2024/2025 Season trade rumours and speculation thread

[The Cobra]

Originally Posted by Paulie Walnuts

Also traded their best prospect goalie because they blocked him by going with Wedgewood.

They didn't block him with Wedgewood.

When the signed Saros to an 8 year deal, the decision was made to run with Saros, and Askarov had too much trade value to relegate him to a back up role his whole life. So they traded him for value.

[Sample00]

Checks to see the title of the thread,

"2024/2025 Season trade rumours and speculation thread"

Is there a chance we may have some trade rumours or speculations happening any time soon?

[Bingo]

So created a database.

Looking at the last 30 years, and removing both Vegas and Seattle as they don't have enough seasons.

Grouped seasons into three categories ... Top 10 Picks (not exact, but by win % of less than .500), Mushy Middle and Contending.

The 30 NHL franchises averaged 11.3 years in the mushy middle over the 30 years. If you do a +2 / -2 there are 17 teams that have an average within this ban including the Flames.

7 teams that missed low (less mushy middle)

1. Detroit
2. San Jose
3. Jersey
4. Anaheim
5. Chicago
6. Pittsburgh
7. Tampa

Could certainly argue some success in that group.

More instances above the average within the mushy middle (more frequency in the zone that fans fear)

1. Minnesota
2. Buffalo
3. Philadelphia
4. Dallas
5. Montreal
6. Calgary

If you really want to cut up the data sample to reflect the Flames being the mushy middle team drop ten years and go with the last 20.

But at 30 years the differences are pretty tight to a 1/3 1/3 1/3 split with no major outliers.

And I'm firmly in the camp that thinks looking at 10 20 or 30 years is silly given the change in the management, and economic situations of the league.

[GioforPM]

Too lazy to math it but I'm betting TB's average points per season is around 92.

[D as in David]

Originally Posted by Sample00

Checks to see the title of the thread,

"2024/2025 Season trade rumours and speculation thread"

Is there a chance we may have some trade rumours or speculations happening any time soon?

[SuperMatt18]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

Too lazy to math it but I'm betting TB's average points per season is around 92.

If you look at post lockout seasons the Flames actually average 92 points per 82 games.

Vegas, Boston, Pittsburgh, and Washington are the top of the league in that time, averaging over 100 points per 82 games.

https://www.nhl.com/stats/teams?repo...=0&pageSize=50

It's also interesting that Arizona is last in the NHL in that time with a .486 points percentage and didn't have a single top 2 pick in that time but had 4 top 5 overall picks (Turris, Strome, Hayton, Cooley).

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

If you look at post lockout seasons the Flames actually average 92 points per 82 games.

Vegas, Boston, Pittsburgh, and Washington are the top of the league in that time, averaging over 100 points per 82 games.

https://www.nhl.com/stats/teams?repo...=0&pageSize=50

For some reason they went with 30 seasons. The obvious problem with using an average is that the tanking teams have obviously extremely low years to go with their high ones. So their averages will look like a mushy middle team as well.

[SuperMatt18]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

For some reason they went with 30 seasons. The obvious problem with using an average is that the tanking teams have obviously extremely low years to go with their high ones. So their averages will look like a mushy middle team as well.

Personally to me anything pre-Salary Cap is irrelevant.

It's a completely different ecosystem that has very little relevance to how teams have to be managed in a cap system and a modern draft system.

If you look at most of the 90s you were probably better off trying to use Free Agency and to try to compete every year because really the top end of the draft didn't consistently give you stars anyways. Drafting accuracy of identifying talent has improved, and it's made drafting and earlier picks more important, and that was compounded by the cap crunch for most of the salary cap era.

[Winsor_Pilates]

Originally Posted by Sample00

Checks to see the title of the thread,

"2024/2025 Season trade rumours and speculation thread"

Is there a chance we may have some trade rumours or speculations happening any time soon?

Huberdeau for Forsberg; E5.
Both sitting at 17 points and both teams looking for some shakeup.

[activeStick]

Now that, I would be so down for!

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

Personally to me anything pre-Salary Cap is irrelevant.

It's a completely different ecosystem that has very little relevance to how teams have to be managed in a cap system and a modern draft system.

If you look at most of the 90s you were probably better off trying to use Free Agency and to try to compete every year because really the top end of the draft didn't consistently give you stars anyways. Drafting accuracy of identifying talent has improved, and it's made drafting and earlier picks more important, and that was compounded by the cap crunch for most of the salary cap era.

I don't disagree, but I was just going off what was presented.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Winsor_Pilates

Huberdeau for Forsberg; E5.
Both sitting at 17 points and both teams looking for some shakeup.

Well there is a small difference in Cap hit and term.

LOL - just noticed that Forsberg's agent is Pekkas Rautakalio's son.

EDIT: Man is Nashville ever full of players past their prime.

[Sec214]

Originally Posted by Sample00

Checks to see the title of the thread,

"2024/2025 Season trade rumours and speculation thread"

Is there a chance we may have some trade rumours or speculations happening any time soon?

Not in this thread.

[GioforPM]

Stamkos on pace for 38 points - a 43 point drop from last season. Forsberg on pace for 50, which would be a 44 point drop.

[Sec214]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

Stamkos on pace for 38 points - a 43 point drop from last season. Forsberg on pace for 50, which would be a 44 point drop.

Only one puck on the ice.

[SuperMatt18]

Originally Posted by Sec214

Only one puck on the ice.

And no good centers to get it to them or win it back.

[Monahammer]

Originally Posted by Bingo

So created a database.

Looking at the last 30 years, and removing both Vegas and Seattle as they don't have enough seasons.

Grouped seasons into three categories ... Top 10 Picks (not exact, but by win % of less than .500), Mushy Middle and Contending.

The 30 NHL franchises averaged 11.3 years in the mushy middle over the 30 years. If you do a +2 / -2 there are 17 teams that have an average within this ban including the Flames.

7 teams that missed low (less mushy middle)

1. Detroit
2. San Jose
3. Jersey
4. Anaheim
5. Chicago
6. Pittsburgh
7. Tampa

Could certainly argue some success in that group.

More instances above the average within the mushy middle (more frequency in the zone that fans fear)

1. Minnesota
2. Buffalo
3. Philadelphia
4. Dallas
5. Montreal
6. Calgary

If you really want to cut up the data sample to reflect the Flames being the mushy middle team drop ten years and go with the last 20.

But at 30 years the differences are pretty tight to a 1/3 1/3 1/3 split with no major outliers.

And I'm firmly in the camp that thinks looking at 10 20 or 30 years is silly given the change in the management, and economic situations of the league.

So, you would say that in the recent, relevant history of our franchise, we are in fact a mushy middle team?

Seems like that was exactly what I said prior to all this dissection but sure!

I agree we've had changes in management over 20 years, but overall we haven't changed course. It's been the same dogmatic "make it into the playoffs and see what happens" mantra every season- independent of management or coach. In fact we have had many debates on this board over the last 5 years about why this is- whether coaching or management is to blame, etc. Ultimately it seems to be a directive from ownership down. Bean confirmed this in a press conference last year, so I'm not even sure why we're discussing it. The feelings/whims of independent managers in the club have basically been worthless. They weren't allowed to feel certain ways. Economic situations of the league is interesting, but the league is in the best economic situation it has ever been and there's not huge evidence of change.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

And no good centers to get it to them or win it back.

Stamkos is a centre.

[The Cobra]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

Stamkos is a centre.

But apparently not a good one I guess LOL.

[SuperMatt18]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

Stamkos is a centre.

I think that's part of the problem.

He hadn't really been playing center in Tampa Bay for a while, as they had Point and Cirelli doing most of the center responsibilities.

At this point of his career he's much more suited to being a Winger if you want him to product offensively.