Official WWE/ECW/WCW/TNA talk, or whatever v2

[Julio]

Originally Posted by Ozy_Flame

Could be the youngest promo alive!

https://twitter.com/user/status/1822435192306647544

Took them long enough:

https://forum.calgarypuck.com/showpo...postcount=4932

[TBone290]

Originally Posted by Inferno

lmao at Grayson Waller wearing a Tkachuk jersey.

So good lol

[Inferno]

https://twitter.com/user/status/1831792765828780435

[SuperMatt18]

I haven't been able to fully watch All Out but man AEW needs to learn every match doesn't need to have some absolutely ridiculous spot.

Plastic bags, tacks, cinder blocks, needles, light tubes...what else was there tonight...they have good enough wrestlers they don't even need all these things in every other match.

And okay if they want the blood and gore for these PPvs then fine...but stick to stuff like the needle in the mouth. It's shocking, it's gore, but it's relatively low risk.

Both the vertebreaker and powerbomb onto the cinder block are way too risky. No way Swerve didn't hurt something in his back on that powerbomb. The vertebreaker wasn't as bad looking but if that's off by an inch then Hangman's neck would have had a real issue.

Too often there is stuff like the cinder block, or Darby flying through real glass and 6 chairs from a ladder that is like "was that risk really necessary"

Edit: From a pure booking perspective AEW has this weird habit of really making former champions lose even more after losing the title.

Hangman did it after losing to Punk, Samoa Joe has kind of done it, and now Swerve has done it. Even MJF lost to Ospreay and has been shuffled down into more of the mid card after his return.

Maybe I'm so conditioned to the traditional rematch after losing a title but it's weird to me that once they take a belt off a guy they tend to lose a couple more matches and get shuffled down the card and don't even seem to care about the title that much.

Double Edit: Hangman's fall into insanity is a great story though. Not sure where the story goes for Swerve but for Hangman it's the typical "you've become what you despised" story and he's lost all humanity now.

[LIP MAN]

Last night had a ton of storylines happening. Was actually brilliant, even the Willow/Statlander feud came to an end. Have to appreciate the story in the story with Jack Perry/Luchaurus right before the BCC turn on Danielson. Someone on Reddit articulated it perfectly well:

I don’t think we are supposed to have “enjoyed” the main event.

There were some moments at the show which made plenty of people feel uncomfortable or otherwise displeased. On paper that sounds like a problem, but I really do feel like it was by design.

The company is no stranger to doing what it can to sell a gimmick or story to viewers. People complain about Jericho’s tv time, so naturally he gets a bunch of tv time. We aren’t *supposed* to like it.

It wasn’t enough that Mox turn on Danielson. We needed to be damaged by it. Real ‘Red Wedding’ ####.

It wasn’t enough that Page and Strickland have a match that AEW would make “unsanctioned.” They had to show exactly why. It has to *mean something* when they advertise these sorts of shows.
It wasn’t enough that they have a “blood feud” and hate each other, and they weren’t wrestling they were fighting. All of those things have to mean something.

Art is supposed to elicit emotion. Movies and TV have done it for decades, traditional arts like painting and books have been doing it much longer.
Sometimes the emotion we’re meant to feel isn’t a positive experience. Sometimes we are made to feel uncomfortable by design. We always talk about how wrestling makes us happy and excited and emotional, but rarely these days does an angle make us squirm.

We’re not supposed to have enjoyed watching our favorite babyface descend into madness. We’re not supposed to enjoy watching a beloved champion be brutalized. We’re not supposed to enjoy watching two former friends try to maim one another.

There’s going to be a lot of pushback to what AEW is doing, because the truth is that critical thought - especially with artistic mediums - is severely lacking these days…but from my perspective, AEW is doing something wrestling hasn’t done in a very long time: it’s making us believe.

[Ozy_Flame]

I love that Yuta, Claudio and PAC are still trios champions. That really ramps up the intrigue for me.

Kudos to the writers going in a bold new direction.

[SuperMatt18]

Originally Posted by LIP MAN

Last night had a ton of storylines happening. Was actually brilliant, even the Willow/Statlander feud came to an end. Have to appreciate the story in the story with Jack Perry/Luchaurus right before the BCC turn on Danielson. Someone on Reddit articulated it perfectly well:

I don’t think we are supposed to have “enjoyed” the main event.

There were some moments at the show which made plenty of people feel uncomfortable or otherwise displeased. On paper that sounds like a problem, but I really do feel like it was by design.

The company is no stranger to doing what it can to sell a gimmick or story to viewers. People complain about Jericho’s tv time, so naturally he gets a bunch of tv time. We aren’t *supposed* to like it.

It wasn’t enough that Mox turn on Danielson. We needed to be damaged by it. Real ‘Red Wedding’ ####.

It wasn’t enough that Page and Strickland have a match that AEW would make “unsanctioned.” They had to show exactly why. It has to *mean something* when they advertise these sorts of shows.
It wasn’t enough that they have a “blood feud” and hate each other, and they weren’t wrestling they were fighting. All of those things have to mean something.

Art is supposed to elicit emotion. Movies and TV have done it for decades, traditional arts like painting and books have been doing it much longer.
Sometimes the emotion we’re meant to feel isn’t a positive experience. Sometimes we are made to feel uncomfortable by design. We always talk about how wrestling makes us happy and excited and emotional, but rarely these days does an angle make us squirm.

We’re not supposed to have enjoyed watching our favorite babyface descend into madness. We’re not supposed to enjoy watching a beloved champion be brutalized. We’re not supposed to enjoy watching two former friends try to maim one another.

There’s going to be a lot of pushback to what AEW is doing, because the truth is that critical thought - especially with artistic mediums - is severely lacking these days…but from my perspective, AEW is doing something wrestling hasn’t done in a very long time: it’s making us believe.

It's fine to want to do these things, but movies and art are fake and rehearsed under the careful watch and eye of stunt coordinators, leverage multiple takes and lots of post production effects.

Stuff like the needle or even the plastic bag on Danielson is fine because it's somewhat easy to rig and ensure that nothing too serious can happen. Make sure the bag is easily to rip, the needle isn't going to do any real serious damage. It's visually jarring but not risky (although IMO overused by AEW at this point).

My issue is more with stuff like the Cinder Block which did not look to be "worked" at all based on how it held up and didn't break or even crack at all.

The margin for error with that was so narrow.

[LIP MAN]

Originally Posted by Ozy_Flame

I love that Yuta, Claudio and PAC are still trios champions. That really ramps up the intrigue for me.

Kudos to the writers going in a bold new direction.

Absolutely! Yuma being forced to watch means they’re trying to initiate him but didn’t want to tell him. And we still don’t know what else might happen, but I’m definitely intrigued AEW has really been great the last while, just a lot of PR noise from bots and a tribal IWC as there’s a lot of great stuff they built up here.

[Blaster86]

The only people who have been calling it great are the people who were calling it great when it was objectively awful. It's definitely better. It's definitely getting a better more cohesive story. I am not sure I am going to anoint it "Great."


It sounds like Danielson is going to part time as of now. MJF and Swerve are both taking some time off. I am hoping the thinness at the top of the card sees Okada separate from the Elite and does his own thing. I am also hopeful we see Omega back sooner than later.

[CaptainCrunch]

Another back stage fight at AEW

https://twitter.com/user/status/1832922616090206273


Its strange that MJF just came back a few months ago and now he's gone again.

[Buff]

So... Something big happened. We don't know what. It was probably nothing?

[trackercowe]

Wait.... I thought Punk was the reason for all the problems backstage? Tony said things were doing better without him!

[Ozy_Flame]

As SRS said, it was a big nothingburger.

Again, just the IWC and hotshot reporters trying to arson their way into the narrative of AEW and their (hopeful) demise.

[Blaster86]

It's being reported that nothing actually ended up happening as security was on the scene asap.

Buuuuut, why the #### does this keep happening?!

[SuperMatt18]

I think part of it is AEW really seems to have a culture of "We do what we want".

Seems that all these issues generally pop up when somebody (production team member, another wrestler) tells another wrestler "you shouldn't' be doing that".

Lots of egos, no real "leader" in terms of somebody that commands the locker room, and Tony Khan has let too many people get a way with too much stuff TBH.

CM Punk should have probably been let go the first time there was an issue, Bucks and Elite got a paid vacation and no real punishment, same thing with Jack Perry - he got a paid vacation and came back to it being used in storyline to give him a push.

There's been no real consequences to any of the supposed "bad behavior" so it's just going to keep happening. (Part of it is the roster is just too damn big too).

The freedom does lead to a pretty good product at times, but I think TK does need to start putting a bit more structure in place around him to manage the locker room and card a little more. I think at this point WWE is probably over produced at times in terms of the match scripting and promo scripting (although sounds like that's softened a bit since Vince was forced out), but I think AEW is probably too far at the other end of the spectrum where some of the matches / promos / back stage stuff could use a little more structure.

[TheIronMaiden]

Brett Hart is announced to return to WWE tonight at the dome.

[TheIronMaiden]

Originally Posted by LIP MAN

Last night had a ton of storylines happening. Was actually brilliant, even the Willow/Statlander feud came to an end. Have to appreciate the story in the story with Jack Perry/Luchaurus right before the BCC turn on Danielson. Someone on Reddit articulated it perfectly well:

I don’t think we are supposed to have “enjoyed” the main event.

There were some moments at the show which made plenty of people feel uncomfortable or otherwise displeased. On paper that sounds like a problem, but I really do feel like it was by design.

The company is no stranger to doing what it can to sell a gimmick or story to viewers. People complain about Jericho’s tv time, so naturally he gets a bunch of tv time. We aren’t *supposed* to like it.

It wasn’t enough that Mox turn on Danielson. We needed to be damaged by it. Real ‘Red Wedding’ ####.

It wasn’t enough that Page and Strickland have a match that AEW would make “unsanctioned.” They had to show exactly why. It has to *mean something* when they advertise these sorts of shows.
It wasn’t enough that they have a “blood feud” and hate each other, and they weren’t wrestling they were fighting. All of those things have to mean something.

Art is supposed to elicit emotion. Movies and TV have done it for decades, traditional arts like painting and books have been doing it much longer.
Sometimes the emotion we’re meant to feel isn’t a positive experience. Sometimes we are made to feel uncomfortable by design. We always talk about how wrestling makes us happy and excited and emotional, but rarely these days does an angle make us squirm.

We’re not supposed to have enjoyed watching our favorite babyface descend into madness. We’re not supposed to enjoy watching a beloved champion be brutalized. We’re not supposed to enjoy watching two former friends try to maim one another.

There’s going to be a lot of pushback to what AEW is doing, because the truth is that critical thought - especially with artistic mediums - is severely lacking these days…but from my perspective, AEW is doing something wrestling hasn’t done in a very long time: it’s making us believe.

I want to start by saying that I really try not to criticize AEW because it's fun that people like it and cool that it is happening.

That said, the "red wedding" is so intense because people are emotionally invest in the characters and their cause.

AEW does a great job of the wrestling, and their aesthetic of blurring lines between Heel and face is refreshing. But ultimately their story telling is spastic and confusing, and it makes their WTF spots look like they mean nothing other than to make people go ew... anyways.

[SuperMatt18]

Originally Posted by TheIronMaiden

I want to start by saying that I really try not to criticize AEW because it's fun that people like it and cool that it is happening.

That said, the "red wedding" is so intense because people are emotionally invest in the characters and their cause.

AEW does a great job of the wrestling, and their aesthetic of blurring lines between Heel and face is refreshing. But ultimately their story telling is spastic and confusing, and it makes their WTF spots look like they mean nothing other than to make people go ew... anyways.

At least in this case of All Out AEW had actually built up fueds where it makes sense that it was a bit of a "blood fued" and it wasn't some random Moxley match on a Wednesday night where he needed to blade just for fun.

Statlander vs Willow was a grudge match - it wasn't a story focused on as much since the women don't get a ton of TV time but it was a long running fued.

Page and Strickland was a good long running fued that while it seems like it was bit rushed into this time period because of the All In / All Out timing but it had enough history to overcome that.

Still probably didn't need to do everything they did at All Out but in the case of those two fueds at least they did build it to make some sense that they'd hate each other enough to go to these lengths.

(Personally I think they could have done an even better build for Hangman/Swerve. They should have had Hangman win the Owen, beat Swerve for the title at All In by cheating, then have Danielson beat Hangman for the title at All Out due to Swerve's interference, and then have this Lights Out Steel cage match at either WrestleDream or Full Gear after more of a immediate build and even more reason for these two men to hate each other.)

[Blaster86]

Strickland/Hangman felt rushed because it was. They pushed it up as a way to write Swerve off TV.

[trackercowe]

That's unfortunate if Bryan, Swerve, and MJF will be off television for some time. That's their top three main eventers all out at once. I'm guessing Moxley's new angle will become the focal point of the show. I still don't understand how it all connects to Darby... Darby also has an upcoming match for the title.... As does Christian? It's all very confusing at times. Too many cokes in the kitchen.

I went to Smackdown on Friday. Good show. Nothing spectacular, and was hoping Orton would show. He must hate coming to Edmonton (not that I blame him), as he's missed every show I've been at. It was fun seeing Jacob Fatu in person, and it's obvious he'll be a future main eventer. Sounds like Levesque knows this too, and Fatu has been well received backstage. The heat for Dominick in the dark match was outstanding. The audience really hates him! He rarely wins matches and is booked to be a chicken #### heel, yet it's worked out so well. I don't think he should be losing to Kofi, and eventually Dom should work his way up the card. It would be interesting to see the audience's reaction to him winning a major title. Zayn and Owens are super over with the crowd. Although the biggest chant was "Let's go Oilers", Yuck... Waller trolling the crowd was awesome.

Enjoy the show tonight. I hope they find a good use for Bret, rather than just an appearance. A shame Punk may not be there tonight, as having Punk and Hart together in the same ring would have been a treat.