Israel declares war on Hamas

[Hemi-Cuda]

Well I'm guessing this thread won't mean much pretty soon, with Trump and Netanyahu teaming up there probably won't be a palestine in the next few years

[SebC]

Originally Posted by Hemi-Cuda

Well I'm guessing this thread won't mean much pretty soon, with Trump and Netanyahu teaming up there probably won't be a palestine in the next few years

Hamas really picked a great time to f*** around and find out.

As much as what Israel is doing is a massive overreaction, provoking an occupying power that can squash you like a bug is just so stupid, especially if you believe they have genoicidal intent.

[GGG]

Originally Posted by Flames Fan, Ph.D.

‘annexation’

Why not just call it what it is?

what word are you looking for. Annexation I think is precisely correct. Israel is going to add the land to their country. They aren’t going to just occupy it like previous times. Conquer is incorrect as well as that could just be Occupy, or just bomb into the ground.

My intent was to communicate that Israel is going to include that land in the state of Israel. It won’t be a West Bank type settlement arrangement. Just straight annexation. This a significant departure from the slow expansion via settlement.

[SutterBrother]

Ethnic cleansing and annexation both fit. The bottom line being Palestinians will not (ever) be returning to that land.

The only difference in US policy moving forward will be the removal of the veneer of trying to stop or slow it. Trump will be all in at advancing the borders of Israel as much as possible - fully supported by his popular vote mandate from the American people.

I would suggest that Hamas would be well served to return all hostages while Biden is still in office - but they all think they're going to holy warrior heaven when they die, so they literally prefer death to saving the civilian lives of their people.

The situation in Gaza will now get even worse. Which is a stunning thing to type out.

Frankly, in the next 4 years, the Gaza situation will most likely "end".

[Looch City]

Trump's gonna move the capital of Israel to Gaza.

[Itse]

Originally Posted by SutterBrother

Ethnic cleansing and annexation both fit. The bottom line being Palestinians will not (ever) be returning to that land.

The only difference in US policy moving forward will be the removal of the veneer of trying to stop or slow it. Trump will be all in at advancing the borders of Israel as much as possible - fully supported by his popular vote mandate from the American people.

I would suggest that Hamas would be well served to return all hostages while Biden is still in office - but they all think they're going to holy warrior heaven when they die, so they literally prefer death to saving the civilian lives of their people.

The situation in Gaza will now get even worse. Which is a stunning thing to type out.

Frankly, in the next 4 years, the Gaza situation will most likely "end".

You seriously think returning whatever hostages are still alive after the bombings would make a difference?

This is just incredibly naive.

[GGG]

Originally Posted by Itse

You seriously think returning whatever hostages are still alive after the bombings would make a difference?

This is just incredibly naive.

With Gallant being gone I think it’s clear that the hostages offer no leverage. So keeping them does nothing to help.

[CroFlames]

Originally Posted by GGG

what word are you looking for. Annexation I think is precisely correct. Israel is going to add the land to their country. They aren’t going to just occupy it like previous times. Conquer is incorrect as well as that could just be Occupy, or just bomb into the ground.

My intent was to communicate that Israel is going to include that land in the state of Israel. It won’t be a West Bank type settlement arrangement. Just straight annexation. This a significant departure from the slow expansion via settlement.

I think this is clearly the end goal now. Remove all the Palestinians from Gaza and annex the territory in the name of security.

Wait about a generation, and they'll do the same thing to the West Bank. They've already started the soft annexation there with illegal settlements so that in 25 years from now they can say "Look, Israelis have lived here a long time, this is Israeli land" and take it.

A page right out of the Russian playbook.

[Flames Fan, Ph.D.]

Originally Posted by GGG

what word are you looking for. Annexation I think is precisely correct. Israel is going to add the land to their country. They aren’t going to just occupy it like previous times. Conquer is incorrect as well as that could just be Occupy, or just bomb into the ground.

My intent was to communicate that Israel is going to include that land in the state of Israel. It won’t be a West Bank type settlement arrangement. Just straight annexation. This a significant departure from the slow expansion via settlement.

It’s not just being annexed, where people can remain. It’s being ethnically cleansed.

[Azure]

Any hope for Gaza & a two state solution was gone on Oct 8th.

I mean it was really gone during the Clinton administration when it was offered and rejected, but lets just ignore that part.

[GGG]

Originally Posted by Flames Fan, Ph.D.

It’s not just being annexed, where people can remain. It’s being ethnically cleansed.

That really isn’t a change in policy as a result of Trump being elected which is what my post was discussing. The northern half of Gaza has already been ethnically cleansed.

So instead of being snarky you could have made an additive post instead of a dismissive one.

[Flames Fan, Ph.D.]

It's not snarky... people here have some type of fear over describing Israeli actions in their purest brutal form.

This 'annexation' thing, the discussion about 'explosive' devices, etc...

Time to grasp what is happening.

[Azure]

Originally Posted by Flames Fan, Ph.D.

It's not snarky... people here have some type of fear over describing Israeli actions in their purest brutal form.

This 'annexation' thing, the discussion about 'explosive' devices, etc...

Time to grasp what is happening.

Terrorists being eliminated?

Maybe believers in the two state solution and a free and independent Gaza under the state of Palestine should have actually you know tried to fight for that without letting a bunch of terrorists sideline their cause and use the people of Gaza and Lebanon as puppets in their holy war against Israel?

But hey, lets not talk about the billions that have been funnelled in to build a war machine to attack Israel.

[GGG]

Originally Posted by Flames Fan, Ph.D.

It's not snarky... people here have some type of fear over describing Israeli actions in their purest brutal form.

This 'annexation' thing, the discussion about 'explosive' devices, etc...

Time to grasp what is happening.

The word to use is genocide then. It’s widely used in this thread. That hasn’t changed with the firing of gallant or election of Trump.

And if you wanted to add a different word you should have just added it. That’s the snarky part. Like you a can disagree with someone or expand on their point without being a dick.

[Bagor]

Originally Posted by Azure

Terrorists being eliminated?

That and the small sideshow matter of civilians being slaughtered.

But then your statement suggests that you're another one that believes all Gaza civilians are terrorists.

Damn those newborn terrorists.

[Manhattanboy]

Disgusting antisemitism on full view in Amsterdam last night as Jewish soccer fans were targeted and violently beaten by pro-Palestinian protesters. Rescue planes flew from Israel to the Netherlands to evacuate Israelis. Not a surprise. A direct result of months of encampments and protests and calls for action against Israelis and Jewish people by any means necessary, ignored by Western authorities.

That this occurred days before Remembrance Day in a country that Canadian soldiers gave their lives defending is outrageous.

[TheIronMaiden]

Originally Posted by Manhattanboy

Disgusting antisemitism on full view in Amsterdam last night as Jewish soccer fans were targeted and violently beaten by pro-Palestinian protesters. Rescue planes flew from Israel to the Netherlands to evacuate Israelis. Not a surprise. A direct result of months of encampments and protests and calls for action against Israelis and Jewish people by any means necessary, ignored by Western authorities.

That this occurred days before Remembrance Day in a country that Canadian soldiers gave their lives defending is outrageous.

I think you left out the part where the Tel Aviv fans were tearing down Palestinians flags, taunting Arab players and singing songs with tasteful lyrics like “There are no schools in Gaza because there are no children left.’”

[CroFlames]

Originally Posted by Manhattanboy

Disgusting antisemitism on full view in Amsterdam last night as Jewish soccer fans were targeted and violently beaten by pro-Palestinian protesters. Rescue planes flew from Israel to the Netherlands to evacuate Israelis. Not a surprise. A direct result of months of encampments and protests and calls for action against Israelis and Jewish people by any means necessary, ignored by Western authorities.

That this occurred days before Remembrance Day in a country that Canadian soldiers gave their lives defending is outrageous.

The Israeli fans instigated the violence after arriving in the city and attacking Palestinian supporters before the match, an Amsterdam city council member said.

“They began attacking houses of people in Amsterdam with Palestinian flags, so that’s actually where the violence started,” Councilman Jazie Veldhuyzen told Al Jazeera on Friday.

Israeli “hooligans” chanted songs swearing at Arabs, saying, “There are no schools in Gaza because there are no children left.’”

Goldberg, the Israeli political commentator, said Israel’s reaction to the clashes reflected a “complete rejection of the notion that actions have consequences” given the Israeli fans’ actions in Amsterdam.

Sounds like the Israelis went looking for trouble.

Sauce: https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2024/...s-in-amsterdam

[Beninho]

Originally Posted by TheIronMaiden

I think you left out the part where the Tel Aviv fans were tearing down Palestinians flags, taunting Arab players and singing songs with tasteful lyrics like “There are no schools in Gaza because there are no children left.’”

C’mon. If a bunch of Israelis waited outside a soccer stadium to hunt down arabs because a portion were burning Israeli flags and calling for the destruction of Israel you would rightfully say that’s wrong, I highly doubt you would be here defending Israelis in that situation. It is interesting how you are more than fine defending innocent people being indiscriminately assaulted based on their nationality. Unless you believe in collective punishment and every Israeli who attended the game deserved to be physically assaulted because some fans were saying bad things and a flag was taking down. I was under the impression by reading this thread that collective punishment is not ok and I agree, so how is it ok now? It’s just very interesting how there is always a defence when innocent Israelis are being attacked.

Even if you presume every single Israeli who was attacked were responsible for the distasteful chants and the stealing of property I am pretty sure that does not give you the right to assault them in a country with law and order. You call the police.

[CroFlames]

Originally Posted by Beninho

C’mon. If a bunch of Israelis waited outside a soccer stadium to hunt down arabs because a portion were burning Israeli flags and calling for the destruction of Israel you would rightfully say that’s wrong, I highly doubt you would be here defending Israelis in that situation. It is interesting how you are more than fine defending innocent people being indiscriminately assaulted based on their nationality. Unless you believe in collective punishment and every Israeli who attended the game deserved to be physically assaulted because some fans were saying bad things and a flag was taking down. I was under the impression by reading this thread that collective punishment is not ok and I agree, so how is it ok now? It’s just very interesting how there is always a defence when innocent Israelis are being attacked.

Even if you presume every single Israeli who was attacked were responsible for the distasteful chants and the stealing of property I am pretty sure that does not give you the right to assault them in a country with law and order. You call the police.

What do you base this on? Were you there?

I just posted an article that says Israelis attacked Palestinians.