2024 Off-season trade rumours and speculation thread

[ForeverFlameFan]

Well what’s the report on Kakko? Is it something we can fix? we’ve got a crap ton of wingers, so if we are getting him then it HAS to make sense for us. Is it ice time? Is it lack of chemistry? What are his strengths and is he using them?

At one point Lafreniere was also a guy that was kind of on the hot seat but he definitely figured it out. Is Kakko a slow burner? Did he only do well in his D-1 and D+0 because he had the size to play against men (albeit not the best league in the world)?

The Flames pursued Sharangovich because they knew he was a player that fell out of NJs depth chart because of the Meier acquisition. Also had too many players that needed PP time.

What can we do to bring the best out of Kakko? I just don’t us to pursue someone because of draft pedigree, but there’s definitely a reason why he went 2nd OA and I’ll be honest, I don’t exactly remember why he was.

[Hockey-and_stuff]

Originally Posted by ForeverFlameFan

Well what’s the report on Kakko? Is it something we can fix? we’ve got a crap ton of wingers, so if we are getting him then it HAS to make sense for us. Is it ice time? Is it lack of chemistry? What are his strengths and is he using them?

At one point Lafreniere was also a guy that was kind of on the hot seat but he definitely figured it out. Is Kakko a slow burner? Did he only do well in his D-1 and D+0 because he had the size to play against men (albeit not the best league in the world)?

The Flames pursued Sharangovich because they knew he was a player that fell out of NJs depth chart because of the Meier acquisition. Also had too many players that needed PP time.

What can we do to bring the best out of Kakko? I just don’t us to pursue someone because of draft pedigree, but there’s definitely a reason why he went 2nd OA and I’ll be honest, I don’t exactly remember why he was.

He will be playing in his 6th NHL season. By now draft pedigree should not be a consideration, but his on-ice results.

If it comes down to moving Kuzmenko for a 1st/2nd vs Kakko, I'd rather gamble on the potential of a much younger player than acquire a guy who to this point in his career is just a 30-40pt guy.

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[Wastedyouth]

Can anyone say, Curtis Lazar?

[GreenLantern2814]

Wingers under contract:

Huberdeau - 7 years
Sharangovich - 6 years
Coleman - 3 years
Kuzmenko - 1 year
Mantha - 1 year
Lomberg - 2 year
Pelletier - RFA
Pospisil - 2 years
Duehr - 1 years

Trade Coleman and Mantha.

I’d be willing to bet Kuzmenko has a better year than Kakko three of the next four seasons, at which point Kakko would be UFA anyway.


Assuming he demonstrates that he’s playable defensively in the early part of the year, keep Kuzmenko to pump up the guys on one-year contracts and add to the highlight reels. 3x$8M. They’d still be $20M below the cap, and Having three good wingers discourages them from drafting wingers with high picks.

[SuperMatt18]

Kakko has shown more that the NHL level than Lazar ever has.

If I had to rank the items right now I'd say:

1st > Kakko > 2nd

So if you think the best return you can get for Kuzmenko would be a second, then I think you make that move.

If you think you can get a 1st, then you'd probably wait.

The other factor is age too...if the team wants to contend in 3-4 years, then whatever they get with a pick might be more valuable than Kakko by then too.

[Aarongavey]

Originally Posted by stemit14

Agreed. Teams play premiums for centres and top four defencemen but rarely for wingers. Guentzel was by far the best winger available at the TDL (and even the best forward) and the package he returned included a conditional 1st round pick that ended up being a 2nd round pick. It’s become rare for rental wingers to return first round picks.

To be fair this was the Guentzel (plus Ty Smith) package

-a scoring winger who has been a 55-60 point guy who is under team control for two more years at 4.5 million
- Cruz Lucius who is a former 4th round pick and was in his D+2 year at Wisconsin and led the team and was top 15 in Big Ten scoring the two years since his draft
- former 2nd round pick Ville Koivunen who was in his D+3 year
- former 2nd round pick Vasily Ponomarev who was in his D+4 year
-a conditional first that turned into a second.

Not exactly just a conditional 1st.

Timo Meier was a scoring winger who returned a haul the year before that. Scoring wingers seem to get a pretty good return at the deadline historically.

[ForeverFlameFan]

Kuzmenko is no Meier or Guentzel though. Definitely have to temper our expectations a bit, however, Kuzmenko could very well be our best point-producing player that could *potentially* fetch Calgary a haul at 50%, maybe 75% if a 3rd party takes on 1.375m (which is not hard at all). That’s about a free 4th/5th rounder. Just need to make sure he has every opportunity to score a lot.

[SuperMatt18]

Who are the potential similar targets to Kuzmenko over the last couple years...because he's not in the Guentzel or Meier level of player, even with a strong season.

IMO the closer comparables from the last two seasons are:

Toffoli: 2nd + 3rd
Duclair: 3rd + Thompson
Wennberg: 2nd + 4th
Tarasenko: 3rd + 4th
Granlund: 2nd
Bertuzzi: 1st + 4th

Now if he has 30 goals or something and is on pace for 40 at the deadline then it's possible it changes, but I'd say a 2nd is the most likely return at this point.

[Sylvanfan]

I don't see how he'd fetch more than what Tarasenko just did. Tarasenko used to be a fast dynamic guy before his injuries, but had some playoff experience and a cup ring.

Kuzmenko is a really good poweplay guy, but at even strength will need sheltering, and it's hard to picture him in a real contenders top 6 and top PP unit.

Kakko likely benefits from a change of scenery. But I don't see him suddenly exploding as a 60 point player. Maybe a bit more in that 40 to 50 range and sticking around the league long enough to play 900 games. That's a good piece, but better suited to a team who's more likely looking to break through as a playoff team than one essentially at the start of a rebuild.

[jayswin]

Originally Posted by Sylvanfan

I don't see how he'd fetch more than what Tarasenko just did. Tarasenko used to be a fast dynamic guy before his injuries, but had some playoff experience and a cup ring.

Kuzmenko is a really good poweplay guy, but at even strength will need sheltering, and it's hard to picture him in a real contenders top 6 and top PP unit.

Kakko likely benefits from a change of scenery. But I don't see him suddenly exploding as a 60 point player. Maybe a bit more in that 40 to 50 range and sticking around the league long enough to play 900 games. That's a good piece, but better suited to a team who's more likely looking to break through as a playoff team than one essentially at the start of a rebuild.

Tarasenko is kind of irrelevant in that list of deadline returns. It was an open secret he'd pretty much only waive his NTC for Florida. He was obviously not worth just a 3rd and 4th if he could have been put to market.

[Sylvanfan]

Originally Posted by jayswin

Tarasenko is kind of irrelevant in that list of deadline returns. It was an open secret he'd pretty much only waive his NTC for Florida. He was obviously not worth just a 3rd and 4th if he could have been put to market.

Kuzmenko has a modified NTC. So it's not like the Flames can trade him wherever they want without some input from the player.

[gvitaly]

Originally Posted by Sylvanfan

I don't see how he'd fetch more than what Tarasenko just did. Tarasenko used to be a fast dynamic guy before his injuries, but had some playoff experience and a cup ring.

Kuzmenko is a really good poweplay guy, but at even strength will need sheltering, and it's hard to picture him in a real contenders top 6 and top PP unit.

Kakko likely benefits from a change of scenery. But I don't see him suddenly exploding as a 60 point player. Maybe a bit more in that 40 to 50 range and sticking around the league long enough to play 900 games. That's a good piece, but better suited to a team who's more likely looking to break through as a playoff team than one essentially at the start of a rebuild.

Tarasenko completely controlled his destination. That was the reason for the low return IMO.

I would be surprised if Kuzmenko returns less than Tanev(2nd + 3rd + prospect) if he is playing at a 60+ point pace.

Also the Guentzel comparison above only looks at picks. I thought the prospects more than made up for it. In fact I thought they got 3 A- prospects in Ponomarev, Koivunen, and Lucius.

[blankall]

Originally Posted by gvitaly

Also the Guentzel comparison above only looks at picks. I thought the prospects more than made up for it. In fact I thought they got 3 A- prospects in Ponomarev, Koivunen, and Lucius.

Plus Bunting, who is a solid mid six physical forward. The Pens didn't get a 1st rounder, but got the equivalent to probably 5 second round picks.

[Aarongavey]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

Who are the potential similar targets to Kuzmenko over the last couple years...because he's not in the Guentzel or Meier level of player, even with a strong season.

IMO the closer comparables from the last two seasons are:

Toffoli: 2nd + 3rd
Duclair: 3rd + Thompson
Wennberg: 2nd + 4th
Tarasenko: 3rd + 4th
Granlund: 2nd
Bertuzzi: 1st + 4th

Now if he has 30 goals or something and is on pace for 40 at the deadline then it's possible it changes, but I'd say a 2nd is the most likely return at this point.

Tarasenko was a 1st, 4th and a 4th line forward.

[jayswin]

Originally Posted by Aarongavey

Tarasenko was a 1st, 4th and a 4th line forward.

Nope, 3rd and conditional 4th.

[Bingo Jr.]

Originally Posted by jayswin

Nope, 3rd and conditional 4th.

He's talking about the previous deadline to NYR.

[jayswin]

Originally Posted by Bingo Jr.

He's talking about the previous deadline to NYR.

Which poster? I'm 99% sure the OP with that list (supermatt) was referring to this past deadline where Florida paid a 3rd and 4th, to which aarongavey corrected him thinking he was referring to the older trade.

[Sylvanfan]

Originally Posted by gvitaly

Tarasenko completely controlled his destination. That was the reason for the low return IMO.

I would be surprised if Kuzmenko returns less than Tanev(2nd + 3rd + prospect) if he is playing at a 60+ point pace.

Guentzel and Taffoli both have multiple Stanley Cups on their resume and pretty long track records as NHL point producers. Tanev had some of the better EV metrics defensively against tough competition over multiple seasons at the time of the trade and 41 career playoff games.

Kuzmenko has all of 0 career NHL playoff games played. So I guess anything can happen and you can get favorable conditions tied to a teams playoff success in a trade. But I don't see a 60 point pp specialist winger on a bad team with no NHL playoff games returning a big haul.

[Paulie Walnuts]

A 2nd is a win for Kuzmenko, 1 dimensional wingers like him won't fetch you much. If we can get 2 picks for him its huge. The picks mean more for this organization than he does.

We need to get as many draft picks as possible, and try to spread them out and not have them all in 1 draft. Our scouts showed when they get picks they can find good players.

[Beninho]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

One dimensional offensive wingers rarely even get 1sts at the deadline...my guess is Kuzmenko would be worth more like a 2nd + prospect.

He'd need to be on a 40 goal and PPG pace to maybe return a 1st IMO.

He is not just a one dimensional offensive winger… he is a one dimensional offensive winger with a great personality and a warm smile. That is definitely worth a first