BC Lags Behind Other Provinces in Life Satisfaction

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by White Out 403

Here's a feeling I have. I feel like people accused of violent crime should be denied bail. Weird feeling I know. lol I'm so weird.

So if your son was charged with assault in connection with a brawl at a house party, you’d be cool with him spending 14 months behind bars before he got his day in court?

[Locke]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

So if your son was charged with assault in connection with a brawl at a house party, you’d be cool with him spending 14 months behind bars before he got his day in court?

I kind of understand the sentiment though. Its not like it was their 'first time' or anything.

Also, its a bit of a 'chicken and egg' scenario.

I can understand wanting people accused of violent crimes, especially multiple times, to maybe be held a little longer? And the Court System adjusts for that by increasing Bail amounts, but the other solution could be....'don't take 14 months?'

I know, that would require a more efficient system that we don't have, but maybe thats something to aspire to?

The number of times I've heard Lawyers and Police officers refer to it as a 'Catch and Release' system is somewhat concerning.

[opendoor]

But more people are being held pre-trial for longer than ever. Here's the number of prisoners being held in remand before any kind of trial per 100K of population in Canada:

1980: 11
1985: 12
1990: 17
1995: 18
2000: 28
2005: 36
2010: 41
2015: 43
Currently: 42

If people describe right now as "catch and release", then what were the 1980s and 1990s? For every 100 people being held without bail currently, 60-70 of them would have been released back then.

[bizaro86]

Originally Posted by opendoor

But more people are being held pre-trial for longer than ever. Here's the number of prisoners being held in remand before any kind of trial per 100K of population in Canada:

1980: 11
1985: 12
1990: 17
1995: 18
2000: 28
2005: 36
2010: 41
2015: 43
Currently: 42

If people describe right now as "catch and release", then what were the 1980s and 1990s? For every 100 people being held without bail currently, 60-70 of them would have been released back then.

Are you sure about 60-70 people getting released back then? I think it's quite a bit more likely that roughly the same subset are being held without bail, they're just being held many times longer because the system is so far behind.

Eg if you had 121 people held for 1 month each in 1980 you'd have an average of 11 at a time.

If youu hold those same 121 people for 4.2 months before trial in 2024 then you're holding 42 people at a time.

One thought on that matter is that increasing court funding might actually save us money - get those who are acquitted out of custody and those who are convicted into a penitentiary. Fixes overcrowding in remand without building more jails.

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by bizaro86

Are you sure about 60-70 people getting released back then? I think it's quite a bit more likely that roughly the same subset are being held without bail, they're just being held many times longer because the system is so far behind.

Eg if you had 121 people held for 1 month each in 1980 you'd have an average of 11 at a time.

If youu hold those same 121 people for 4.2 months before trial in 2024 then you're holding 42 people at a time.

One thought on that matter is that increasing court funding might actually save us money - get those who are acquitted out of custody and those who are convicted into a penitentiary. Fixes overcrowding in remand without building more jails.

This is the gist of a lot of things. We've spend so many decades making cuts to everything that it ends up costing us so much more in the long run. But you can't sell the public on higher spending, and some parties have demonized the idea so much that it's impossible to do, so here we are...


Also why Pollivere's zero based budgeting is such a ridiculous idea, but it gets the populace vote so he's not going to consider any other options.

[rubecube]

Originally Posted by bizaro86

One thought on that matter is that increasing court funding might actually save us money - get those who are acquitted out of custody and those who are convicted into a penitentiary. Fixes overcrowding in remand without building more jails.

Yeah, I'd wager we'd be better off hiring more judges and administrators than cops. I also think decrim helps a bit with this because we're not increasing the remand pop with simple possession charges.

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by bizaro86

One thought on that matter is that increasing court funding might actually save us money - get those who are acquitted out of custody and those who are convicted into a penitentiary. Fixes overcrowding in remand without building more jails.

It would almost certainly be more cost-effective than hiring more cops. But the latter is popular with both red-meat conservatives and public sector unions. I don’t know what political constituency you appease by spending more on lawyers, judges, and courthouses.

[blankall]

Maybe there's more to the case of the guy grabbing a women at knife point and dragging her into an alley. That seems like something someone with zero impulse control would do. That person is likely to reoffend. Plus all the witnesses.

Some more details, pretty terrifying stuff:

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/briti...sant-1.7317257

[opendoor]

Originally Posted by blankall

Maybe there's more to the case of the guy grabbing a women at knife point and dragging her into an alley. That seems like something someone with zero impulse control would do. That person is likely to reoffend. Plus all the witnesses.

Some more details, pretty terrifying stuff:

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/briti...sant-1.7317257

Last I saw, the Crown hadn't pressed charges yet, so obviously he had to be released. Why that has happened, I have no idea. But that's not a bail issue.

[blankall]

Originally Posted by opendoor

Last I saw, the Crown hadn't pressed charges yet, so obviously he had to be released. Why that has happened, I have no idea. But that's not a bail issue.

I wonder how they identified the guy. Based on the story, he was wearing a mask. It also sounds like it was an attempted robbery, as opposed to sexual violence, which was my first conclusion about hearing about the incident.

[Winsor_Pilates]

Originally Posted by blankall

I wonder how they identified the guy. Based on the story, he was wearing a mask. It also sounds like it was an attempted robbery, as opposed to sexual violence, which was my first conclusion about hearing about the incident.

Could be either, thankfully it didn't get far enough to know.
The guy who pulled over to help and got the other guys involved is a hero.

[blankall]

Originally Posted by Winsor_Pilates

Could be either, thankfully it didn't get far enough to know.
The guy who pulled over to help and got the other guys involved is a hero.

No doubt. In an age of observers it's amazing to see someone step in.

[opendoor]

Originally Posted by bizaro86

Are you sure about 60-70 people getting released back then? I think it's quite a bit more likely that roughly the same subset are being held without bail, they're just being held many times longer because the system is so far behind.

Eg if you had 121 people held for 1 month each in 1980 you'd have an average of 11 at a time.

If youu hold those same 121 people for 4.2 months before trial in 2024 then you're holding 42 people at a time.

One thought on that matter is that increasing court funding might actually save us money - get those who are acquitted out of custody and those who are convicted into a penitentiary. Fixes overcrowding in remand without building more jails.

Yeah, I worded that poorly. What I meant to say was of the 100 people in remand at any given time now, 60-70 would be out at that same point in time back then.

And you could also look at it in the inverse. Using your numbers, at any given time 110 of the 121 would be in the community in 1980 while only 79 would be now. Still a significant difference that is completely counter to people's impressions of the current bail system.

Also, my understanding is the average length of stay is only part of it, so the effect is greater than those numbers would suggest. I haven't come across recent data, but from the mid-80s until the early '00s (which represents most of the increase in the remand count), the average length of stay only increased marginally (about 20%). And most of that increase in median remand length is attributed to the fact that non-violent crime rates dropped faster than violent crime rates, so the latter (who are normally held longer) made up a higher proportion of detainees.

The fact is, conditional releases have always existed and the current system is less lax than it was in the past. Crime rates are down significantly since the 1980s and 1990s, yet the number of people being held without bail is up significantly.

[rubecube]

Good read for people who don't quite understand why safe supply (and safe consumption sites) are important.

https://twitter.com/user/status/1834003183997518327

[chemgear]

On the hood in the hood with the "ON DRUGS" sign at the end.

https://twitter.com/user/status/1833962616269758895

[Locke]

Originally Posted by chemgear

On the hood in the hood with the "ON DRUGS" sign at the end.

https://twitter.com/user/status/1833962616269758895

Cheaper than the Bus?

[calgarygeologist]

Good news for BC as Premier Eby has announced that they will be establishing highly secure facilities for people with mental health and addiction issues. There will be stand-alone facilities and facilities located within correctional facilities.

[afc wimbledon]

Originally Posted by calgarygeologist

Good news for BC as Premier Eby has announced that they will be establishing highly secure facilities for people with mental health and addiction issues. There will be stand-alone facilities and facilities located within correctional facilities.

Vancouver Pretrial has sat empty since they moved Pickton out a decade ago, a fully secure facility sitting in heart of the DTES, never understood why it wasn't used as a mental health unit

[chemgear]

####

https://bc.ctvnews.ca/parents-fight-...camp-1.7033221

Brianna MacDonald died last month in an Abbotsford, B.C., homeless camp. She was just 13 years old.

Her death was caused by a suspected overdose, according to her family. And her grieving parents are urging change so other families don’t have to face what they are going though.

Brianna’s mom said despite the family’s ongoing attempts to get her help for her addictions and mental health issues, their pleas were ignored in a system they said failed Brianna at every turn.

Family said that despite Brianna’s age, she had accessed Fraser Health-supplied drug paraphernalia including needles, naloxone kits and pamphlets on how to use safely.

But her family said what they instead wanted from Fraser Health was to get their daughter treatment.

“(Children) are not able to buy alcohol, they are not able to buy marijuana at the marijuana store, they can’t buy cigarettes, but they can have access to crack pipes and kits to be able to do safe injection? It’s just wrong,” said her step-father Lance Charles.

The family wanted her held involuntarily so she could get the help they said she desperately needed.

But the family said they were told Brianna had the right to decide herself, despite her only being 12 years old at the time.

The family is calling on government to support involuntary treatment and to do more to protect children like Brianna.

[FlamesAddiction]

That is absolutely appalling.