2024 Off-season trade rumours and speculation thread

[Paulie Walnuts]

Originally Posted by Wastedyouth

Can we all just agree that no matter what, success and making/nearly the playoffs or abject failure/tanking next season, we will all agree to be miserable about the outcome?

I don't think this season was miserable, losing sucks yes but I think most people realize it's what we have to do to get better.

As long as the team shows up and competes, which is what I think Conroy is trying to say when he says playoffs, the season should be ok.

[Macho0978]

Originally Posted by Wastedyouth

Can we all just agree that no matter what, success and making/nearly the playoffs or abject failure/tanking next season, we will all agree to be miserable about the outcome?

I feel the opposite. I believe that some posters just think you need to trade everyone to get a top pick. That is not the case. I think the Flames will be in the mix for a top 5 pick next season, but Conroy will keep good players that want to stay and will add nice depth pieces that are young similar to what he has already done. If he really makes some home run moves, this team may climb higher than some of us want, but at least it will be a very good young deep hockey team with very good contracts, cap space, and tons of picks and prospects in the system.

[Bonded]

Originally Posted by Wastedyouth

Can we all just agree that no matter what, success and making/nearly the playoffs or abject failure/tanking next season, we will all agree to be miserable about the outcome?

The only outcome I will be disappointed with is if they sign UFAs and trade for players to get into the bubble territory.
If the roster is left unchanged and they somehow are a bubble team then it is what it is. Conroy has shown he will trade players at the deadline so at least there should be some good value.

I still don't see a way out of the bottom ten but we will see.

[Macho0978]

Originally Posted by Bonded

The only outcome I will be disappointed with is if they sign UFAs and trade for players to get into the bubble territory.
If the roster is left unchanged and they somehow are a bubble team then it is what it is. Conroy has shown he will trade players at the deadline so at least there should be some good value.

I still don't see a way out of the bottom ten but we will see.

I agree with this other than if he traded for guys like Lundell, Holtz, Frost or similar guys that have been rumored to be available and they come here and have a breakout season, I'm ok with this.

Conroy did very well in the Sharangovich and Kuzmenko trades. These trades were so good, it really does not make sense how he did so well. Keep doing that, I will be very happy.

[Paulie Walnuts]

Originally Posted by Macho0978

I feel the opposite. I believe that some posters just think you need to trade everyone to get a top pick. That is not the case. I think the Flames will be in the mix for a top 5 pick next season, but Conroy will keep good players that want to stay and will add nice depth pieces that are young similar to what he has already done. If he really makes some home run moves, this team may climb higher than some of us want, but at least it will be a very good young deep hockey team with very good contracts, cap space, and tons of picks and prospects in the system.

The roster is bad enough without trading anyone for a top 5 pick. Trading Markstrom puts is in Hagens sweepstakes.

[Macho0978]

Originally Posted by Paulie Walnuts

The roster is bad enough without trading anyone for a top 5 pick. Trading Markstrom puts is in Hagens sweepstakes.

I agree and odds are no depth young player will move the needle enough. Some are saying we aren't rebuilding. We already have, this team is on par with Columbus and Anaheim right now only slightly better than Chicago and better than SJ.

Trade your #1 goalie who was our best player until the trade deadline? This team is bad enough already.

[Paulie Walnuts]

Originally Posted by Macho0978

I agree and odds are no depth young player will move the needle enough. Some are saying we aren't rebuilding. We already have, this team is on par with Columbus and Anaheim right now only slightly better than Chicago and better than SJ.

Trade your #1 goalie who was our best player until the trade deadline? This team is bad enough already.

Yup, retool is just the word being used to please Edwards and some of the fanbase.

Retooling teams do not make the trades we made, those are rebuilding trades.

I also believe Kuzmenko is not in our long term plans either, they brought him in to rebuild his value and dump him at the next deadline.

[Roof-Daddy]

The Flames haven't traded away player with term for futures yet so it could still be a retool technically speaking. They were forced to trade all the players they've traded or else they would have lost them for nothing.

[Macho0978]

Originally Posted by Paulie Walnuts

Yup, retool is just the word being used to please Edwards and some of the fanbase.

Retooling teams do not make the trades we made, those are rebuilding trades.

I also believe Kuzmenko is not in our long term plans either, they brought him in to rebuild his value and dump him at the next deadline.

I could see Kuzmenko getting an offer though. I just think it likley does not happen as he will want more than Conroy is offering.

I think why some are saying this is not a rebuild is because Conroy will probably try re-sign Kuzmenko and Sharangovich and he won't trade guys like Coleman or Weegar or Rasmus unless they ask to be traded.

But I agree more players will be traded as some won't get the offer they want. I think Conroy just gets that if you ink a young player that can score 40+ goals to the correct contract, that's more valuable than hoping to get a 40+ goal guy with a late 1st or 2nd. You maybe have a 10% chance of that with those types of picks and we already have extras. If we are already near the bottom of the standings, why do we need to run more guys out?

[Macho0978]

Originally Posted by Roof-Daddy

The Flames haven't traded away player with term for futures yet so it could still be a retool technically speaking. They were forced to trade all the players they've traded or else they would have lost them for nothing.

I still think Conroy made offers and did not budge on his offers and players did not respond well to that. I think some would have stayed if he offered more or closer to what the player wanted.

[Paulie Walnuts]

Originally Posted by Roof-Daddy

The Flames haven't traded away player with term for futures yet so it could still be a retool technically speaking. They were forced to trade all the players they've traded or else they would have lost them for nothing.

But usually isn't that how it starts. You get rid of the UFA's first, and start with others after.

They did try to trade Markstrom with 2.5 years left. A guy who was having a really good year. From the sounds of it, it was a futures trade as well.

Also the players with term, either are guys who likely will never have a trade market(Huberdeau), or guys you want to keep like Weegar and Coleman.

Kadri is a difficult one.

They also have a bunch of NTC, so those conversations probably happened at the exit meetings.

He also mentioned he wants a strong culture, and trading away good players who want to win like a Coleman and Weegar would hurt that. A losing team, but guys who go out and play hard and still try to do it the right way and try to win even though they know we may suck lol.

[traptor]

Originally Posted by Macho0978

I think SJ will stay the course this off season. They aren't close yet.

Anaheim, Columbus and Chicago have reasons to make some moves to improve. Doesn't mean they will be good, but they have enough high-end pieces now that they should be trying to climb the standings rather than just building through the draft.

If San Jose gets Celebrini they are going to want to start building it back up.

They potentially have 1st and 14th this year plus x2 second rounders. 2 picks next year. Plus a good prospect group already with klund, Smith, musty, muhk and bystedt.
Burns and Vlassic coming off the books in 2 years.


They will suck again but I imagine they will want to start building it back up again and won't be as bad as they were this year.

[traptor]

Yeah I tend to think Rebuilding = selling assets with control.
Selling UFAs that won't sign just seems like retooling if not just a good general practice.

They tried to re-sign them at very fair caps which is terrifying. If those guys had another year of contract the team would just be rolling it back.

[Paulie Walnuts]

Originally Posted by traptor

If San Jose gets Celebrini they are going to want to start building it back up.

They potentially have 1st and 14th this year plus x2 second rounders. 2 picks next year. Plus a good prospect group already with klund, Smith, musty, muhk and bystedt.
Burns and Vlassic coming off the books in 2 years.


They will suck again but I imagine they will want to start building it back up again and won't be as bad as they were this year.

Once you pick in the top 3, that is when you should start planning around those players and reversing the cycle.

Picking 9th for us is just getting started, we should get a piece. If we get into the top 3 next season, that's when we can say ok we got a franchise piece to build around. That doesn't mean the end of the rebuild, or you start trading out picks for immediate help, but you can start looking at a window of getting it turned around.

[Bonded]

Originally Posted by traptor

Yeah I tend to think Rebuilding = selling assets with control.
Selling UFAs that won't sign just seems like retooling if not just a good general practice.

They tried to re-sign them at very fair caps which is terrifying. If those guys had another year of contract the team would just be rolling it back.

Yeah, but most teams entering a rebuild don’t have the contract structure the Flames had so there wasn’t much incentive for the Flames to trade players with term. They will have another crop of UFAs to deal with and it sounds like Markstrom is gone
The players with term will be hard to trade. Kadri and Weegar are good but contracts are prohibitive. I don’t think they’d get good enough value to actually trade Coleman. Huberdeau is tank commander.

[Paulie Walnuts]

Originally Posted by traptor

Yeah I tend to think Rebuilding = selling assets with control.
Selling UFAs that won't sign just seems like retooling if not just a good general practice.

They tried to re-sign them at very fair caps which is terrifying. If those guys had another year of contract the team would just be rolling it back.

It's a forced rebuild no doubt.

I just don't see it as a retool, we literally have no one to retool around.

A team like Pittsburgh is retooling, they have Crosby.

We have Huberdeau and Kadri lol.

[traptor]

Originally Posted by Paulie Walnuts

Once you pick in the top 3, that is when you should start planning around those players and reversing the cycle.

Picking 9th for us is just getting started, we should get a piece. If we get into the top 3 next season, that's when we can say ok we got a franchise piece to build around. That doesn't mean the end of the rebuild, or you start trading out picks for immediate help, but you can start looking at a window of getting it turned around.

Yeah I agree it's not a light switch. That's why you need to start once you get these top guys and slowly work up step by step.

In the San Jose example if they get celebrini, they will still be a bottom 5 team next year but they should be looking to not be as bad. They should go from looking like a bad AHL team to being an actual NHL team. Sign a couple every day vets.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by Wastedyouth

Can we all just agree that no matter what, success and making/nearly the playoffs or abject failure/tanking next season, we will all agree to be miserable about the outcome?

Well they won't be making the playoffs next season so no point in considering that. I actually enjoyed this season far more than last season. They were competitive for a while and after the trade deadline, jockeying for draft position which to me is more fun than the hopelessness of checking the standings after every win/loss to see that you are still mathematically in contention for the 8th spot but the odds are placing the team in the 13-15 area or worse being the Kings and making the playoffs as a bottom seed only to get discarded like a piece of trash in the first round knowing that the best you can hope for next season is a repeat because the team isn't getting better. We get to debate a top 10 pick for the next two months wich to me is super fun. If they are really bad next season it's going to be fun drooling over which of the top 5 prospects they will be able to draft. You just have to embrace the process of being bad enough to draft elite talent.

[traptor]

Originally Posted by Paulie Walnuts

It's a forced rebuild no doubt.

I just don't see it as a retool, we literally have no one to retool around.

A team like Pittsburgh is retooling, they have Crosby.

We have Huberdeau and Kadri lol.

Yeah I agree.

It seems like the org might think differently unfortunately.
At the end if the day it's all semantics.

The one true thing based on what theyve said is they wont intentionally go into the season to bottom out like sanjose and Chicago. They very well might be in the bottom like the BJs thought

[Inferno]

Originally Posted by Paulie Walnuts

But usually isn't that how it starts. You get rid of the UFA's first, and start with others after.

Order doesn't really matter when it comes to rebuilding. You just start getting rid of players when you get an offer you like.

They did try to trade Markstrom with 2.5 years left. A guy who was having a really good year. From the sounds of it, it was a futures trade as well.

If Holtz and/or Mercer were involved in discussions it then it's not a futures trade. It's a partial futures trade. You're getting both present and future assets.

Yes, Conroy explored the possibility of trading Markstrom if the right offer was made but he wasn't trying to actively get rid of him.

It's at a point now though where moving him would be just as beneficial to him as it would the team. He's not getting any younger and the team won't be contenders within the next two season either. And it gives Wolf an opportunity to take over the starting spot sooner than he would have if he backed up Markstrom and then took over.