MF YYC Politics - there, I mega did it

[You Need a Thneed]

Any cost increases should be sued for the difference to the UCP party.

one of the biggest obstruction and goalpost moving operations at this level of government I've ever seen.

If not for the UCP, we would be half done construction already, including the line up to 16th ave.

The UCP must absolutely be held accountable for this.

[Ironhorse]

Originally Posted by GGG

Such foolishness on this thing. If they just built North to Ogden first future expansions would have been relatively cheap.

Where would they put the maintenance and storage depot?

[Jimmy Stang]

Originally Posted by You Need a Thneed

Any cost increases should be sued for the difference to the UCP party.

one of the biggest obstruction and goalpost moving operations at this level of government I've ever seen.

If not for the UCP, we would be half done construction already, including the line up to 16th ave.

The UCP must absolutely be held accountable for this.

This is by design. This will be a centrepiece grievance of a new, populist, TBA/UCP municipal party/slate. The average voter won’t worry about the UCP delays being a contributing factor.

[GGG]

Originally Posted by Ironhorse

Where would they put the maintenance and storage depot?

Too late now but back in 2012 there were discussions of building two separate lines entirely when these ideas started. With the current plan they don’t have an option. I’m lamenting decisions from 10-15 years ago.

[accord1999]

Originally Posted by BlackArcher101

Can't wait to see the cost cutting measures. Remove 3 stations, no canopies on others, etc?

One rumor I've read is that Stage 1 will be cut back to Eau Claire to Ogden.

Originally Posted by Ironhorse

Where would they put the maintenance and storage depot?

In earlier studies, they did looked at sites in the SE, particularly land owned by CP. They likely went with Shepard then because it could store more LRVs and was half the price. But now, Shepard is 8km and probably a $1B farther away.

[BlackArcher101]

Originally Posted by GGG

Such foolishness on this thing. If they just built North to Ogden first future expansions would have been relatively cheap.

I bet the river crossing and the first north station alone would now cost what the south was planned for.

[accord1999]

Originally Posted by You Need a Thneed

If not for the UCP, we would be half done construction already, including the line up to 16th ave.

The UCP must absolutely be held accountable for this.

The UCP can only be blamed for around 13 months. Most of the delays have been self-inflicted.

Green Line timeline:

Late 2015: Construction to begin in 2018, opening in 2024 for the entire 40 km line (from Panorama to Seton)
May 2017: Cut back to 16th Ave - Shepard, construction to begin in 2020 and opening in 2026
June 2019: 4km core tunnel no longer feasible, new plan developed with construction expected to begin 2021, new managing director hired
June 2020: Council approves new plan with shorter tunnels and 3 phase Stage 1 but not approved by Alberta
Sept 2020: Managing director leaves
July 2021: Alberta approves new plan with 2 phase Stage 1, new CEO for GL is hired
April 2023: Constructor is selected but requires 16 months for design
June 2024: 60% design is finished

[BlackArcher101]

Reminds me of how I make most purchase decisions.

1. Come up with need for something.
2. Research it for far too long.
3. As I make a decision new options become available. Research again.
4. Repeat step 3.
5. 8-24 months later buy something, but hate that it now costs 15% more and in the end the first option would have worked fine.

[BlackArcher101]

Originally Posted by accord1999

The UCP can only be blamed for around 13 months. Most of the delays have been self-inflicted.

Green Line timeline:

Late 2015: Construction to begin in 2018, opening in 2024 for the entire 40 km line (from Panorama to Seton)
May 2017: Cut back to 16th Ave - Shepard, construction to begin in 2020 and opening in 2026
June 2019: 4km core tunnel no longer feasible, new plan developed with construction expected to begin 2021, new managing director hired
June 2020: Council approves new plan with shorter tunnels and 3 phase Stage 1 but not approved by Alberta
Sept 2020: Managing director leaves
July 2021: Alberta approves new plan with 2 phase Stage 1, new CEO for GL is hired
April 2023: Constructor is selected but requires 16 months for design
June 2024: 60% design is finished

What a disaster of a project. I had assumed we were at 60% at least when they did the RFP?

[accord1999]

Originally Posted by BlackArcher101

What a disaster of a project. I had assumed we were at 60% at least when they did the RFP?

Yeah, I think that surprised a lot of people (including myself) when even after finally reaching the constructor picked stage, there was still another 1+ year design phase to go. But the biggest problem of the Green Line has always been over-estimating its readiness.

[powderjunkie]

Centre St has been overloading busses for decades. The problem is that running down a train down Centre St was a totally foreign concept until quite recently. Look at how we built the other lines...down the middle of long-dedicated ROWs. Like right around 2015 when the Harper money-fairy appeared to set this whole thing off was when the idea was gaining traction. Prior to that the idea was to run up Nose Creek (ie. west of the heavy rail to the west of Deerfoot. The obvious problem there being you only have a 180 degree catchment area.

So the north just wasn't very ready in terms of land acquisition or functional planning. Coupled with a pedo-rapist councillor who fought against it coming to his area lead the focus to shift SE. But apparently that wasn't nearly as shovel-ready as they thought, either.

Getting through downtown is complicated and expensive. But it would not have been immediately - if ever - necessary for the north line, especially if it will run at-grade south of 16th Ave. But this is another notion that was unfathomable a decade ago, and we've only begun to incrementally accept some of these new fangled ideas like not spending millions extra to cater to car dominance (which is especially silly when the project is literally a competition/alternative to cars)

Originally Posted by Ironhorse

Where would they put the maintenance and storage depot?

The city owns land south of 96 Ave that was considered; the only justification offered against it was that another city dept had other ideas for that land. Seemingly none of which have actually started to come to fruition, yet.

My tinfoil hat has long wondered exactly who is invested in Shephard Crossing...perhaps indirectly to avoid a conflict of interest.

[Bigtime]

Oh boy, this is quite a reduction being proposed:

https://twitter.com/user/status/1818419138773368948

[curves2000]

Any coincidence that all this negative news is being released now that construction has been started on the new arena?? I don't think so.

There are councilors who are currently involved and others active in politics that got really cocky about how much wiggle room there was. Very cocky about having more than enough of a cushion.

Ironically that city council thought we could pull off a global Olympics in 2026 with approx the same amount of money. We can't even lay some track and built some canopies over some expanded concrete stations for that money.

Bad look all around but all of this was predicted at the start. No matter who gets elected in any set of government what we have is the rich and the elites who get what they want and the poor people get shafted. The property tax increase for this gong show is going to be fun.

[accord1999]

Originally Posted by powderjunkie

The city owns land south of 96 Ave that was considered; the only justification offered against it was that another city dept had other ideas for that land. Seemingly none of which have actually started to come to fruition, yet.

It's funny that Aurora has been saved from development for so long that they've had to do a 180 and go from mixed commercial-industrial to mixed-use residential. I assume all the potential original users got sick of waiting and ended up building elsewhere.

My tinfoil hat has long wondered exactly who is invested in Shephard Crossing...perhaps indirectly to avoid a conflict of interest.

With the new phase 1 shown by BigTime, even Shepard is going to have to wait.

[SeeGeeWhy]

We Po'.

[You Need a Thneed]

Originally Posted by Bigtime

Oh boy, this is quite a reduction being proposed:

https://twitter.com/user/status/1818419138773368948

if its reduced now, the winners of the next provincial election could easily top up some money.

[calgarygeologist]

Originally Posted by Bigtime

Oh boy, this is quite a reduction being proposed:

https://twitter.com/user/status/1818419138773368948

I'd ask why even bother going to Ogden at this point unless there is some sort of ROW agreement that might expire if nothing happens. If it is so scaled back just go to Inglewood/Ramsay where there might be some decent ridership.

Edit: I don't know if there is any truth to this but someone on Reddit posted that the partner for the green line, Barnard Flatiron, is out of the project now.

[Mazrim]

Originally Posted by Bigtime

Oh boy, this is quite a reduction being proposed

Yikes. What a disaster.

[accord1999]

Originally Posted by calgarygeologist

I'd ask why even bother going to Ogden at this point unless there is some sort of ROW agreement that might expire if nothing happens. If it is so scaled back just go to Inglewood/Ramsay where there might be some decent ridership.

They need the maintenance yard, that's the nearest site to DT where it could be built.

[calgarygeologist]

Originally Posted by accord1999

They need the maintenance yard, that's the nearest site to DT where it could be built.

So they would build a facility over top of the sports fields/park?