Alberta Politics & Government Thread 3.0

[malcolmk14]

Originally Posted by Firebot

I would be much more concerned about what Contentment Social Services is and how they are involved.

A patient hotel in itself isn't a problem (as calgarygeologist showed), what is described here seems to be criminal negligence of an elderly and how seemingly taxpayer money is being misappropriated.

Why is whois coming up redacted for what is supposed to be a social services program?

Registered On:
2020-03-06

Something doesn't smell right on this one.
contentmentsocialservices.org

This site didn't exist until late 2021, and the address on the info below (which were ones found when doing a date search to avoid current info) shows a fake Edmonton address and a different phone number (5 87 63 5 3521).

https://ca.showmelocal.com/profile.aspx?bid=23568503

https://www.hotfrog.ca/company/13652...-trade-schools

https://www.localmint.com/ca/content...-hours-1099290

It doesn't seem to have an active license let alone anything certifiable?

https://opengovca.com/edmonton-business/410422247-002

How is this running long term or transitionary care? How is AHS involved with this? The buck should always stop at the government, and that lies with the UCP.

Holy ####, someone needs to dig a little further into this. Our media should be pounding down the doors of the Legislature asking these questions.

[Fuzz]

I would have thought any company operating patient care would be subject to have it's facilities inspected before AHS would transfer patients to them. You know, things like wheelchair accessibility and meals that aren't McDonalds. Is that a naive assumption? I just don't understand how this could happen.

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by malcolmk14

Holy ####, someone needs to dig a little further into this. Our media should be pounding down the doors of the Legislature asking these questions.

Your favourite Candain public broadcaster has been doing just that. It would be a shame if they weren't around anymore.

Before the story aired Friday and was published online Saturday, CBC News went to an address listed on Contentment Social Services's website but found it was a mailing address.

CBC News called two numbers associated with the non-profit multiple times, texted one of those numbers three times and sent several emails requesting an interview and comment for this story. As of Monday, CBC News has not heard back.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/edmon...147904?cmp=rss


And I guess there are no standards or inspections, since AHS says this is fine.

"My understanding is that AHS [Alberta Health Services] followed their proper procedures. They did discharge to a non-profit provider and you would have to ask the non-profit provider why they chose that site," LaGrange said on Monday.


When pressed by CBC News on whether those guidelines were appropriate and the right thing to do, LaGrange reiterated that AHS followed its discharge guidelines, where a team of healthcare workers work with an individual to determine where is an appropriate place to send the patient.

So ya, I guess this is just what healthcare looks like in Alberta under a UCP government. Good to know. Hope voters are paying attention.

[Canadianman]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

I would have thought any company operating patient care would be subject to have it's facilities inspected before AHS would transfer patients to them. You know, things like wheelchair accessibility and meals that aren't McDonalds. Is that a naive assumption? I just don't understand how this could happen.

I don't either, and I have worked on AHS continuing care agreements with service providers. Those agreements have very strong audit/review language in them to ensure that facilities are meeting the standards set out by AHS. I have no visibility of these issues anymore (moved over to different area), but my suspicion is that the government might have put its finger on the scale to ensure the outcome that it needs.


This is a failing that occurs when the health care authority is not actually arm's length from the government. It will get MUCH worse when AHS is rolled up into the government.

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by Canadianman

I don't either, and I have worked on AHS continuing care agreements with service providers. Those agreements have very strong audit/review language in them to ensure that facilities are meeting the standards set out by AHS. I have no visibility of these issues anymore (moved over to different area), but my suspicion is that the government might have put its finger on the scale to ensure the outcome that it needs.

This is a failing that occurs when the health care authority is not actually arm's length from the government. It will get MUCH worse when AHS is rolled up into the government.

It's just another example of Danielle Smith doing what she told us she was going to do...before the election.

Smith said the province needs to figure out how to free up acute care beds that are occupied by seniors destined for long-term care.

"It's something like 60 per cent of the beds are filled with people who are awaiting long term placement," Smith stated.

"And I have to figure that there's got to be a more comfortable place for them to go. I was thinking maybe a hotel may be a better environment."

Smith continued her answer by stating that there is excess capacity in some continuing-care facilities which could also be used by seniors in hospital beds.

NDP Health Critic David Shepherd focused his criticism of Smith on her hotel suggestion during an afternoon media conference outside of a west Edmonton hotel.

"Long-term care beds require a registered nurse to be on hand 24 hours a day with all of the equipment and supplies that might be needed to assist someone with significant medical challenges," Shepherd said.

"The idea that a purpose built medical care facility is interchangeable with a hotel is absurd. It's not a solution…Hotel and motel staff are not health-care workers."

https://edmonton.ctvnews.ca/deeply-i...tels-1.6047520

Sorry folks, but this is what happens when you put an absolute moron in charge. You get them doing moronic things.

[Izzle]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

It's just another example of Danielle Smith doing what she told us she was going to do...before the election.





https://edmonton.ctvnews.ca/deeply-i...tels-1.6047520



Sorry folks, but this is what happens when you put an absolute moron in charge. You get them doing moronic things.

All one can do is laugh.

[calgarygeologist]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

It's just another example of Danielle Smith doing what she told us she was going to do...before the election.


https://edmonton.ctvnews.ca/deeply-i...tels-1.6047520

Sorry folks, but this is what happens when you put an absolute moron in charge. You get them doing moronic things.

Theoretically Smith might not be wrong when it comes to hotels or other similar environments being better for patients waiting for permanent residence or who need short term, non acute care:

Patient hotels are a relatively new concept which means that they have not become embedded in health service delivery on a global scale and this has meant that the quality of research is generally low. Studies have focused generally on the themes of patient experience and cost, to provide evidence to inform future service provision. Only one study [23] was found which explored
the experience of nursing in a patient hotel, although the representativeness of this study is difficult to assess due to its small sample size. The overarching concern of the researchers conducting this review however lies in the fact that the patient hotel model has no clear definition, and inconsistencies in labeling are apparent. This may have impacted upon the review process whereby work may have been overlooked due to the diversity of classification. The studies pertaining to patient experience reported that greater freedom, privacy and independence was found in the patient hotel model, in comparison to traditional hospital accommodation [5,12,24].

This may be because there is greater emphasis put upon self-care, and the involvement of family and friends, than in a traditional hospital environment, where patients are said to experience “pyjama paralysis” brought on by lengthy hospital stays and induced immobility [25, p.881]. The importance of the aesthetic environment was mentioned in a number of studies and served to reinforce the issue of consumer satisfaction and increased feelings of wellbeing [5,24]. The home-like qualities of the accommodation and involvement of relatives was found to be of particular value to older people where the focus was on rehabilitation [24]. In two studies, exploring the post-operative perceptions of women staying at a patient hotel following surgical intervention for breast cancer, both studies found that participants staying at a patient hotel experienced a greater sense of privacy and feelings of wellbeing, directly linked to the hotel-like environment [5,12].
However, the limited number of studies focusing on the subjective experiences of patients, family members and staff means that more research is needed to allow for greater insights into the benefits of the patient hotel model.

In evaluating the cost effectiveness of the patient hotel model, two studies focused directly on this measure of outcome [21,22]. Both studies used a retrospective audit approach, although Bouam
et al. [22] conducted a matched comparison of the national hospital activity data to obtain results. The results from both studies demonstrated potential savings in using the patient hotel model
for ambulatory surgical patients. In the audit by Sive et al. [21] the comparative cost of providing nursing care in a patient hotel is almost a third less, and savings were also highlighted in respect
of increasing ambulatory care capacity, and therefore decreasing traditional hospital inpatient care by an additional 1844 days, whilst freeing up hospital beds for patients requiring acute medical care. The study by Bouam et al. [22] found potential savings of over e2.8 million. A third study [5] found comparative savings in using a patient hotel against traditional hospital accommodation to be five times cheaper for perioperative care for patients following breast cancer surgery. The studies included in this review offer insights into the potential cost effectiveness of the patient hotel model, although further robust studies are needed to offer conclusive recommendations.

The combination of hospitality and healthcare is highly relevant to health service providers, who are now becoming attuned to patient satisfaction, as a quality of care indicator [26]. The literature reviewed reveals that the patient hotel model has the potential to offer health providers a cost-effective alternative for perioperative care, particularly in respect of ambulatory surgery [21,22].

The improvement of patient flow though hospitals, to home, or non-acute care environments is a global problem for health service providers [27]. Delayed transfers of care have implications
to health outcomes for patients awaiting transfer, as well as those requiring acute care and those on waiting lists [28]. An example of this is seen in the UK where there is a defined problem of
delayed transfers of care, at the interface between acute and primary care, where patient flow is unnecessarily blocked as patients wait for non-acute NHS beds and social care to become available
[29,30]. The use of patient hotels in this instance could provide a cost-effective alternative for these patients, who require either rehabilitation or recuperation, and not an acute medicalised environment.

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/31211929/

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by calgarygeologist

Theoretically Smith might not be wrong when it comes to hotels or other similar environments being better for patients waiting for permanent residence or who need short term, non acute care:

Is there any level of patheticness you won't find away to defend with this government? Are you trying to rationalize your vote?

[Fuzz]

Not content with lobotomizing health care, they are coming for your kids next.

How bad is the social studies curriculum the United Conservative Party wants to start piloting?

We all know it’s bad. But I mean, seriously, how bad is it really?

Last Friday, the expert panel asked by the province to weigh in on the UCP Government’s new kindergarten to Grade 6 social studies curriculum published an open letter to Education Minister Demetrios Nicolaides unanimously urging him pull the plug on it and start over again.

The eight post-secondary educators and curriculum specialists outlined their “significant concerns” with the plan to start piloting the controversial curriculum.

The new curriculum, he said, is “devoid of any sense of the overall goals to be systematically pursued and reflected in a person who graduates after 13 years of social studies instruction.”

The old curriculum, he explained, tried to develop the knowledge, skills and dispositions in young people that would let them become “active and engaged citizens of a democratic society.” And this, he added, “was to be worked at increasingly through the grades.”

Now? “It looks like our students will be rigidly focused on the knowledge of the past that they have accumulated. No systematic development of the skills and attributes needed for making complex decisions in public affairs, no development of discerning judgement, no sense of agency or the disposition to be engaged and involved in public affairs.”

No surprise, either, given the UCP’s American-influenced MAGA ideology and hostility to critical thinking – especially if it results in criticism of them!

This, Mr. Booi suggested, looks like “a curriculum designed for home schooling.”

https://albertapolitics.ca/2024/03/a...ome-schooling/

So ya, ignoring experts again. The en####ification of Alberta continues.

[Street Pharmacist]

Originally Posted by calgarygeologist

Theoretically Smith might not be wrong when it comes to hotels or other similar environments being better for patients waiting for permanent residence or who need short term, non acute care:


https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/31211929/

This might be the most unintentionally funny post I've read in a while

[calgarygeologist]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

Is there any level of patheticness you won't find away to defend with this government? Are you trying to rationalize your vote?

You said you would be open to supporting the idea of patient hotels if it was supported by studies and I posted info from a literature review study on this topic that reviewed information and data from hundreds of papers. It shows that it can be a success alternative.

I'm not trying to support this government but I'm trying to counter your notion that everything the UCP/AHS does or touches is wrong and a disaster. I know you will never agree with anything that comes from the current government because you are so morally opposed to them.

[calgarygeologist]

Originally Posted by Street Pharmacist

This might be the most unintentionally funny post I've read in a while

Do explain further. It is happening in Europe, Australia, Surrey BC, Ontario and Halifax is opening a hotel later this year. It is an idea and implementation that is gaining traction and serves a purpose.

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by calgarygeologist

You said you would be open to supporting the idea of patient hotels if it was supported by studies and I posted info from a literature review study on this topic that reviewed information and data from hundreds of papers. It shows that it can be a success alternative.

I'm not trying to support this government but I'm trying to counter your notion that everything the UCP/AHS does or touches is wrong and a disaster. I know you will never agree with anything that comes from the current government because you are so morally opposed to them.

You are showing things that say an airplane with square wings can fly, as an attempt to defend AHS using a school bus with cardboard wings. Can you not see the difference?

And I question how this is a long term plan at all. If we need care spaces, we need them. So why not build them, and staff them? it's not like we won't need them in the future. This is what privatization of healthcare looks like. The lowest cost bidder with no oversight finds the cheapest hotel and loads it with patients with minimal, inappropriate levels of care and sends them fast food while the patient festers in filth. Then they profit.

And I'm not just morally opposed to this government, I'm opposed to them on an intellectual level more than anything. That they ignore experts and do whatever they think feels right has to be amoung the dumbest ways to run a government, and a sure way to fail. That anyone could defend that, let alone vote for it, is mind boggling. It is endorsing stupidity.

[Street Pharmacist]

Originally Posted by calgarygeologist

Do explain further. It is happening in Europe, Australia, Surrey BC, Ontario and Halifax is opening a hotel later this year. It is an idea and implementation that is gaining traction and serves a purpose.

A stroke patient was discharged from hospital to a hotel with no wheelchair accessibility and fed fast food. In an effort to find some silver lining you Google a study about sending patients to hotels.

What you didn't realize is a "patient hotel" in Europe is not the same as sending a patient to a travel lodge. A Patient Hotel is a medical facility that is set up like a hotel and has no similarity to a motel 6 with McDonald's service

[calgarygeologist]

Originally Posted by Street Pharmacist

A stroke patient was discharged from hospital to a hotel with no wheelchair accessibility and fed fast food. In an effort to find some silver lining you Google a study about sending patients to hotels.

What you didn't realize is a "patient hotel" in Europe is not the same as sending a patient to a travel lodge. A Patient Hotel is a medical facility that is set up like a hotel and has no similarity to a motel 6 with McDonald's service

It actuality I didn't search out a study on this topic but rather this is the study that was referenced in the media reporting on the merits of the Surrey hotel that is being contracted out for patients. I just looked to see what the results of the study were.

[powderjunkie]

Originally Posted by calgarygeologist

Theoretically Smith might not be wrong when it comes to hotels or other similar environments being better for patients waiting for permanent residence or who need short term, non acute care:


https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/31211929/

The concept is sound, as long as the intention is actually patient care and not laundering taxpayer money through a dubious consultancy.

[topfiverecords]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

You are showing things that say an airplane with square wings can fly, as an attempt to defend AHS using a school bus with cardboard wings. Can you not see the difference?

And I question how this is a long term plan at all. If we need care spaces, we need them. So why not build them, and staff them? it's not like we won't need them in the future. This is what privatization of healthcare looks like. The lowest cost bidder with no oversight finds the cheapest hotel and loads it with patients with minimal, inappropriate levels of care and sends them fast food while the patient festers in filth. Then they profit.

And I'm not just morally opposed to this government, I'm opposed to them on an intellectual level more than anything. That they ignore experts and do whatever they think feels right has to be amoung the dumbest ways to run a government, and a sure way to fail. That anyone could defend that, let alone vote for it, is mind boggling. It is endorsing stupidity.

[Cappy]

Originally Posted by calgarygeologist

Theoretically Smith might not be wrong when it comes to hotels or other similar environments being better for patients waiting for permanent residence or who need short term, non acute care:


https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/31211929/

Dude,

You are taking the word "hotel" and essentially ending your analysis there.

As Fuzz has basically shown, the similarity between the Hotel model in the studies and what this man went through stops at the word "hotel". Nothing is the same after that.

[puffnstuff]

What the study is versus what this govt is doing are not the same

[Major Major]

Originally Posted by calgarygeologist

It actuality I didn't search out a study on this topic but rather this is the study that was referenced in the media reporting on the merits of the Surrey hotel that is being contracted out for patients. I just looked to see what the results of the study were.

I haven't seen someone miss the point this hard in a long time.