BC Lags Behind Other Provinces in Life Satisfaction

[afc wimbledon]

Originally Posted by activeStick

A look into the crisis in Vancouver, with views from both sides of the safe supply argument.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/global-h...lumbia-canada/

To be fair you have to compare Canada's rate to the other's not just BC/Vancouvers, Vancouver sucks in a vast portion of the rest of the countries damaged and addicted due to its mild climate, Vancouver has to cope with Canada's issues, not just it's own

As a foster parent I doubt more than 20% of my foster kids over the years were from BC

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by afc wimbledon

To be fair you have to compare Canada's rate to the other's not just BC/Vancouvers, Vancouver sucks in a vast portion of the rest of the countries damaged and addicted due to its mild climate, Vancouver has to cope with Canada's issues, not just it's own

As a foster parent I doubt more than 20% of my foster kids over the years were from BC

Really good point. In fact, some municipalities have a history of actually rounding up their homeless and offering them free bus tickets to Vancouver. It really is a federal issue. I mean, if Vancouver transported them to Ottawa, you can bet the federal government would do more.

[blankall]

There's definitely a large number of people on the streets in Vancouver from Quebec and Alberta.

It seems like so much of the money we put into social services is a waste if the number of people in the most desperate situation is growing so quickly.

This combo of fentanyl and a housing crisis is just brutal. Most days I ride the bus to/from work through the downtown eastside hoping to see fewer people there, but it just looks worse everyday. Bless the outreach workers doing their best to provide food, administer Naloxone, etc... but they constantly just trying to plug holes in a sinking ship.

It does look there has been some slight improvement:

https://app.powerbi.com/view?r=eyJrI...g1ZTM1OWFkYyJ9

182 deaths in April vs. 239 in April of 2023. I don't know if drug legalization made the problem better, but it doesn't seem ot have made it worse, with drug overdoses lower every month this year vs 2023.

[Galakanokis]

Wrong thread.

Contemplating a job back downtown. Not sure I want to go there on a regular bases and the homelessness definitely plays a part in that. ####ty drive or ####ty trains?

[chemgear]

Did somebody say bail? You get bail! You get bail! Everybody gets bail!

https://bc.ctvnews.ca/b-c-premier-wa...rder-1.6957348

British Columbia's premier says the province worked with the federal government to change its bail rules, so he is not sure why a man with a long and violent criminal history was released from jail weeks before the stabbing death of a woman in her Surrey, B.C., home.

At the time, Mann was facing an unrelated aggravated assault charge for an alleged attack in Surrey three weeks earlier.

David Eby called the murder "horrific," saying the reformed federal rules should have prevented Adam Mann's release.

He was once deemed an "unmanageable risk" unsuitable for community supervision, in a pre-sentencing report after being convicted of a home invasion in Ontario more than a decade ago.

Court records in B.C., Ontario and New Brunswick show Mann has a criminal history dating back decades.

In 2009, he was sentenced to 12 years in prison for robbery and weapons offences in connection with a home invasion, which he unsuccessfully appealed.

The Ontario Court of Appeal ruling in 2010 said Mann had racked up 22 previous convictions by the age of 25, including violent offences involving firearms and robberies.

The ruling said a pre-sentence report on Mann was "very bleak," and that he once described stabbing a female victim as "like a knife going through butter."

The report said Mann was "not suitable for community supervision, as he appears to be an unmanageable risk while in the community.

Online court records in B.C. show Mann also has a long criminal history in the province.

In 2021, he was found guilty of publication of an intimate image without consent, an offence that occurred in Abbotsford.

In March this year, Mann was found guilty of possessing a weapon for dangerous purpose, and wilfully resisting or obstructing a peace office. He was then found guilty of breaching a probation order on June 5.

Eby had previously said Mann's release had raised questions because he was facing criminal charges and Crown prosecutors had urged a judge not to release him back into the community.

[Johnny199r]

“New bail rules” don’t mean anything.

Pretty much every accused in Canada gets released several times, no matter their record.

A lot of the time, prosecutors will agree to their release without even having to run a bail.

There are a few judges in every city that let everyone out. Defence lawyers just wait for the day they’re in court and then everyone tries to get their client in.

[afc wimbledon]

Part of the problem is the politics get in the way of the solution, there are a couple of things that are needed, a large psyche unit far enough out of town to make leaving a pain, a humane effective replacement for Riverview basically somewhere way up the valley that is equipped to keep patients for months even years.

Laws to limit the homeless to one tent and sod all else, endless washing of the streets to keep people moving during the day, the idea that allowing the DTES to thrive is humane needs to be thrown out, the DTES sucks the mildly addicted in, gets them ramped up onto opioids and kills them, it is an abattoir for the damaged and needs to be seen as such by the left, the 'caring' side of the argument needs to realize the DTES itself is killing people and the only solution is to minimize the numbers by almost any means

[afc wimbledon]

Of course the right wing side needs to realize not treating people and jailing them is way way more expensive, that there is a huge cost saving in solving the problem

[chemgear]

Hardcore drug sales at retail stores would be . . . interesting. Visit Circle K for some F.


https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/briti...port-1.7260641

B.C. should consider non-prescribed drug alternatives: top doctor

Addictions minister swiftly rejects Dr. Bonnie Henry's call for access to opioids without a prescription

The B.C. NDP government has swiftly rejected a recommendation from the province's top doctor that B.C. expand its safer supply program and allow people to obtain opioids without a prescription, including at compassion clubs and even retail stores.

However, just over an hour after the report was published, Minister of Mental Health and Addictions Jennifer Whiteside rejected the recommendations.

Whiteside said in a statement that while the province respects Henry's advice, "the province will not go in the direction of compassion clubs and other non-medical models of distributing medications."

[afc wimbledon]

Originally Posted by chemgear

Hardcore drug sales at retail stores would be . . . interesting. Visit Circle K for some F.


https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/briti...port-1.7260641

B.C. should consider non-prescribed drug alternatives: top doctor

Addictions minister swiftly rejects Dr. Bonnie Henry's call for access to opioids without a prescription

The B.C. NDP government has swiftly rejected a recommendation from the province's top doctor that B.C. expand its safer supply program and allow people to obtain opioids without a prescription, including at compassion clubs and even retail stores.

However, just over an hour after the report was published, Minister of Mental Health and Addictions Jennifer Whiteside rejected the recommendations.

Whiteside said in a statement that while the province respects Henry's advice, "the province will not go in the direction of compassion clubs and other non-medical models of distributing medications."

There are times when I wonder if people have any idea what causes an overdose, any opioid will kill you, vast numbers of people have died from prescribed opioid's, there are some reasons for decriminalization but preventing overdoses isnt one of them

[Street Pharmacist]

Originally Posted by afc wimbledon

There are times when I wonder if people have any idea what causes an overdose, any opioid will kill you, vast numbers of people have died from prescribed opioid's, there are some reasons for decriminalization but preventing overdoses isnt one of them

The issue is complex and unprecedented which makes prescribing solutions chaotic where it's impossible to draw clear lines.

However, I disagree with you a bit here. The vast majority of overdoses here are due to either tainted supply or doses being way more potent than expected. Pharmaceutical grade opiates are at least a known quantity. Almost 90% of overdoses are from substances containing fentanyl or a potent derivative. The issue with these synthetic opiates is they're so potent you have to have very sensitive and expensive equipment to accurately allot doses. Fentanyl is 50 times more potent than heroin mg to mg, so making a dose you can give someone makes it difficult because it's such a small physical quantity that you have to mix it with other stuff because you can just hand someone a bag of microscopic powder. But making sure you have the correct dose is difficult and made more so when you consider there are other analogues like carfentanyl which are up to another 100 times as potent as fentanyl. Then, add that we're now finding benzodiazepines in over 50% of tested samples. Benzodiazepines are sedatives that multiply the Royal of respiratory depression and the dose is completely unknown every dose you get.

This is what's killing people. Accidental overdoses. These people are trying to get to the line with really imprecise drugs that sometimes even just have toxic byproducts from chemical production.

Now, whether you support the public paying for it or if you want to argue offering free controlled supply has other detrimental effects you certainly can. But you can't claim safe supply doesn't prevent overdoses

[activeStick]

Originally Posted by Galakanokis

Wrong thread.

Contemplating a job back downtown. Not sure I want to go there on a regular bases and the homelessness definitely plays a part in that. ####ty drive or ####ty trains?

I'd definitely opt for taking the Skytrain downtown instead of driving. Cost of parking, risk of smashed windows, traffic, etc. I have friends who take the Skytrain downtown to/from work and they don't encounter any issues.

[blankall]

Originally Posted by Street Pharmacist

The issue is complex and unprecedented which makes prescribing solutions chaotic where it's impossible to draw clear lines.

However, I disagree with you a bit here. The vast majority of overdoses here are due to either tainted supply or doses being way more potent than expected. Pharmaceutical grade opiates are at least a known quantity. Almost 90% of overdoses are from substances containing fentanyl or a potent derivative. The issue with these synthetic opiates is they're so potent you have to have very sensitive and expensive equipment to accurately allot doses. Fentanyl is 50 times more potent than heroin mg to mg, so making a dose you can give someone makes it difficult because it's such a small physical quantity that you have to mix it with other stuff because you can just hand someone a bag of microscopic powder. But making sure you have the correct dose is difficult and made more so when you consider there are other analogues like carfentanyl which are up to another 100 times as potent as fentanyl. Then, add that we're now finding benzodiazepines in over 50% of tested samples. Benzodiazepines are sedatives that multiply the Royal of respiratory depression and the dose is completely unknown every dose you get.

This is what's killing people. Accidental overdoses. These people are trying to get to the line with really imprecise drugs that sometimes even just have toxic byproducts from chemical production.

Now, whether you support the public paying for it or if you want to argue offering free controlled supply has other detrimental effects you certainly can. But you can't claim safe supply doesn't prevent overdoses

I wouldn't say that most people are overdosing due to accidentally taking fentanyl. Sure, there are people dabbling with drugs who accidentally end up taking fentanyl. However, they are a pretty slim minority.

The vast majority of people overdosing are people purposely taking fentanyl as they want to get as high as possible. I wouldn't call that accidental. Just yesterday, I saw someone so high they couldn't get up and a friend of theirs was giving them more drugs.

[Street Pharmacist]

Originally Posted by blankall

I wouldn't say that most people are overdosing due to accidentally taking fentanyl. Sure, there are people dabbling with drugs who accidentally end up taking fentanyl. However, they are a pretty slim minority.



The vast majority of people overdosing are people purposely taking fentanyl as they want to get as high as possible. I wouldn't call that accidental. Just yesterday, I saw someone so high they couldn't get up and a friend of theirs was giving them more drugs.

You're completely missing the point. They don't care if it's fentanyl or not. They're taking something to get high, but can never be sure of the actual dose.

Imagine you've got a headache and take an ibuprofen but it could be 40mg, 400mg or 4000mg and there might be caffeine in it. That matters.

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by Street Pharmacist

Now, whether you support the public paying for it or if you want to argue offering free controlled supply has other detrimental effects you certainly can. But you can't claim safe supply doesn't prevent overdoses

Afc is saying the controlled supply and tolerance of open use is increasing the number of people who become addicted to opioides. You’re saying controlled supply reduces the likelihood of the single use of an opioide being lethal. Those can both be true. But it would be hard to say without better data whether the net effect is more or less overdoses.

[Street Pharmacist]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

Afc is saying the controlled supply is increasing the number of people who become addicted to opioides. You’re saying controlled supply reduces the likelihood of the single use of an opioide being lethal. Those can both be true. But it would be hard to say without better data whether the net effect is more or less overdoses.

I mean, that's literally not what he said:

Originally Posted by afc wimbledon

There are times when I wonder if people have any idea what causes an overdose, any opioid will kill you, vast numbers of people have died from prescribed opioid's, there are some reasons for decriminalization but preventing overdoses isnt one of them

[blankall]

Originally Posted by Street Pharmacist

You're completely missing the point. They don't care if it's fentanyl or not. They're taking something to get high, but can never be sure of the actual dose.

Imagine you've got a headache and take an ibuprofen but it could be 40mg, 400mg or 4000mg and there might be caffeine in it. That matters.

Except that most street users are actively looking for the 4000mg pill. When they hear that someone has overdosed, they'll actively seek that dealer in order to get the stronger dose. They don't want a clean supply of heroine. They want fentanyl.

And if you give a heavy use a free clean supply, that free supply will just be used to supplement what they are already taking with more opioids.

[Street Pharmacist]

Originally Posted by blankall

Except that most street users are actively looking for the 4000mg pill. When they hear that someone has overdosed, they'll actively seek that dealer in order to get the stronger dose. They don't want a clean supply of heroine. They want fentanyl.

And if you give a heavy use a free clean supply, that free supply will just be used to supplement what they are already taking with more opioids.

Again, you can't just get the 4000mg dose because, again, you have no idea what dose you're getting.

[afc wimbledon]

actually, what I meant, but didn't say, is that an overdose is caused by the balance between drug potency and the user's tolerance, most of the fatal overdoses I have dealt with are because a user had a lower tolerance than they believed, usually as a result of coming out of jail or hospital.

The same amount of smack can kill the same addict given a few weeks either detoxed or just using lower amounts, this was the classic Sid Vicious overdose, what we need to acknowledge is opioids can never be made safe, as a drug they are inherently deadly

[afc wimbledon]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

Afc is saying the controlled supply and tolerance of open use is increasing the number of people who become addicted to opioides. You’re saying controlled supply reduces the likelihood of the single use of an opioide being lethal. Those can both be true. But it would be hard to say without better data whether the net effect is more or less overdoses.

As to this what I meant is that the DTES has a gravitational pull, it sucks in both the majority of services, low cost housing and damaged souls and if you live in the DTES then opioid use becomes your social norm, in some little town in Alberta or BC you are the town idiot, you get drunk, start fights, smoke way way to much weed but your coke meth and down use will tend to be occasional, they are socially unacceptable and that acts as a brake on your behaviour, in the DTES it's the opposite, being clean becomes the uncommon so when you try to get clean you lose all your social bonds, friends, on top of that your dealer finds you in 30 minutes with a 'free' dose because they 'care about you and you look like your getting dope sick'

The last place in the world we should make/allow the addicted to live is in the DTES