Canadian Federal Politics Thread v5

[chemgear]

Further to the catch and release bail situation in Canada, the Premiers letter to Trudeau about needed bail reform, etc. and the recent murder in Alberta.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/calga...rder-1.7293576

One of the men accused of murdering Rocky View County worker Colin Hough last week was on bail while the other had just finished a prison sentence for crimes that closely align with the allegations faced in the fatal carjacking, CBC News has learned.

Court records reveal new details about the two suspects' involvement with police, the courts and prison.

Around noon on Tuesday, Aug. 6, two men were looking for a vehicle to steal because the truck they'd stolen a day earlier in Calgary broke down after a collision, police say.

Hough, 45, spotted the fire and believed the two men needed help. RCMP say Hough pulled over in his Rocky View County work truck to lend a hand.

Hough and a 39-year-old FortisAlberta employee, who was working in the area, were both shot. Hough died of his injuries. He leaves behind a wife and two young sons.

Upon discovering the shooting scene and abandoned trucks, police issued a shelter-in-place alert for Wheatland County. They lifted the order three hours later and expanded the search into what has become a week-long, provincewide manhunt.

At the time of the shooting, Penner was on bail and was prohibited from possessing weapons, specifically firearms.

Penner is set to go on trial in Edmonton next month on charges of break and enter, four firearms offences and theft.

In December, Penner was convicted of break and enter and received a conditional sentence order, meaning he was allowed to serve his sentence at home, under conditions.

Most recently, Strawberry was facing 27 charges, including a number that closely reflect the allegations he is currently facing in connection with the homicide.

He was handed a three-year prison sentence in August 2021. With credit for time he's already spent in custody, Strawberry had about two years, five months left to serve.

Strawberry is prohibited from possessing firearms or driving.

[Azure]

Everyday I read the news thinking today is the day where the government will finally fix the immigration problem and shut down the foreign worker programs.

But alas.....

[chemgear]

Originally Posted by Azure

Everyday I read the news thinking today is the day where the government will finally fix the immigration problem and shut down the foreign worker programs.

But alas.....

Well, at least Trudeau has admitted that it is literally out of control under their government.

Meanwhile the UN releases a report about our breeding ground for slavery to the world.


https://www.ctvnews.ca/politics/cana...port-1.6999244

Canada's foreign worker program a 'breeding ground for contemporary slavery,' says UN report

The program is administered by Employment and Social Development Canada, Immigration, Refugees and Citizenship Canada and the Canada Border Services Agency. In Quebec, the provincial government is an administrative partner.

"The government defers a significant portion of responsibility for informing temporary foreign workers of their rights to employers, despite the obvious conflict of interest," according to the report.

Because workers lack access to justice, they are at risk of a variety of other abuses, Obokata wrote.

"The Special Rapporteur received reports of underpayment and wage theft, physical, emotional and verbal abuse, excessive work hours, limited breaks, extracontractual work, uncompensated managerial duties, lack of personal protective equipment, including in hazardous conditions ... Women reported sexual harassment, exploitation and abuse."

Link to their report:

https://documents.un.org/doc/undoc/g...f/g2412097.pdf

[Azure]

Everyday someone else admits its a massive problem.

The UN is saying it amounts to slavery or creates an environment where the workers are treated more like slaves.

And yet nothing is done.

But everyday those morons in the Liberal Party go to the press and blame everyone else for what is going on.

I guess we'll wait till tomorrow. Maybe something will be done then.

[iggy_oi]

Anti-immigrant rhetoric being used to distract people from realizing that the primary reason why those workers are being exploited is the lack of protections that all workers would still be left with even if the TFW program went away today.

Classic.

[chemgear]

All the cheap imported labor is having the expected effects on unemployment and reducing wages across the board.


https://www.bnnbloomberg.ca/business...D19%20pandemic.

It’s getting harder for young Canadians to find a job. A post-pandemic influx of cheap foreign workers in restaurants and retail stores may be making it tougher.

That’s contributing to a soaring rate of youth unemployment. Two years ago, the jobless rate for people 15 to 24 years old was a little over 9%. Now it’s 14.2% — the highest level in more than a decade outside of the Covid-19 pandemic.

For younger immigrants — those who’ve landed in Canada in the past five years — the unemployment rate is around 23%.

An analysis of government data by Bloomberg News shows explosive growth in the number of temporary foreign workers in food and retail over the past five years. The number of them approved to work in those two sectors jumped 211% between 2019 and 2023.

“In a sense what we’re doing is we’re subsidizing those activities by allowing them to bring in low-wage workers rather than make them pay a competitive wage,” said Christopher Worswick, economics department chair at Carleton University in Ottawa, who co-wrote a peer-reviewed report showing firms prefer temporary foreign workers due to their higher efforts for the same wage.

[belsarius]

Those damned Liberals.. just sitting there doing nothing about the issues with the TFW program. Oh wait.....

Minister Boissonnault announces new measures to address fraud in Canada’s Temporary Foreign Worker Program

Government of Canada continues to take action to protect Temporary Foreign Workers, non-compliant employer penalties increased by 36%

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by iggy_oi

Anti-immigrant rhetoric being used to distract people from realizing that the primary reason why those workers are being exploited is the lack of protections that all workers would still be left with even if the TFW program went away today.

Classic.

You almost have to laugh at how strong a case of confirmation bias it is.

“The TFW amounts to slavery where immigrants are being made vulnerable.”

“SEE? Everybody knows immigrants are the problem!”

Most normal people know the problems being highlighted by that UN report are not the problems people complaining about immigration and the existence of the TFW program are talking about. And yet…

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by belsarius

Those damned Liberals.. just sitting there doing nothing about the issues with the TFW program. Oh wait.....

That’s closing the barn door after the horse has bolted.

Globe and Mail editorial (Aug 10):

Fraud in the temporary worker program isn’t the problem. The rules that rig the labour market are

…This is not an accident: the Liberals rewrote the rules for the temporary foreign worker program two years ago and further opened the taps for low-wage workers from abroad.

There were three key changes to the low-wage stream of the temporary foreign worker program, separate from the agriculture stream. Previously, companies with permits under the low-wage stream could not fill more than 10 per cent of their positions with temporary foreign workers. In 2022, that cap rose to 20 per cent for all sectors, and to 30 per cent for seven sectors deemed to be particularly suffering from labour shortages.

The government also doubled the period for which labour market impact assessments were valid to 18 months from nine months. Those assessments are the basis for obtaining a permit for workers, and are supposed to show that no Canadian citizens or permanent residents could fill the positions.

In addition, the Liberals waived a rule that had prohibited companies in the accommodation and retail sectors from hiring temporary foreign workers when the local unemployment rate was 6 per cent or higher...

… But the Liberals, egged on by business, bought into the notion that the solution to tight labour markets was to allow companies to import cheap labour rather than to increase wages, or to boost the productivity of their existing staff.

The effect of all of those changes was to dramatically weaken the link between labour market conditions and the low-wage temporary foreign worker program, even as the number of workers permitted to enter Canada soared.

Rising unemployment levels would have slowed that intake under the old regulations. Not so under the new rules...

… But the real problem with the low-wage temporary foreign worker program is not abuse of the rules – it’s the rules themselves. The press release from Mr. Boisonnault’s office boldly stated that the temporary foreign worker program “is designed as an extraordinary measure to be used when a qualified Canadian is not able to fill a job vacancy.”

That may have been the case once. But now that is demonstrably untrue – and a slap in the face to unemployed workers struggling to find a job while the Liberal government allows businesses to continue to import cheap labour.

[Azure]

Hey don't be bashing the Liberals!

[iggy_oi]

Originally Posted by chemgear

All the cheap imported labor is having the expected effects on unemployment and reducing wages across the board.


https://www.bnnbloomberg.ca/business...D19%20pandemic.

It’s getting harder for young Canadians to find a job. A post-pandemic influx of cheap foreign workers in restaurants and retail stores may be making it tougher.

That’s contributing to a soaring rate of youth unemployment. Two years ago, the jobless rate for people 15 to 24 years old was a little over 9%. Now it’s 14.2% — the highest level in more than a decade outside of the Covid-19 pandemic.

For younger immigrants — those who’ve landed in Canada in the past five years — the unemployment rate is around 23%.

An analysis of government data by Bloomberg News shows explosive growth in the number of temporary foreign workers in food and retail over the past five years. The number of them approved to work in those two sectors jumped 211% between 2019 and 2023.

“In a sense what we’re doing is we’re subsidizing those activities by allowing them to bring in low-wage workers rather than make them pay a competitive wage,” said Christopher Worswick, economics department chair at Carleton University in Ottawa, who co-wrote a peer-reviewed report showing firms prefer temporary foreign workers due to their higher efforts for the same wage.

What was keeping wages in the fast food industry low before the TFW program?

I’m torn between hoping that you don’t plan on arguing that fast food and retail workers were way better off before the TFW program was introduced and hoping that you do because it might be entertaining to read.

Your arguments, and those used by the media, to vilify immigrants are paper thin. Youth unemployment isn’t a very strong indicator because TFWs aren’t just doing jobs that only youths would otherwise be doing.

In the case of both fast food and retail jobs, ignoring a few outliers those industries historically have generally paid minimum wage. There hasn’t been much pressure on those industries to pay more because workers in those industries don’t have any leverage to deter their employers from not paying them more.

Workers are getting exploited all over this country and all you want to do is try and angle that into a way to criticize a government that doesn’t even regulate the industries you claim are doing the exploiting. I find that to be pretty insulting to the workers who want and deserve better. One could even say that politicians and their supporters who do this are exploiting them.

If you’re ok with allowing legislation that gives employers the ability to exploit, coerce and intimidate their employees regardless of their status as a citizen with essentially impunity, why are you acting so surprised when it happens at all? Worse yet, you’re actually blaming the people working for them as if it’s what those workers want.

You know what workers say when they are presented with an option to address poor conditions of employment? “My boss says they’ll fire anyone who tries it.” You know what a TFW says when presented with the same option? “My boss says they’ll cancel my work contract and I’ll be sent back”. Which is the exact same thing, only worse because they lose the ability to even find another crappy low wage job.

These disingenuous studies and arguments you bring forward might convince the average person who doesn’t know or speak with low wage workers and/or TFWs on a regular basis, but for anyone who actually does it just comes off as asinine.

So on behalf of the exploited, please knock it off and instead go educate yourself on what issues workers are really facing that are having a detrimental effect on them. Or if you want to double down, please provide us with your explanation for how Amazon workers would stand to gain more from the elimination of the TFW program than they would if they could realistically form a Uknowwhat at their workplace.

[BlackArcher101]

I lost my job to a TFW in 2009, after the big layoffs in O&G. I saw the documentation on the office printer, HR had sent it there accidentally, so knew it was coming. They claimed they couldn't find mechanical designers or drafters in a time when the market was flush with them. Said it was "specialized". Prior it was already being used by that firm for a lot of roles. The person they brought in at 1/5 of my pay, had to live in a house shared by others in the same boat, of same ethnic origin, arranged for by that ethnic association. He couldn't afford anything else. Didn't speak a lick of English in a role that required it and I couldn't even train him on the systems. Company went under a few years later as a result.

It was ripe for abuse then already, and at that point disgusted me. Knowing the owners and managers that take advantage of this program, I'm willing to bet there is a 90% overlap in a venn diagram of who opposes immigration and those who use TFW's in some manner.

You want to know why no government is fixing it? Because it benefits the privileged, powerful or wealthy. Liberals or cons, doesn't matter, we elect those who use it.

[Harry Lime]

There is some confusion between anti-immigrant and anti-immigration, again. It's possible to be for immigration reform, and also for worker's rights. I'm also not saying that is happening here, but everybody seems to be yelling with their backs to each other.

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by Harry Lime

There is some confusion between anti-immigrant and anti-immigration, again. It's possible to be for immigration reform, and also for worker's rights. I'm also not saying that is happening here, but everybody seems to be yelling with their backs to each other.

There’s not really any confusion.

[Harry Lime]

Originally Posted by iggy_oi

Anti-immigrant rhetoric being used to distract people from realizing that the primary reason why those workers are being exploited is the lack of protections that all workers would still be left with even if the TFW program went away today.

Classic.

Thanked by Pepsi. It's anti-immigration rhetoric. Also, both need to be argued in public, to make sure both are not shuffled under the rug by government. You are just fighting the wrong people for the right reasons.

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by Harry Lime

Thanked by Pepsi. It's anti-immigration rhetoric. Also, both need to be argued in public, to make sure both are not shuffled under the rug by government. You are just fighting the wrong people for the right reasons.

I was wrong. There is confusion. I think you’re confused.

[Cowboy89]

Originally Posted by belsarius

Those damned Liberals.. just sitting there doing nothing about the issues with the TFW program. Oh wait.....

Minister Boissonnault announces new measures to address fraud in Canada’s Temporary Foreign Worker Program

Government of Canada continues to take action to protect Temporary Foreign Workers, non-compliant employer penalties increased by 36%

Thanking the Liberals for these measures would be like thanking an arsonist for putting a small hose on the fire he started after it burned down your house.

[opendoor]

Originally Posted by chemgear

All the cheap imported labor is having the expected effects on unemployment and reducing wages across the board.

I'm curious where you're getting that information. Median wages are up 5.4% in the last year (2.7% after inflation). And in the longer term, they're up 25% in the last 5 years (7.0% after inflation).

Fast wage increases are precisely why corporate lobbyists want the government to relax TFW rules.

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by Cowboy89

Thanking the Liberals for these measures would be like thanking an arsonist for putting a small hose on the fire he started after it burned down your house.

It’s too bad our only options are either thanking them or saying they do nothing then.

[Doctorfever]

Originally Posted by iggy_oi

What was keeping wages in the fast food industry low before the TFW program?

I’m torn between hoping that you don’t plan on arguing that fast food and retail workers were way better off before the TFW program was introduced and hoping that you do because it might be entertaining to read.

Your arguments, and those used by the media, to vilify immigrants are paper thin. Youth unemployment isn’t a very strong indicator because TFWs aren’t just doing jobs that only youths would otherwise be doing.

In the case of both fast food and retail jobs, ignoring a few outliers those industries historically have generally paid minimum wage. There hasn’t been much pressure on those industries to pay more because workers in those industries don’t have any leverage to deter their employers from not paying them more.

Workers are getting exploited all over this country and all you want to do is try and angle that into a way to criticize a government that doesn’t even regulate the industries you claim are doing the exploiting. I find that to be pretty insulting to the workers who want and deserve better. One could even say that politicians and their supporters who do this are exploiting them.

If you’re ok with allowing legislation that gives employers the ability to exploit, coerce and intimidate their employees regardless of their status as a citizen with essentially impunity, why are you acting so surprised when it happens at all? Worse yet, you’re actually blaming the people working for them as if it’s what those workers want.

You know what workers say when they are presented with an option to address poor conditions of employment? “My boss says they’ll fire anyone who tries it.” You know what a TFW says when presented with the same option? “My boss says they’ll cancel my work contract and I’ll be sent back”. Which is the exact same thing, only worse because they lose the ability to even find another crappy low wage job.

These disingenuous studies and arguments you bring forward might convince the average person who doesn’t know or speak with low wage workers and/or TFWs on a regular basis, but for anyone who actually does it just comes off as asinine.

So on behalf of the exploited, please knock it off and instead go educate yourself on what issues workers are really facing that are having a detrimental effect on them. Or if you want to double down, please provide us with your explanation for how Amazon workers would stand to gain more from the elimination of the TFW program than they would if they could realistically form a Uknowwhat at their workplace.

Seems you answered your own question.