Israel declares war on Hamas

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by Snuffleupagus

Look moron, what white nationalist video's? explain them and point the way to this white nationalist youtube channel that I shared them from.

Here's my thinking, if I ever posted a video that offended your anti-white brain it probably came from a real news source, ABC,NBC,BBC..etc because there's zero chance I posted from a white nationalist youtube channel,you know why, because I absolutely hate the hard right, can't stand the bible thumping idiots that support it and I hope Trump dies in jail for turning the USA upside down with his racistism and bigotry.

The ones you posted, from a white nationalist YouTube channel, that people have already provided the links to the post you did it in. The ones you described as depicting people, I quote:

Originally Posted by Snuffleupagus

It's called fighting back, if you think the brits wont respond to some of the antics the muslums are doing in London think again. I could post some real disturbing stuff happening there but I suspect you know about them. If you don't just search "muslims in London" to see the problems.

Looking back, it looks like you had shared content from the BNP. Definitely not from a mainstream media source, and in fact, when someone else posted someone from Channel 4, you immediately suggested I would call them a white nationalist as well, to which I responded I would not because they had posted from a legitimate news source instead of a far-right hate group.

Now, can you please explain, without calling me names, how I am a racist for pointing out that you have posted white nationalist content, and additionally, how it makes sense to you that I must be watching the (since banned from YouTube) channels you have shared from?

[Snuffleupagus]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

The ones you posted, from a white nationalist YouTube channel, that people have already provided the links to the post you did it in. The ones you described as depicting people, I quote:



Looking back, it looks like you had shared content from the BNP. Definitely not from a mainstream media source, and in fact, when someone else posted someone from Channel 4, you immediately suggested I would call them a white nationalist as well, to which I responded I would not because they had posted from a legitimate news source instead of a far-right hate group.

Now, can you please explain, without calling me names, how I am a racist for pointing out that you have posted white nationalist content, and additionally, how it makes sense to you that I must be watching the (since banned from YouTube) channels you have shared from?

Whats BNP? found one on youtube but it's from Uganda and it's not in english. your brother Zary says he saw the videos but neither one of you will describe them.

I seriously can't remember what exactly was in them but in the post I said:

"Rioting Muslims attack Christians protesters in UK screaming "get out of OUR country"

So tell me how on earth does this make me a racist or white nationalist? because it hurt your pea-brained faith? It dawned on me you won't describe them because they were just troubling news out of London that was probably carried by the BBC or CNN

I'm done with both(?) of you clowns, now on ignore.

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by Snuffleupagus

Whats BNP? found one on youtube but it's from Uganda and it's not in english. your brother Zary says he saw the videos but neither one of you will describe them.

I seriously can't remember what exactly was in them but in the post I said:

"Rioting Muslims attack Christians protesters in UK screaming "get out of OUR country"

So tell me how on earth does this make me a racist or white nationalist? because it hurt your pea-brained faith? It dawned on me you won't describe them because they were just troubling news out of London that was probably carried by the BBC or CNN

I'm done with both(?) of you clowns, now on ignore.

The British National Party. Far-right fascists. Since you’re not admitting you know the post in question then it would be a lie to pretend this wasn’t already covered and that this definitely was not from a mainstream news channel.

Why would the BBC or CNN have had their channels removed from YouTube for violating ToS? Hint: they don’t, which is why the channel you shared from is none of those channels.

It’s amazing that you were denying the video entirely but are now claiming videos removed for violating YouTube terms of service were just troubling news out of London from the BBC lol. Guess you got caught, oh well. Try to save the accusations of racism going forward, doesn’t mean much from you.

[GGG]

Nm

[Zary's-Mustache]

I'm actually offended on Pepsifree's behalf that you think we are the same person.

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by Zary's-Mustache

I'm actually offended on Pepsifree's behalf that you think we are the same person.

It makes such little sense I just assumed a malady affecting the mind is to blame.

You should give yourself a pat on the back, though. How many different posters have you been accused of being? Alt-accounts, recently banned, troll legends. You’re everyone and no one at this point.

[CalgaryKid12]

Hi all. Long-time CP reader, first time poster.

I’ve read through quite a bit of this thread, and I’d like to share my experiences and add context to this discussion in the hopes of deescalating some of the vitriol here. I’m hoping to keep this to a one-time post and don’t plan on replying to anything afterwards.

A bit of background about me (and to be upfront about my biases), I’m a 31-year-old male, born and raised in Calgary, Flames fan, Jewish, and a Zionist.

Before starting, I’d like to state for the record that what’s going on in Gaza is horrible. It’s not right for innocent civilians to pay for the decisions of their leaders. My heart aches for each and every person who has lost a loved one in this conflict.

I find it quite interesting how many people on this forum speak so confidently about the Israel-Palestine conflict, yet I question, how many of you have been to Israel? Or even know a Jewish person? I have been immersed in this subject for my whole life, so I feel as though I have a pretty good understanding in this matter. But to understand Israel, it’s necessary to understand what goes on outside of Israel first.

Shortly after the attacks on October 7th, there was a video that was posted online that had a senior Hamas official call for a “day of Jihad” against Jews around the world. Now some of you might say that the video was fake, I dno I’ve heard it all, but either way, the message was real, and the fear was real. I know numerous parents that didn’t send their kids to school that day in the fear that some crazy extremist would take this call to action seriously and attack Jewish communities. Now tell me, have any one of you personally experienced fear for your life for simply practicing your religion/beliefs? It felt like an act of resistance to simply be publicly Jewish that day.

More recently, right in our backyard of Calgary, the area beside the Jewish school that I attended and the synagogue that I currently attend was defaced with pro-Palestine/anti-Israel graffiti. For what? What good does this accomplish? Or is this simply just intimidation against people of Jewish faith? Sure seems like that to me. Going a little more broadly across Canada, Jewish schools across in Toronto or Montreal have been shot at. A synagogue in Vancouver was set on fire. Numerous people have been arrested across Canada for plotting heinous actions against Jewish communities. Again, is the support for Palestine, protesting Israeli politics, or just blatant antisemitism? This isn’t happening in Europe, the Middle East, or even the US… This is just in Canada! If that’s how bad things are here, can you imagine what it’s like in other parts of the world? I mean just at this Olympics, there were “pro-Palestine” protesters that showed up to an Israeli soccer match and chanted “Heil Hitler” as the Israeli players entered onto the field. Now is that anti-Zionist, or anti-Jewish? Is there a difference? The lines sure do seem to be blurred to me.

Now that we’ve established that significant antisemitism still exists, what does that have to do with Israel? As I hope many of you are aware a little over 80 years ago the Holocaust occurred where 6 million Jews were murdered simply for being Jewish. Thankfully my grandparents were already in North America at that time, but much of my extended family was exterminated during that period. The curious thing is that no one really talks about the generational trauma associated with an event as significant as that. I am here to bring to light what that generational trauma is: antisemitism still exists and one day they will come for us (Jews) again. During the Holocaust, countless countries would not accept Jews as they were trying to flee religious persecution in Europe. Hence the rise of Zionism. A belief that Jews need their own country so that they could be free from religious persecution. Further, through generations Zionism has evolved into: we need to keep Israel so that if/when the world comes hunting for us again, we all have a place to be safe. This isn’t an excuse for Israel to do whatever it wants and murder whoever it wants in the name of the Holocaust, but Israel is needed as a safe haven for Jews worldwide, and the Israeli government has a unique obligation to maintain that above all else.

The question begs, how do you maintain a stable and safe country when many of the countries around you hate you and your people? There is no one simple answer here. There’s a multitude of methods employed, some of which are defensive (i.e. the Iron Dome), and some of which are offensive (operation Swords of Iron). Furthermore, how does one measure the success of these decisions? Or even compare them to other decisions that aren’t made? No one talks about the bomb that doesn’t go off. Hypothetically speaking here, but what if Israel/Palestine came to a ceasefire within a month, without destroying the amount of Hamas' militant infrastructure that they have. It’s quite possible that in a year’s time, Hamas orders another massive military operation on Israel, resulting in even more deaths of innocent civilians on the Israeli side. I mean, the last uprising was in 2021 with a quick ceasefire agreement reached, and in just a little over 2 years from that time, Hamas carries out the worst attack on Israeli soil ever. That’s your datapoint. It’s not a hypothetical situation. The job of the Israeli government is to protect Israeli lives, and so a decision was made to conduct a drastic offensive operation.

Now conversely, there are nuances within Israeli politics where currently there is a far-right government is in place due to a coalition. That’s emboldening Israelis in the West Bank to become increasingly aggressive. For the record, I disagree with this. Yet this further highlights my point, it’s a highly complex situation and you can disagree with one portion of the Israeli policy, while still supporting Israel’s right for self-determination and safety of its citizens. But it does not give anyone the right to protest the “Zionist entity’s” existence and intimidate people for being Jewish.

To summarize (or TLDR): Jews have generational trauma from the Holocaust and having Israel as a safe haven is necessary in case the antisemitism in this world boils over again and results in another genocide against Jews.

To back up many of the facts that I have mentioned in the post above, I have included links to them below under a spoiler tag. I also want to include one last link which is an overview of the history in the region by Ben Shapiro (who I know many of you dislike). I know it’s definitely biased, but nowadays, who isn’t? Either way, it’s consistent with the facts that I learned growing up and the video does a good job summarizing the events.

In closing, thank you for letting me share my story. I hope that I was able to shed some new light on a complex situation and I truly hope for an end to this horrific conflict as soon as possible.

Spoiler!

Links:
https://nationalpost.com/news/israel-hamas-day-of-jihad
https://www.msn.com/en-in/news/Hindi...d=BingNewsVerp
https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/world...d=BingNewsVerp
https://www.theobserver.ca/news/cana...eal-restaurant
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/montr...hool-1.7211792
https://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/canad...d=BingNewsVerp
https://nationalpost.com/opinion/rah...-canadian-jews
https://www.theglobeandmail.com/cana...gainst-jewish/
https://www.tmz.com/2024/07/29/pro-p...-soccer-match/
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dEoV...U3bdaw&index=8

[Bagor]

It's nearly as if Nage Waza and DrStarvey had a baby between them excusing and defending the ongoing genocide whilst playing the poor me, antisemitic card. Whilst saying I'm not excusing it, but I am.

Originally Posted by CalgaryKid12

This isn’t an excuse for Israel to do whatever it wants and murder whoever it wants in the name of the Holocaust, but Israel is needed as a safe haven for Jews worldwide, and the Israeli government has a unique obligation to maintain that above all else.

This isn’t an excuse for Israel to do whatever it wants and murder whoever it wants in the name of the Holocaust, but ......you know what I'm going to say that it is.

Originally Posted by CalgaryKid12

The job of the Israeli government is to protect Israeli lives, and so a decision was made to conduct a drastic offensive operation.

CalgaryKid's new name for the murder of tens of thousands of civilians, decimation of a health care system, deliberate starvation of a whole population.

Not a genocide. It's a "drastic offensive operation". It's their job

Originally Posted by CalgaryKid12

But it does not give anyone the right to protest the “Zionist entity’s” existence and intimidate people for being Jewish.

No it doesn't but that doesn't change the fact that a significant part of the planet find the genocide and anyone that supports it disgusting. People have every right to protest the genocide and show support for the Palestinian people. Deal with it.

Originally Posted by CalgaryKid12

Jews have generational trauma from the Holocaust and having Israel as a safe haven is necessary in case the antisemitism in this world boils over again and results in another genocide against Jews.

Again, This is the guy that said above that "This isn’t an excuse for Israel to do whatever it wants and murder whoever it wants in the name of the Holocaust".

Love the finish.Here'a Ben Shipiro video. I know it's definitely biased but here it is anyways.

And your post wasn't a story it was a long winded defence and justification for genocide.

[AltaGuy]

That was one long, clueless post CalgaryKid12. Have you ever been to a Palestinian refugee camp?

[jayswin]

Wow, and he actually got two thanks for that.

[PepsiFree]

How many new accounts will be created or dead ones resurrected almost solely in the name of justifying or promoting genocide and painting the people against it as the monsters?

Fascinating watching propaganda at work, regardless of where you stand on the subject.

[Firebot]

Originally Posted by Pointman

Back to your question, there's no such things as "acceptable" and "not acceptable" in wars. Wars themselves are not acceptable. Yet, once it's on you do whatever it takes to win. If it means, that you must take civilians and let them clean up the traps set up by Hamas - go for it.

No...no it absolutely does not.

I have seen videos of Israeli soldiers sending blindfolded Palestinians to run a direction to pick them off as sport. I have seen videos of Israeli soldiers tying up Palestinians on top of vehicles. I have seen videos of Israeli settlers beating up West Bank Palestinian families with bats while being supported by Israeli soldiers.

And these are systemic and daily. In the past 24 hours there are videos of Israeli soldiers sniping and shooting at clearly identified and unarmed reporters. There's even videos of a mule with food supplies being killed for fun (one posted today). I counted 10 sniper shots in the video...on a mule.

These are actions we have seen from Russia against Ukrainian citizens. We are seeing Israelis doing the same against Palestinians.

None of this is about winning a war and these acts are systemic, to the point where Israeli hostages waving a makeshift white flag were mistakenly gunned down by Israeli soldiers as they were killing for sport. Such acts are warcrimes and genocide. Hamas's atrocious actions, usage of hospitals as human shields and Palestinian support for Hamas, Hamas wishing for the total annihilation of Israel as a state, does in no way give a carte blanche for Israelis to commit genocide on civilians

We see Ukrainians in Russia right now...and we do not see similar videos of warcrimes committed against Russian citizens. Quite the opposite in fact.

Israel absolutely has a right to defend itself and eliminate threats against its existence, and this could mean collateral damage is necessary evil to achieve success. This is not what is happening right now

[Sliver]

lol, here is all my BS. "I don't plan on replying."

So brave.

[Zary's-Mustache]

https://mondoweiss.net/2024/08/65-of...ian-detainees/

65% of Israeli jews believe the soldiers who raped Palestinian prisoners shouldn't be charged.

We kept hearing about rape on Oct 7th and people were rightfully outraged and yet we have silence after the rape of palestinians by media outlets who are zionist owned.

65%. We kept hearing about stats and how Gazans support rape but yet no big media outlet will dare do a story on this.

Edit: shouldn't **

[GGG]

I think that’s slightly misleading as the alternative question getting the 65% was that they be subject to internal discipline with no description of what that is. Not the best polling to get an objective view on the situation. It may just represent faith in the army to discipline their troops rather than a rejection of discipline.

Only 28% wanting criminal charges is quite low though

[CalgaryKid12]

Originally Posted by Sliver

lol, here is all my BS. "I don't plan on replying."

So brave.

Yep, my extended family being exterminated in the Holocaust and Jewish schools/synagogues being shot at is "all BS".

But good to know where you stand on these subjects... or should I say "propaganda" as PepsiFree so eloquently put it.

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by CalgaryKid12

Yep, my extended family being exterminated in the Holocaust and Jewish schools/synagogues being shot at is "all BS".

But good to know where you stand on these subjects... or should I say "propaganda" as PepsiFree so eloquently put it.

If you’re going to make a long post where your sole focus is October 7, anti-semitism abroad, and the holocaust, while totally ignoring what’s happening in Gaza outside of using the aforementioned, including the holocaust to justify/explain away the actions of the Israel government and paint Israel as clear victims and Palestinians as the aggressors/danger… what would you call it?

If it wasn’t already clear from the above, attempting to suggest Sliver or I are suggesting the holocaust is BS or propaganda makes it totally clear what your intentions are, and is completely insane.

[TheIronMaiden]

The Holocaust is sad, really sad, certainly one of the worst things in the 20th century, maybe one of the worst things ever, Systematic killing of an entire ethnic group and displacing them from their ancestral lands is horrific and should never happen again.

[Zary's-Mustache]

What I don't get is why are graffiti on synagogues painted as it's the pro Palestinian side as a whole who did that.

It's not like when the Pro israeli person who stabbed that little 6 year old boy and killed him was a representation of the Israeli side.

3 Palestinian students were shot in Vermont and nobody claimed it was a representation of the Israeli side.

Antisemitism through graffiti is awful but don't try to pretend it's a representation of the people in this thread standing up against Israel or the people speaking out against Israel's genocide.

At some point you need to stop playing the victim all the time and argue in good faith.

[CliffFletcher]

If not being careful about avoiding civilians casualties among the enemy you’re at war with = genocide, then the Allies committed genocide against Germany and Japan in WW2.