2024 Off-season trade rumours and speculation thread

[Jason14h]

Originally Posted by TOfan

I believe finishing dead last can still land you with the 4OA pick. Could be wrong on that. Also believe this happened to Detroit who, despite have several years at/near the bottom, only ever got one 4OA pick out of it.

I don’t get the Necas attraction either for a number of reasons, mostly, I don’t think he fits the current trajectory of the team which should still be in a downward direction.

You can drop to 3rd - As two lottery 'balls' are chosen. I forgot they draw twice not just once because of how this years turned out.

[TOfan]

Originally Posted by Paulie Walnuts

I’m not saying it’s a fact, but his cousin is our assistant GM and he’s broken news from him before.

It probably has more credibility to it right now.

Why would Nonis leak info to Dreger? What purpose would that serve Dave Nonis? And if it’s true Nonis has been leaking confidential team info to the media, would that not jeopardize his position in the organization and reputation throughout the league and industry?

If there is a leak, I’d bet it’s coming from the players agent?

Thinking Nonis leaked this to Dreger is as thin an argument as I could imagine.

[Rhett44]

Originally Posted by Bingo

Absolutely. Could be true for sure.

But I went months hearing how stupid Treliving was. Now it's all the owners fault.

I guess it could be both, but that seems somewhat unlikely.

I'd just like to know what we are dealing with? Is the problem gone? Or is it still present?

And I'm not a fan of calling things facts that are far from it.

I went overboard with my last comment, I guess it isn't a "fact".

But just knowing how Murray Edwards operates, any time I see a rumor like this it just gets me going. I do think it is a combination of Treliving and ownership.

For example most of the dealing with Johnny and Tkachuk leading to them leaving is on Brad. But panic trading for Huberdeau and Weegar to stay competitive is more on ownership. And I personally don't think Conroy has any say on if he can rebuild or retool.

For example we made all these trades that I was a fan of this past year. But we got lucky. Let's not pretend we didn't offer Lindholm and Hanifin large amounts of money for them to stay. Rumor is we offered Tanev an extension as well.

We got more lucky those 3 players declined us than anything else. Because we were forced to trade them for futures as a result.

[Ashasx]

Originally Posted by TOfan

Why would Nonis leak info to Dreger? What purpose would that serve Dave Nonis? And if it’s true Nonis has been leaking confidential team info to the media, would that not jeopardize his position in the organization and reputation throughout the league and industry?

If there is a leak, I’d bet it’s coming from the players agent?

Thinking Nonis leaked this to Dreger is as thin an argument as I could imagine.

I'm not going to say confidently that Nonis leaked any information to anyone, but maybe somebody inside the organization would want to leak this information to put pressure on ownership to stop meddling. Or, I suppose to take pressure off themselves for failing to complete a trade.

[Rhett44]

Originally Posted by TOfan

Why would Nonis leak info to Dreger? What purpose would that serve Dave Nonis? And if it’s true Nonis has been leaking confidential team info to the media, would that not jeopardize his position in the organization and reputation throughout the league and industry?

If there is a leak, I’d bet it’s coming from the players agent?

Thinking Nonis leaked this to Dreger is as thin an argument as I could imagine.

I see it more as ranting in frustration in a private message about how he and Conroy are not able to do their jobs properly. Dreger was very careful to choose his words so it didn't throw anyone under the bus.

[transplant99]

Dreger doesn't deal in "facts", he deals in conjecture....just about all those talking heads do.

Even if he is given "factual" information, it has to be lumped in with the "guessing" part of the job or else everything he says is fact or everything he says is fiction.

Who knows what happened at the deadline? Those guys in the seats of the Flames executive group....and that's it.

The entire media business though has gotten away from truth vs opinion in reporting, and its clearly imprinted on a large part of the population now. Its both sad and fascinating what will be presented as real and having occurred vs what some want presented and to have happened.

Objectivity is a lost skill.

[TOfan]

Originally Posted by Rhett44

I see it more as ranting in frustration in a private message about how he and Conroy are not able to do their jobs properly. Dreger was very careful to choose his words so it didn't throw anyone under the bus.

Doubtful.

Would you do that if you were in Nonis’s shoes? If so, I’d say that’s pretty careless and that behaviour, if found out, would likely lead to his termination.

Why would one even want to consider doing that? I would think it’s the opposite. Nonis probably doesn’t talk to Dreger at all about the Glames and Dreger probably knows better not to even ask.

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by Rhett44

I went overboard with my last comment, I guess it isn't a "fact".

But just knowing how Murray Edwards operates, any time I see a rumor like this it just gets me going. I do think it is a combination of Treliving and ownership.

For example most of the dealing with Johnny and Tkachuk leading to them leaving is on Brad. But panic trading for Huberdeau and Weegar to stay competitive is more on ownership. And I personally don't think Conroy has any say on if he can rebuild or retool.

For example we made all these trades that I was a fan of this past year. But we got lucky. Let's not pretend we didn't offer Lindholm and Hanifin large amounts of money for them to stay. Rumor is we offered Tanev an extension as well.

We got more lucky those 3 players declined us than anything else. Because we were forced to trade them for futures as a result.

More assumptions in there in my opinion.

We don't know the ins and outs of the Gaudreau contract negotiation; the summer before, or the summer he left.

Maybe Treliving took a $7M/yr contract to Edwards and recommended they do it in the summer of 2022.

Maybe Treliving said that's what it will take and to pass.

We don't know.

And then recently they move UFAs. Was that a change in view? Conroy's presence? Or did they all just want to leave so they had no choice?

They did move Toffoli before the season started which isn't a win at all costs move.

I'm not pretending to know more than you do? I honestly have no idea. But the future is a lot brighter if Conroy doesn't have roadblocks so fingers crossed.

[Paulie Walnuts]

Originally Posted by Bingo

Absolutely. Could be true for sure.

But I went months hearing how stupid Treliving was. Now it's all the owners fault.

I guess it could be both, but that seems somewhat unlikely.

I'd just like to know what we are dealing with? Is the problem gone? Or is it still present?

And I'm not a fan of calling things facts that are far from it.

Well it doesn’t seem like a deal was off the table. The Devils GM was crying about being extorted in the goalie market after the deadline.

Who knows what happened.

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by Ashasx

I'm not going to say confidently that Nonis leaked any information to anyone, but maybe somebody inside the organization would want to leak this information to put pressure on ownership to stop meddling. Or, I suppose to take pressure off themselves for failing to complete a trade.

So Nonis who everyone knows is related to Dreger leaks a rumour that the guys above him are idiots thinking it will help them not be idiots in the future and not pretty much tank his future in Calgary?

[Ashasx]

where did the idiots portion of that comment come from?

I don't know if Nonis leaked any information. I do know that Dreger is a reputable insider who was even more reliable when Nonis was in Toronto.

[TOfan]

Originally Posted by Ashasx

where did the idiots portion of that comment come from?

I don't know if Nonis leaked any information. I do know that Dreger is a reputable insider who was even more reliable when Nonis was in Toronto.

Seems to me you’re making enormous leaps in logic.

Isn’t it more likely that Nonis, if he values his job/reputation/career, actually says nothing to Dreger? Especially given Dreger is his cousin??? Wouldn’t that be the very first connection to be made if Dreger publicized sensitive information that the Flames don’t want to be public?

[OGmudbone]

Can we change the thread name to

"Trade Rumours and Idiot Speculation thread"

[Ashasx]

Originally Posted by TOfan

Seems to me you’re making enormous leaps in logic.

Isn’t it more likely that Nonis, if he values his job/reputation/career, actually says nothing to Dreger? Especially given Dreger is his cousin??? Wouldn’t that be the very first connection to be made if Dreger publicized sensitive information that the Flames don’t want to be public?

Somebody asked why somebody inside the organization would be motivated to leak that information. That was one possible reason I could think of. It's not that serious.

[TOfan]

Originally Posted by Ashasx

Somebody asked why somebody inside the organization would be motivated to leak that information. That was one possible reason I could think of. It's not that serious.

Okay, fair enough.

I suspect the vast majority of leaks come from agents. Players themselves may offer up some off the record ‘hearsay’ but I’d bet the vast majority of hockey executives are vaults.

I’m not sure what benefit there would ever be for a GM or AGM to leak information. It’s basically career suicide.

[CliffFletcher]

The owners of professional sports teams almost never go on the record. So the only source of information on their role in the operations of their teams are these sorts of anonymous side-channels. If you don’t think these sources are credible, then presumably you don’t feel there’s any legitimate basis for sports fans to criticize the owners of the teams they support. Which is fine. But many fans feel otherwise.

Originally Posted by transplant99

Dreger doesn't deal in "facts", he deals in conjecture....just about all those talking heads do.

Some of it’s conjecture, and some of it’s factual information given to them by people working in the NHL who want to remain off the record.

Feel free to ignore it. But there’s a reason most of the executives and agents in the NHL follow Elliote Friedman’s podcast. There’s a lot of legitimate insider information in there alongside the conjecture.

[Paulie Walnuts]

Leaking information happens in all of sports, its a strategy. It puts pressure on either side.

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by TOfan

I’m not sure what benefit there would ever be for a GM or AGM to leak information. It’s basically career suicide.

A) To cultivate a media source who they can later use as a conduit for other information they want to get out.

B) To undermine someone else in their organization. Pro sports franchises aren’t all happy, selfless, one-for-all organizations. The executives are as competitive, jealous, and career-driven as execs in other organizations. Maybe even moreso.

C) People like to gossip and share secrets. It’s human nature.

And it doesn’t have to be a GM or an AGM. In the modern NHL you have at least a half dozen people involved once trade negotiations get serious (GM, AGMs, President, VP of hockey operations, capologist, analytics, scouts).

[TOfan]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

The owners of professional sports teams almost never go on the record. So the only source of information on their role in the operations of their teams are these sorts of anonymous side-channels. If you don’t think these sources are credible, then presumably you don’t feel there’s any legitimate basis for sports fans to criticize the owners of the teams they support. Which is fine. But many fans feel otherwise.



Some of it’s conjecture, and some of it’s factual information given to them by people working in the NHL who want to remain off the record.

Feel free to ignore it. But there’s a reason most of the executives and agents in the NHL follow Elliote Friedman’s podcast. There’s a lot of legitimate insider information in there alongside the conjecture.

I’m trying to think of an instance where Friedman, as an example, spoke about something as a fact that wasn’t readily known or available.

Conjecture, sure, that I can understand specifically if it’s around player movement. I think most people can probably recall Friedman saying things along the lines of ‘the Canadiens might be interested in drafting a forward’ this could be strategic for the Canadiens to entice another team, like the Flames to live up in the draft to select a certain player.

I only say that seeing as it’s topical. It’s not a move I would make if I were the Flames…..

As far as hockey executives revealing internal processes, I find that much more difficult to see. I think that stuff, mostly, is kept pretty close to the chest and only a select few know. If that breached, the individual who did so is likely out.

[howard_the_duck]

We now have enough drops of information by CP insiders, in addition to the Dregers and Friedmans of the world, that Edwards et all play an active role and sometimes it affects the autonomy of the GM and the way they'd otherwise do their business. Reading between all the inferences and drips of information over the past couple years, I'm confused why we're even calling this into question at this point.