American Politics 3.0 - Back to Brunch

[GGG]

Originally Posted by GullFoss

Trump's track record is better on border, immigration, economy, taxes, trade and foreign policy.

Harris was a disaster on the border - which was her only meaningful file during her vice presidency. The Biden administration did not accomplish much of anything notable in her time as VP. She came across as super incompetent. And she was complicit in covering up Bidens dementia from the American people, so not super trustworthy.

What was her redeeming characteristics? She wasn't trump. Weak.

She was the VP selection of Biden in part because woke Democrats wanted a bipoc woman on the ticket. And she's only the candidate because of how Biden dementia played out and the optics of dumping a bipoc woman for a higher quality candidate that was either white, male or both would have been ugly.

The results are not surprising. At all.

The people picked the more qualified, more intelligent and more competent candidate.

Your last line is incorrect. It should be Despite all the challenges with Kamala she was still clearly the more qualified, more intelligent, more competent candidate.

Age alone disqualifies Trump.

People are dumb.

[Looch City]

Originally Posted by GullFoss

He's playing to the crowd lol. Might turn you off, but it plays well to many many people.

Plays well to many deplorables.

Murica is filled with too many deplorables.

[GullFoss]

Originally Posted by Looch City

Plays well to many deplorables.

Murica is filled with too many deplorables.

Inflation eating away at real wages
Border policies and immigration causing wage suppression and crime issues
Weak economy that's getting weaker
Candidate with low credibility

It's not complicated. Inf fact, the exact same thing is happening in Canada with support for Liberal party falling off a cliff

[AFireInside]

Originally Posted by GullFoss

Inflation eating away at real wages
Border policies and immigration causing wage suppression and crime issues
Weak economy that's getting weaker
Candidate with low credibility

It's not complicated. Inf fact, the exact same thing is happening in Canada with support for Liberal party falling off a cliff

It's almost as if you don't understand any of those things..

[GullFoss]

I understand the issues as well as everyone else abandoning the liberal party and democrat party. But I'm super interested in learning your take on any of them and why the progressive policy stances on any of those issues is the correct stance.

[AFireInside]

Originally Posted by GullFoss

I understand the issues as well as everyone else abandoning the liberal party and democrat party. But I'm super interested in learning your take on any of them and why the progressive policy stances on any of those issues is the correct stance.

When you explain exactly how you were correct in those things, with some examples we can talk about it. I expect you'll be on facebook for awhile grabbing all the data you need.

[GirlySports]

Rubecube is right

https://twitter.com/user/status/1854029577716125731

[Sultan]

Originally Posted by GirlySports

Rubecube is right

https://twitter.com/user/status/1854029577716125731

I don't think he or you are asking the right questions. Are you ok with this when the mother could have been saved?

https://www.texastribune.org/2024/11...on-ban-emtala/

It is on CNN and other sites, but this is what some are happy about and cheering for lol. This would not been allowed when Roe vs wade was settled law.

Be, happy, what a great speech.

Really look up the 14 year old marriage law, this is why you are happy? Cheering for 14 year old marriages and women shouldn't vote?

PS. I don't live there, but it is ok to show what got voted in before. But it is also more important to say that everyone who is happy and supports Trump was happy they both died, because that is the law now, after it was changed under Trump.

Still waiting for a happy trump supporter to show the bill put forward to lower the age of marriage to 14? Own it, i think it is sick, but i also think r and carry to term, or letting this poor girl die(1 of many that are easily searchable), are also sick. Maybe others and society have moved on now, somehow, that is the new normal?

PS. I did copy and paste a bit. I just want to see if anyone who was happy and thought it was someone else's fault, is just as happy about this girl, 14 year old marriage bills, and carry to term. I do not mind linking the bill or more instances, even in just texas, if we are celebrating the new rules and the new deaths that never get talked about.

[PaperBagger'14]

[Itse]

Originally Posted by GirlySports

Rubecube is right

https://twitter.com/user/status/1854029577716125731

People love to crap on the electoral college system and the two-party mess, and rightfully so.

That said, it would sure be nice to be able to vote directly on something like minimum wage.

It's a big, complicated country.

[Cali Panthers Fan]

Saw it trending towards a Trump win last night and was hoping for a late comeback in some battleground states for Harris. Woke to find out this awful news.

A pretty disappointing result. America shows that it doesn't understand the economy at all. It also shows (at least to me) that America still doesn't want to vote for a woman as the electoral college numbers were eerily similar to the Clinton.

But most disappointing is the democratic party as a whole. They continue to run weak candidates with poor messaging and policies that don't resonate with the people. This whole campaign should have been a layup, but they just can't get out of their own ####ing way. There needs to be some soul searching in the party to figure out why they keep losing. Is America that conservative? Maybe, but I would argue that they just don't like what the Democrats have been offering ever since Obama. Better policy. Better campaign strategy. Better candidates (give people an inspirational candidate for ####s sake). Do your job donkey party.

America making another bargain with the devil. Last time (supreme court notwithstanding) he only managed to cause short-term damage. I wonder if the guardrails hold this time or he manages to do some of the worst things he promised. If so, this could change America for the long haul.

Abortion amendment failed in Florida. Disappointing, but it was going to be tough to get 60% of the vote in what has become the new Texas.

Legalized weed also failed in Florida. Honestly, quite surprising. Even Trump was in favor of that one, but his followers didn't vote that way.

I'm trying not to freak out, but I have serious concerns. However, I'm just going to react to things as they happen and not project the worst case scenarios. I'm taking a break from news and politics for my mental health, using that time to focus more on family and my immediate circle, as that's all I really have control over anyway. This is probably my last post in here for a while.

Who knows. Maybe we all get lucky and he dies in the first year. It's not like he's young or particularly healthy.

[Fuzz]

Trump dying just puts someone more competent in charge. That should be a good thing, but instead it means far more effective governance achieving the goals of horrible, awful people. The rich will get MUCH richer. The poor will get much more dead.

[Ozy_Flame]

Good points Cali Panthers Fan. It's a long, inward look in the mirror for the Democrats and probably go back to square one.

This is a good time as any for a third-party make some headway as well. I think it's time.

One thing though, Donny kicking the bucket would just result in Vance taking the Presidency, and that isn't ideal. Not to mention Trump is just the first of many in what is likely a long line of MAGA presidential candidates in Trump's vein.

[Scroopy Noopers]

Originally Posted by Itse

People love to crap on the electoral college system and the two-party mess, and rightfully so.

That said, it would sure be nice to be able to vote directly on something like minimum wage.

It's a big, complicated country.

Voting directly is dumb because the population is dumb. We should be electing people who support our values and work to create the environment we want to live in. Those people, who’s job it is to be informed on the details and to fight for their constituents, should be voting for these things on our behalf.

[Looch City]

Guys I have to make a confession:

Rubecube was right all along.

[photon]

It's fine, we don't need NATO...

I guess the only thing is we're not going to have to deal with months of secret German servers and Italian satellites flipping votes and North Korean subs delivering bamboo laced ballots and whatever other delusional fantasies Republicans came up with.

Now just need a new thread title.

American Politics 47.0 - Fascistastic

[SebC]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

How does a choice become viable if nobody ever supports it?

You do support it. Just not on election day in a swing state. And it's tough, long work. But you can succeed.

I volunteered for Nenshi's first campaign. Where we were at 2% on the first poll. Our strategy was to show growth. Every poll, show growth. It was all about signaling viability. We had a major poll right before Thanksgiving, so that we could be talked about as a viable campaign when families all get together. That was our campaign's defining moment, when that poll came out and showed we had the momentum we needed.

One interaction that I remember was talking with someone who said she liked what I was saying about Nenshi, but she was a committed Hehr supporter. I told her I liked Hehr too, and just asked her to consider us if he dropped out. She said he wouldn't. He did. I'd like to think she became one of voters. But if Hehr was viable over Nenshi, I would've voted Hehr myself even as one of Nenshi's volunteers from Day 1. And if it had come down to Higgins or McIver, I would've voted Higgins.

Another strategy is to attack the systems that incentivize coalescing around the leaders. This is why I keep talking about how first-past-the-post promotes strategic voting and how if you want to free people to vote their conscience you get rid of it. In my view, electoral reform is an important target. And it might be achievable in Canada. BC has come close. The Liberals made it a campaign promise (though not acted on).

In the USA, another option is to bypass the parties and directly put your policy up for referendum. Progressive causes have been advanced by this method.

Keep talking about your ideas. They might catch on to the point that a big party picks them up.

The system is rigged against evolution. So sew seeds for revolution.

Change is hard and most of what you'll do will barely move the needle, including throwing a swing state vote away. Do the things that aren't self-sabotaging. Let vote splitting be a mistake that your enemy makes.

[Lanny_McDonald]

Originally Posted by GullFoss

Inflation eating away at real wages

Inflation caused by Trump policies. When you slap tariffs on pretty much everything that is going to cause scarcity and prices of available products to rise. When you use the credit card to put massive tax cuts into play - predominantly for the rich - that is going to exacerbate the effects of those inflationary policies.

Border policies and immigration causing wage suppression and crime issues

This is 1000% bull#### that the media is just to ####ing lazy to fact check and dispel, and the stupid lap up because it gives them someone else to blame instead of understanding the complexity of the situation. Trump's big border policy was to build a wall, which was ineffective and did nothing to stem the flow of illegal immigration, and then treat those who were asylum seeks as sub-humans, setting an example that would prevent others from taking the risk of illegal crossing. The actual solutions to illegal immigration are found in policies and programs that address the problems in the home countries of the people fleeing, and then an actual functional program to address the flow of people wanting to enter the country. As an actual immigrant that went through the system, it is a joke how slow and inefficient the process is, and this has been a big problem for 40 years.

The crime garbage is just that, garbage. Immigrants, illegal or not, cause less crime than natural born citizens. There is an inherit fear of wrongdoing in the immigrant community because the specter of deportation is always hanging over their heads. None of these groups, especially those who enter the country illegally, are going to risk their existence in the United States by committing a crime that may get them caught and deported. Illegals tend to live in communities where they blend in and where they will be isolated from suspicion during their daily existence. The crimes they commit are usually related to working and living illegally in the United States. Violent crime in these communities is usually gang related and very few of the illegals are gang members - many are they are fleeing gang related pressures and violence in their home countries.

Weak economy that's getting weaker

GDP? Up. Inflation? Flat. Unemployment? Down. Ratio of people to open jobs? Near record low. Wages? Up. Stock market? Record highs. Trade deficit? Down. Manufacturing capacity? Up.

How is the economy getting weaker?

Candidate with low credibility

Another failure of the media. There has never been a candidate with lower credibility than Trump. Harris should have all the credibility in the world because of her back story. She literally picked herself up by her bootstraps and rose to the top. Trump is a failure at everything he touches, to the point of being a convicted felon. How the #### does this not register? You would have to be quite the degenerate to not recognize the failings and lack of credibility of Donald Trump, and then claim someone like Harris had low credibility.

Frankly, what won this election was misogyny and racism. That's the core of the Trump base and that is what drove those voters to the polls. Harris was a bad pick because she has a vagina. The United States will never support a female candidate for president. the patriarchy is so entrenched in the fabric of this country that it will never allow for a woman in the big chair. Project 2025 will push this country backward and provide further reinforcement of the patriarchy in the United States.

[Lanny_McDonald]

Originally Posted by Cali Panthers Fan

Who knows. Maybe we all get lucky and he dies in the first year. It's not like he's young or particularly healthy.

I suspect that Vance and the Republicans will 25th amendment Trump during 2025 and get the true believer they really want in the Oval Office. Trump is too much of a wild card. President JD Vance will do everything the Heritage Foundation and the Tech Bros tell him to do. This is the end game. The useful idiot will be pardoned for all past and future crimes, then put out to pasture to do damage only to the fairways on his golf courses. The damage to America will be left in the capable hands of JD Vance.

[GGG]

Trumps lack of competency is the one thing that can hold democracy together.