Adds to a serious housing crisis in many major cities, often leading to tent villages when there is no more affordable housing. Drives up the demand for cheap and affordable housing, making it more difficult for the working class.
Not to mention general issues with societal and cultural integration, but it's a smaller problem.
It's not a nothing issue to have zero control over the influx of immigrants. It was a major failing of the Biden administration, and that's coming from someone who really thought he had a good presidency (one that we won't see the benefits of for many years because the policies were all for long term planning, not a quick tax break to garner votes).
He did try near the end to implement a meaningful policy, but was blocked by the Republicans. It's not an unwarranted criticism to say he did a poor job of handling the issue for the first 3 years of his term.
To be clear, you can be pro-immigration and pro-border at the same time. These things aren't mutually exclusive. It just creates the rules and regulations for legal immigration instead of pure chaos.
Zero control is a huge overstatement and misrepresentation. I've yet to see backup to show that Biden's policies were responsible for an increase in captured illegal immigrants. Biden's policies were more humane, yet he actually caught and deprted more undocuymented immigrants than Trump. So who was more effective?
Do you not see it? In your previous post you talk down to Canadian values(respecting past wrongs, acknowledging hurt), but shouldn't you be adopting those values?
Zero control is a huge overstatement and misrepresentation. I've yet to see backup to show that Biden's policies were responsible for an increase in captured illegal immigrants. Biden's policies were more humane, yet he actually caught and deprted more undocuymented immigrants than Trump. So who was more effective?
You’ve literally been shown backup, you just refuse to accept it because for some reason, you’re not able to acknowledge that you’re wrong.
Curious why you ignored my previous post putting some onus on you to refute actual data shown. So I’ll repeat again:
- Since you haven’t yet shown any data that supports your position - do you have anything that shows there was no increase in illegal immigration after Biden took over? You’ve been shown data that supports that it has. Show data that supports your position.
- You acknowledged that Biden has recently brought the numbers down through executive action. Again - if the numbers weren’t elevated, like you believe, how did the numbers come down after Biden took action?
Nothing you are saying makes any sense and you don’t have any backup for anything you’re saying other than moving goalposts and arm-waving away, which doesn’t prove what you think it does. Show any data that supports your position.
Edit to add: you are also very incorrect about Biden deporting more illegals than Trump. Straight up false. Why am I surprised.
I didn't play the race card. Curves did with his "culture" nonsense.
No one wants illegal immigration. It's just not the crisis it's made out to be.
Culture does not equal race or skin colour. That is a fundamental mistake people make when discussing things like immigration and culture. Custom's, norms, laws, language, history. cuisine and a lot more. It becomes all encompassing and slightly hard to define.
As I said before, mass immigration no matter where becomes a concern for the locals involved. It doesn't make people racist or xenophobic as people always want to point out, although that can sometimes be a part of it. People get concerned all over the world with changes.
If Trump starts to deport millions of people and millions show up to the Canadian border, you think Canadians are going to be super welcoming with open arms? Just look at the federal government's response. Trudeau was openly welcoming people on Twitter to their new home. Now? Significant effort is being made to reduce the welcome mat, notifying people in other countries Canada is not easy to stay and your refugee claim will most likely be denied.
Look at the EU. During the Syrian/ African wars when tens of thousands of refugee's were fleeing the war and coming onshore in Italy and Greece, nobody in central Europe cared. Let the Greeks and the Italian's deal with it was the mantra. When the refugee's indicated that they had zero interest in staying in economic basket case countries during a financial crisis and wanted Germany, France and the UK, things changed and emergency meetings were held.
People just fail to understand that mass immigration is a political and hot button issue everywhere.
Do you not see it? In your previous post you talk down to Canadian values(respecting past wrongs, acknowledging hurt), but shouldn't you be adopting those values?
What can I tell you? That I agree with everything Canadian culture wise? No. I think we have a lot of great customs, values, culture and more. Other things are not so great or just plain weird.
It's also called independent thought and that's ok too for everybody. I am not perfect and neither are other people. When it comes to immigration it's always tough to describe things because a lot of people play the race card or say things like "anti immigrant rhetoric" when in reality some of the biggest critics of immigration policy are immigrants themselves.
The reason why this has become such a big topic in Canada is because of how bad the Trudeau Liberals have screwed this file up. It's bonkers and can't be defended. They are being taken advantage of, being left to live on the street and in hotels, the government has a piss poor plan and provinces and their services are beyond stretched.
Bottom line is that mass immigration becomes an issue everywhere. Since this is a American Politics thread, that was made very clear to the Democrats from Democrats that borders need to be respected and immigration laws need to be followed. They pretended it didn't matter until it became a democrat problem in their states.
If you’re actually an immigrant who believes these things, then why aren’t you adapting to Canada? You keep saying immigrants should adapt to the lifestyle here, but in the same breath you are constantly telling us that we should be more like other countries and change our culture, like not renaming landmarks or having “x” on their passports. There are other places, right? Why not move to the US? Has it crossed your mind that you’re acting in a completely hypocritical manner? You want our country to bend to your whims and believe systems, but keep saying everybody else that moves here should be the ones adapting.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fuzz
Do you not see it? In your previous post you talk down to Canadian values(respecting past wrongs, acknowledging hurt), but shouldn't you be adopting those values?
Expecting consistency and good faith discussion seems to be a big ask these days. Too many bull####ters think they can hide their hypocrisy if they just keep spewing more words. The more people calling it out the better.
Culture does not equal race or skin colour. That is a fundamental mistake people make when discussing things like immigration and culture. Custom's, norms, laws, language, history. cuisine and a lot more. It becomes all encompassing and slightly hard to define.
I agree with this, and it's why you see entire beer league hockey teams made up of first generation immigrants who are often visible minorities.
There is some magic amount of immigration that maintains critical mass of culture, and has people coming into the country very likely to end up adopting largely to those norms within a generation or two.
If you open the floodgates, foreign cultures potentially have critical mass, and you end up with enclaves where language, tradition, cultural norms etc. are imported rather than adopted.
I agree with this, and it's why you see entire beer league hockey teams made up of first generation immigrants who are often visible minorities.
There is some magic amount of immigration that maintains critical mass of culture, and has people coming into the country very likely to end up adopting largely to those norms within a generation or two.
If you open the floodgates, foreign cultures potentially have critical mass, and you end up with enclaves where language, tradition, cultural norms etc. are imported rather than adopted.
That just alters how long it takes, there are many many first generation Italian pensioners in Vancouver that can barely speak English despite arriving in Canada 60 years ago, their kids can barely speak Italian their Grandkids are likely to support Manchester or RM
I agree with this, and it's why you see entire beer league hockey teams made up of first generation immigrants who are often visible minorities.
There is some magic amount of immigration that maintains critical mass of culture, and has people coming into the country very likely to end up adopting largely to those norms within a generation or two.
If you open the floodgates, foreign cultures potentially have critical mass, and you end up with enclaves where language, tradition, cultural norms etc. are imported rather than adopted.
I've heard Brampton has a very large concentration of visible minorities, something like more than 3/4? Mostly from India?
We are importing outside conflicts and grudges.
This was published nearly a decade ago and it's only gotten more concentrated.
That just alters how long it takes, there are many many first generation Italian pensioners in Vancouver that can barely speak English despite arriving in Canada 60 years ago, their kids can barely speak Italian their Grandkids are likely to support Manchester or RM
I don't think that's true. What you're describing is the current situation where there is critical mass of "Canadian Culture", and exactly what I cited in my example where every kid ends up liking hockey despite having parents from the other side of the world where it wasn't a thing.
If you increase the rate substantially, it will be similar to examples such as the Soviet satellite states where the immigration levels were artificially ramped up (along with many other measures that make this a bit of a shaky example) and ended up with Russian culture dominating, even today.
I don't think that's true. What you're describing is the current situation where there is critical mass of "Canadian Culture", and exactly what I cited in my example where every kid ends up liking hockey despite having parents from the other side of the world where it wasn't a thing.
If you increase the rate substantially, it will be similar to examples such as the Soviet satellite states where the immigration levels were artificially ramped up (along with many other measures that make this a bit of a shaky example) and ended up with Russian culture dominating, even today.
I think you underestimate the massive lack of assimilation in immigrant areas in Vancouver in the 50's and 60', German's had their own banks, bakeries retirement homes all centered around the Victoria Drive area, Italians had the drive, black Americans lived off Chinatown, these communities were just as vast as our current migrant population and unlike today most were not educated nor spoke English, if anything is likely todays migrants will assimilate faster
I agree with this, and it's why you see entire beer league hockey teams made up of first generation immigrants who are often visible minorities.
There is some magic amount of immigration that maintains critical mass of culture, and has people coming into the country very likely to end up adopting largely to those norms within a generation or two.
If you open the floodgates, foreign cultures potentially have critical mass, and you end up with enclaves where language, tradition, cultural norms etc. are imported rather than adopted.
Even with low immigration rates, what immigrants there are would likely to tend to concentrate themselves in specific areas for language, cultural, and financial reasons. And these concentrations allow for neighbourhoods to have their own cultural identities, which I actually enjoy exploring.
I don't think that's true. What you're describing is the current situation where there is critical mass of "Canadian Culture", and exactly what I cited in my example where every kid ends up liking hockey despite having parents from the other side of the world where it wasn't a thing.
If you increase the rate substantially, it will be similar to examples such as the Soviet satellite states where the immigration levels were artificially ramped up (along with many other measures that make this a bit of a shaky example) and ended up with Russian culture dominating, even today.
But every kid doesn't like hockey. Born and raised Calgarian and idgaf about hockey. No way all immigrants care about hockey. Most don't...it's probably just your bubble of people who like hockey.
I think you underestimate the massive lack of assimilation in immigrant areas in Vancouver in the 50's and 60', German's had their own banks, bakeries retirement homes all centered around the Victoria Drive area, Italians had the drive, black Americans lived off Chinatown, these communities were just as vast as our current migrant population and unlike today most were not educated nor spoke English, if anything is likely todays migrants will assimilate faster
Doesn't that sort of line up with what I'm saying? During those periods, the ratio of immigrants to Canadian born citizens was really high, and a bunch of ethnic enclaves formed and grew. If you maintain those rates, those things get bigger and bigger and indefinitely delay cultural assimilation of some portion of the population.
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Originally Posted by SebC
Even with low immigration rates, what immigrants there are would likely to tend to concentrate themselves in specific areas for language, cultural, and financial reasons. And these concentrations allow for neighbourhoods to have their own cultural identities, which I actually enjoy exploring.
Yes, and we get a ton of the "Happy Medium" here in Canada. I love going to ethnic neighbourhoods in different cities, and having the various different cultural celebrations etc. If you take that to the extreme, however, you end up with things like this:
TL;DR: They now have a publicly broadcast call to prayer, have banned bars near mosques, and were early in the admittedly long line of rainbow flag bans.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sliver
But every kid doesn't like hockey. Born and raised Calgarian and idgaf about hockey. No way all immigrants care about hockey. Most don't...it's probably just your bubble of people who like hockey.
I don't have data for it, but I would be willing to bet my life savings that if you surveyed new immigrants from Asia/South Asia about if they followed or played hockey vs. their children, there would be a stark difference.
People talking about Canadian culture and "assimilation" like that's ever been a part of the Canadian ethos. 50 years ago I learned about melting pot versus mosaic and people still don't get it.
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