You Know What Really Grinds My Gears? Now with 3x more gears...

[Dion]

Originally Posted by TrentCrimmIndependent

Well, now you guys can't get mad and stomp your feet over future Walls of Shame

You had your chance to stick it to me by making me biggest jerk (annoyance, whatever)

Didn't even get me through round two!
I guess y'all have softened up.

May the fleas of a thousand camels infest your groin area.

[curves2000]

Spent a few days in Edmonton on a few different trips in the last month and it's shockingly bad how the social decay from opioids and fentanyl is there. Shocking the size, scope, width and more it is. All across the city you see an incredible amount of sketchy people to a different degree. It really is Vancouver downtown eastside light.

Calgary has a lot of this currently I am sick of it here and everywhere really. This is a complete and utter failure across the board from everybody. We are talking about untold billions in dollars spent and we are going backwards.

What is the actual strategy here? What are governments, people, organizations and corporations doing about this issue? Why is nobody being held to account?? Why are people not thinking about citizens concerned and fed up with this problem? Business and employees who have to deal with the social decay of people just to try and put food on the table and a roof over there heads and still have to deal with the safety risks?

I know we like to joke around about Edmonton being no good but this is a problem right around the country. Edmonton is the capital of the supposedly wealthiest province in Canada, one which spends the most on healthcare and we are being put to the brink as a result? How do we expect others to fair better. Everybody who I talked to this weekend across the board has been affected by this to untold degrees. It makes you wonder from a strategic perspective, who is doing this and what is the end goal with a lot of these problems that are intertwined.

An ICU Dr friend in Edmonton brought up a good point. How many people in Canada don't have basic access to a family Dr, including the above mentioned addicts. He can fire off enough patient names he has personally looked after with these issues where the total expense to the system is $500k-1 million in the last year or two+.

Be much much better Canada. Our future matters too

[undercoverbrother]

Originally Posted by curves2000

Spent a few days in Edmonton on a few different trips in the last month and it's shockingly bad how the social decay from opioids and fentanyl is there. Shocking the size, scope, width and more it is. All across the city you see an incredible amount of sketchy people to a different degree. It really is Vancouver downtown eastside light.

Calgary has a lot of this currently I am sick of it here and everywhere really. This is a complete and utter failure across the board from everybody. We are talking about untold billions in dollars spent and we are going backwards.

What is the actual strategy here? What are governments, people, organizations and corporations doing about this issue? Why is nobody being held to account?? Why are people not thinking about citizens concerned and fed up with this problem? Business and employees who have to deal with the social decay of people just to try and put food on the table and a roof over there heads and still have to deal with the safety risks?

I know we like to joke around about Edmonton being no good but this is a problem right around the country. Edmonton is the capital of the supposedly wealthiest province in Canada, one which spends the most on healthcare and we are being put to the brink as a result? How do we expect others to fair better. Everybody who I talked to this weekend across the board has been affected by this to untold degrees. It makes you wonder from a strategic perspective, who is doing this and what is the end goal with a lot of these problems that are intertwined.

An ICU Dr friend in Edmonton brought up a good point. How many people in Canada don't have basic access to a family Dr, including the above mentioned addicts. He can fire off enough patient names he has personally looked after with these issues where the total expense to the system is $500k-1 million in the last year or two+.

Be much much better Canada. Our future matters too

“It makes you wonder from a strategic perspective, who is doing this and what is the end goal with a lot of these problems that are intertwined.”

[iggy_oi]

Originally Posted by curves2000

Spent a few days in Edmonton on a few different trips in the last month and it's shockingly bad how the social decay from opioids and fentanyl is there. Shocking the size, scope, width and more it is. All across the city you see an incredible amount of sketchy people to a different degree. It really is Vancouver downtown eastside light.

Calgary has a lot of this currently I am sick of it here and everywhere really. This is a complete and utter failure across the board from everybody. We are talking about untold billions in dollars spent and we are going backwards.

What is the actual strategy here? What are governments, people, organizations and corporations doing about this issue? Why is nobody being held to account?? Why are people not thinking about citizens concerned and fed up with this problem? Business and employees who have to deal with the social decay of people just to try and put food on the table and a roof over there heads and still have to deal with the safety risks?

I know we like to joke around about Edmonton being no good but this is a problem right around the country. Edmonton is the capital of the supposedly wealthiest province in Canada, one which spends the most on healthcare and we are being put to the brink as a result? How do we expect others to fair better. Everybody who I talked to this weekend across the board has been affected by this to untold degrees. It makes you wonder from a strategic perspective, who is doing this and what is the end goal with a lot of these problems that are intertwined.

An ICU Dr friend in Edmonton brought up a good point. How many people in Canada don't have basic access to a family Dr, including the above mentioned addicts. He can fire off enough patient names he has personally looked after with these issues where the total expense to the system is $500k-1 million in the last year or two+.

Be much much better Canada. Our future matters too

In what universe does Alberta spend the most on healthcare out of any province?

Statements like that make it hard to believe that you have yet another “friend” who based on their alleged job title happens to be a good source of knowledge for a particular field. One might even consider them an expert.

I’m not trying to be a dick here(though I’m sure some would argue that I’m probably failing somewhat in that regard) but you’ve really gotta stop trying to bull#### people like that.

[Fuzz]

https://www.cihi.ca/en/how-do-the-pr...tories-compare


We are basically middle of the pack. If you think Alberta has been on a poor healthcare trajectory for a long time, maybe don't vote for the same losers who don't know how to manage it over and over? Particularly ones who tell you how they are going to destroy the system in the months and years before electing them? I dunno, just a thought.

[SutterBrother]

Were things actually worse during the war on drugs than they are now?

I want to have sympathy and compassion for homeless and addicts - hate the sickness not the person - but it's tough when every morning I get up to check the ring camera and see people walking by on the street checking every car door.

I find it hard to believe that mass decriminalization of drugs is going to help this issue.

I am probably wrong. I'd love to hear how this gets better.

[bc-chris]

Originally Posted by SutterBrother

Were things actually worse during the war on drugs than they are now?

I want to have sympathy and compassion for homeless and addicts - hate the sickness not the person - but it's tough when every morning I get up to check the ring camera and see people walking by on the street checking every car door.

I find it hard to believe that mass decriminalization of drugs is going to help this issue.

I am probably wrong. I'd love to hear how this gets better.

it's all about ending homelessness...

my band played at a house party 2 weekends ago. it was a private party and lots of kids were there. during a set break i went into the house to use the bathroom and a woman who was well into her 50s was talking with a bunch of the kids (12-17 yrs old) that were at the party. she was going on and on about how 'the government' is poisoning the drug supply in order to 'kill off' the homeless population in order to end homelessness.

please stop getting 'facts' from facebook

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by SutterBrother

Were things actually worse during the war on drugs than they are now?

I want to have sympathy and compassion for homeless and addicts - hate the sickness not the person - but it's tough when every morning I get up to check the ring camera and see people walking by on the street checking every car door.

I find it hard to believe that mass decriminalization of drugs is going to help this issue.

I am probably wrong. I'd love to hear how this gets better.

I'm not sure you can compare the 80's to now. The lethality of the drugs, and addictiveness is just so much higher now.


I don't know what you do, but it isn't a problem of one city, region or country. Warmer areas will have it worse, but it is everywhere. I was just in Kingston and on the main restaurant street their was no shortage of people doing drugs openly there, too. Ottawa was the same.

[Titan2]

Saskatoon was really bad as well.

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by Titan2

Saskatoon was really bad as well.

But how was the drug problem?

[powderjunkie]

Originally Posted by bc-chris

it's all about ending homelessness...

my band played at a house party 2 weekends ago. it was a private party and lots of kids were there. during a set break i went into the house to use the bathroom and a woman who was well into her 50s was talking with a bunch of the kids (12-17 yrs old) that were at the party. she was going on and on about how 'the government' is poisoning the drug supply in order to 'kill off' the homeless population in order to end homelessness.

please stop getting 'facts' from facebook

Wait...was this a UCP grooming event?

[Titan2]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

But how was the drug problem?

Substantially improved the situation!

[curves2000]

Originally Posted by iggy_oi

In what universe does Alberta spend the most on healthcare out of any province?

Statements like that make it hard to believe that you have yet another “friend” who based on their alleged job title happens to be a good source of knowledge for a particular field. One might even consider them an expert.

I’m not trying to be a dick here(though I’m sure some would argue that I’m probably failing somewhat in that regard) but you’ve really gotta stop trying to bull#### people like that.

Well said friend who runs two different ICU departments in Edmonton, Royal Alex and University of AB can provide some additional info. There are different ICU departments, FYI. CVICU, NICU, Neurological, surgical etc. He discussed such as when he first got into medicine, the level of drug addiction costs to the ICU department were X % of the total budget where as now they have skyrocketed. ICU costs for things such as workplace accidents, car accidents have actually gone down as a percentage as there has been an increase in safety systems etc.

He has patients that continue to cost his department hundreds of thousands of dollars, a small number of people across Canada are costing the systems across the country billions. This is amongst other system wide issues not related to drugs as well.

I believe Alberta spends or spent the most per capita on health care spending up until very recently. Regardless if they are #1 or 3, Alberta spends money on health care but this isn't just an AB problem. This is Canada wide problem

[undercoverbrother]

Originally Posted by curves2000

Well said friend who runs two different ICU departments in Edmonton, Royal Alex and University of AB can provide some additional info. There are different ICU departments, FYI. CVICU, NICU, Neurological, surgical etc. He discussed such as when he first got into medicine, the level of drug addiction costs to the ICU department were X % of the total budget where as now they have skyrocketed. ICU costs for things such as workplace accidents, car accidents have actually gone down as a percentage as there has been an increase in safety systems etc.

He has patients that continue to cost his department hundreds of thousands of dollars, a small number of people across Canada are costing the systems across the country billions. This is amongst other system wide issues not related to drugs as well.

I believe Alberta spends or spent the most per capita on health care spending up until very recently. Regardless if they are #1 or 3, Alberta spends money on health care but this isn't just an AB problem. This is Canada wide problem

But what about the Men in Suits

[iggy_oi]

Originally Posted by curves2000

Well said friend who runs two different ICU departments in Edmonton, Royal Alex and University of AB can provide some additional info. There are different ICU departments, FYI. CVICU, NICU, Neurological, surgical etc. He discussed such as when he first got into medicine, the level of drug addiction costs to the ICU department were X % of the total budget where as now they have skyrocketed. ICU costs for things such as workplace accidents, car accidents have actually gone down as a percentage as there has been an increase in safety systems etc.

He has patients that continue to cost his department hundreds of thousands of dollars, a small number of people across Canada are costing the systems across the country billions. This is amongst other system wide issues not related to drugs as well.

Sure. I’m really not gonna debate hearsay with you.

I believe Alberta spends or spent the most per capita on health care spending up until very recently. Regardless if they are #1 or 3, Alberta spends money on health care but this isn't just an AB problem. This is Canada wide problem

Some people believe in Santa Clause but(spoiler alert) that doesn’t mean he exists. But theoretically even if we were number 1 there are other factors that need to be considered for why that would be the case. Delivery methods differ from province to province, your friend can probably clue you in on how and why. And if you say this problem is bad across the country I’m not sure why our provincial spending levels would need to be part of the discuss. It’s starting to come off as public healthcare is too expensive rhetoric.

[curves2000]

Originally Posted by undercoverbrother

“It makes you wonder from a strategic perspective, who is doing this and what is the end goal with a lot of these problems that are intertwined.”

Well you can roll your eyes or you can see some things a little more objectively. China is sending and smuggling enough fentanyl into countries like Canada and the US to poison our population, this is not in dispute whatsoever. There is enough evidence that this is deliberate, China is actually subsidizing production of fentanyl and shipping it to us. You seem like a smart person, can you ever envision a scenario where Canada would be subsidizing the production of a known lethal substance that can destroy people and shipping it to China without repercussions? Do you think China would allow major cities and centers to become infected with the level of despair we are seeing in large North American cities? How many days do you think it would take for Chinese authorities to respond with significant sanctions and force?

We know we have a housing crisis of epic proportions yet we are continuing to allow significant increases in immigration. I am not saying this as an anti immigrant stance, I am the son of immigrants and virtually my entire social circle is as well. There are legit concerns where is everybody suppose to live and can they actually afford to live where they work as well. A lot of these workers are also being taken advantage of in various forms.

Housing, food security, food quality, stability in a home, gainful and meaningful employment , legit access to health care, staying away from drugs and more are part of a stable life.

Everything is connected but I don't think people realize that. We have completely normalized what is happening with the fentanyl, homeless, drugs, mental health and more. Look at frontline workers who deal with these people every single day. EMS, police, fire, healthcare workers. Dr shortage in Canada? Sure, let's tax them more in their professional corporations. Nurse shortages? Let's offer them 1% raises during times of inflation when things are exploding in costs. We wonder why healthcare professionals are burned out beyond control. You really want to be dealing with addicts and homeless people who have **** themselves, have maggots infested in them and are beyond abusive for $50 an hour gross income. Probably why A LOT of emergency room nurses have fled the profession and moved to Botox injections and plastic surgery consults.

We can see things in front of us but rather than allowing things to improve and normalize, we keep pretending that there isn't much to see here and let's move on.

[PepsiFree]

China doesn’t actually send fentanyl to Canada.

[curves2000]

Originally Posted by iggy_oi

Sure. I’m really not gonna debate hearsay with you.



Some people believe in Santa Clause but(spoiler alert) that doesn’t mean he exists. But theoretically even if we were number 1 there are other factors that need to be considered for why that would be the case. Delivery methods differ from province to province, your friend can probably clue you in on how and why. And if you say this problem is bad across the country I’m not sure why our provincial spending levels would need to be part of the discuss. It’s starting to come off as public healthcare is too expensive rhetoric.

I think you may be confusing things a little bit. This is an issue across the country because all provinces and healthcare systems are battling this war across the board with limited resources. Lack of funding, lack of cohesion, lack of people to address the said problems. There is a lack of leadership to improve and implement policies that actually improve the situation. There is lot's of talk from people in politics, businesses and organizations about improving things, but are they? We need to attack this problem with a hell of a lot more force and gusto, and yes, expanded funding and resources from healthcare down to policing and recovery. We got to quit messing around and improve things drastically and bringing some very uncomfortable truths to the surface to actually deal with it. Decisions need to be made.

[curves2000]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

China doesn’t actually send fentanyl to Canada.

Are you actually serious right now or are you just looking for a reaction based on a minor technicality? Fentanyl and associated chemical substances are coming from China in mass quantities. There is no dispute in any of this.

What's next, that Mexican cartels don't transport drugs into America? Columbia has absolutely nothing to do with cocaine?

[ResAlien]

We got to quit messing around and improve things drastically and bringing some very uncomfortable truths to the surface to actually deal with it. Decisions need to be made.

What is it curves is trying to get at here. What are these uncomfortable truths and decisions that need to be made? GMG when people won’t just come out and say what they think.