when its biggest cheerleader didn’t even know the basics of who owned what and how exporting works.
He wasn't part of the Liberal government, and he just announced his candidacy today. How is he already a disaster? Because he hasn't differentiated himself less than 12 hours in?
It's straight out of their playbook. PP was calling it the 9 years of the Carney-Freeland-Trudeau Government at his presser today. lol
__________________ Peter12 "I'm no Trump fan but he is smarter than most if not everyone in this thread. ”
They have successfully litigated against the federal government in the past.
When the tax wasn't limited to export (as was the case of a tax on natural gas sales in 1982, despite the export tax on oil remaining in place for years after).
The 1982 decision is probably their basis for this plan:
Quote:
They’re looking at creating a public body that would buy all private oil and gas intended for export to the U.S.
That would inoculate Alberta petroleum products against a federal export tax, because one Canadian government can’t tax another.
but it wasn't the ownership of the gas that caused the tax to be defeated, but where in the line the tax was applied (and how broadly). The decision effectively enshrined the federal government's ability to tax exports even if the owner was a provincial government. Hence why petroleum export taxes continued after the decision.
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Right now we need the NDP to do something pronto and get a leader onboard that actually cares for the working class, because Carney ain't it.
We really lack a party that represents the blue collar worker. PP is where a large portion have coalesced but he certainly isn’t going to help. I don’t think I’ve ever supported proportional representation before but it would really help right to have a credible socially right workers party to get votes that could work with a socially left workers party.
But you are right Carney is a global economy pro-trade, pro-market guy. Hes the Mulroney era conservative we need right now.
The basis for her position hasn't been one of negotiation at all. I don't think she has negotiated. I believe she talked to Trump's advisors and was told that there would be no oil tariffs. She then pivoted to the threat that Ottawa would use Alberta has fodder in the negotiation.
I kind of doubt that she was told there would be no oil tariffs without something going back the other way. I mean it’s plausible that it could have happened, but highly unlikely all things considered.
Quote:
She's almost certainly right. The Liberals are in a bad position, and probably would find it very useful to limit the impact of the tariffs on their Ontario/Quebec base by throwing Alberta's economy under the bus. The Liberal part, and most of their base would not care one bit about a massive recession in Alberta, while also being able to deploy their strongest weapon in the fight.
There is nothing team oriented about the Liberal/Ontario approach to the "Canada First" tariff fighting mentality. They have repeatedly demonstrated what they think of Alberta and the oil industry.
Ontario/Quebec and the Liberal party are willing to fight.... to the last Albertan.
For arguments sake let’s say you’re right on all that. When you finally have leverage against the people who you believe have been holding you back and can use that leverage to finally accomplish some goals that would be otherwise out of reach it’s best to try and extract as much as you can from that situation.
You’re right, they’re known for being experts on the legal system. I’m sure their secret plan is secret because it’s SO amazing. And it sounds even better when its biggest cheerleader didn’t even know the basics of who owned what and how exporting works.
Great stuff.
/shrug.
We'll see. Until we have details on the tariffs and the response of Canada, and the subsequent response from Alberta, we're all speculating.
When the tax wasn't limited to export (as was the case of a tax on natural gas sales in 1982, despite the export tax on oil remaining in place for years after).
The 1982 decision is probably their basis for this plan:
but it wasn't the ownership of the gas that caused the tax to be defeated, but where in the line the tax was applied (and how broadly). The decision effectively enshrined the federal government's ability to tax exports even if the owner was a provincial government. Hence why petroleum export taxes continued after the decision.
I was referring to the recent wins by Alberta regarding federal over-reach.
The previous taxes were removed for political reasons, I believe.
