2023/2024 Trade Rumors and Speculation Thread

[stemit14]

After what we have seen for returns from the trades so far, I’m going to adjust my predictions/trade proposals… I doubt any of the remaining trades return a prospect ranked in the top five of that team’s prospect pool. Not that I’m upset at the returns Conroy has gotten so far… I just think the market is down this year especially. For some reason, teams are being very conservative with trading their picks and prospects more than other years. So here is my expected return for any of the following players if they get traded:

Hanifin (50% retained): 2nd round pick + conditional 3rd round pick (becomes a 2nd round pick if the acquiring team makes the conference finals) + B-level prospect
Markstrom (50% retained): 2nd round pick + Holtz + C-level prospect (I’m assuming New Jersey is the only team that will trade for Markstrom)
Mangiapane (50% retained, assuming in the summer): 4th round pick

I’m sure these returns seem underwhelming but the market seems very limited right now. I think it will be tough to get a first round pick for Hanifin. Teams know that he is only willing to sign with a select few teams and those teams have very little in the way of picks or prospects. Teams also know Conroy has to sell this player so he is in a bit of a tight spot. I’ll be surprised if Conroy can get a first round pick for him.

[cannon7]

Originally Posted by stemit14

After what we have seen for returns from the trades so far, I’m going to adjust my predictions/trade proposals… I doubt any of the remaining trades return a prospect ranked in the top five of that team’s prospect pool. Not that I’m upset at the returns Conroy has gotten so far… I just think the market is down this year especially. For some reason, teams are being very conservative with trading their picks and prospects more than other years. So here is my expected return for any of the following players if they get traded:

Hanifin (50% retained): 2nd round pick + conditional 3rd round pick (becomes a 2nd round pick if the acquiring team makes the conference finals) + B-level prospect
Markstrom (50% retained): 2nd round pick + Holtz + C-level prospect (I’m assuming New Jersey is the only team that will trade for Markstrom)
Mangiapane (50% retained, assuming in the summer): 4th round pick

I’m sure these returns seem underwhelming but the market seems very limited right now. I think it will be tough to get a first round pick for Hanifin. Teams know that he is only willing to sign with a select few teams and those teams have very little in the way of picks or prospects. Teams also know Conroy has to sell this player so he is in a bit of a tight spot. I’ll be surprised if Conroy can get a first round pick for him.

Hanifin is quite a bit more valuable than Tanev, so not sure why you're expecting a similar return?

Also not sure why you think New Jersey is the only team in the market for a goaltender? Have you seen Carolina? Or Colorado?

[Heavy Jack]

A 4th for a 50 percent retained mangiapane is woefully bad. Andrew continues to be severely undervalued by some; I mean I really loved Tanev in Calgary and yes the return at first glance is underwhelming but he is a rugged 34 YO UFA rental dman at a week from the TDL who missed a chunk of the playoffs the last time he was in them. If he can return what he did, a 28 year old former 35 goal scorer and likely 20 to 25 goal scorer at 50 percent for an entire season should return more than a measly 4th.

[The Cobra]

Originally Posted by stemit14

After what we have seen for returns from the trades so far, I’m going to adjust my predictions/trade proposals… I doubt any of the remaining trades return a prospect ranked in the top five of that team’s prospect pool. Not that I’m upset at the returns Conroy has gotten so far… I just think the market is down this year especially. For some reason, teams are being very conservative with trading their picks and prospects more than other years. So here is my expected return for any of the following players if they get traded:

Hanifin (50% retained): 2nd round pick + conditional 3rd round pick (becomes a 2nd round pick if the acquiring team makes the conference finals) + B-level prospect
Markstrom (50% retained): 2nd round pick + Holtz + C-level prospect (I’m assuming New Jersey is the only team that will trade for Markstrom)
Mangiapane (50% retained, assuming in the summer): 4th round pick

I’m sure these returns seem underwhelming but the market seems very limited right now. I think it will be tough to get a first round pick for Hanifin. Teams know that he is only willing to sign with a select few teams and those teams have very little in the way of picks or prospects. Teams also know Conroy has to sell this player so he is in a bit of a tight spot. I’ll be surprised if Conroy can get a first round pick for him.

Hanifin will certainly get more than Tanev, and will include a 1st round pick.

Why would Calgary trade Mangiapane for a 4th and retain half his cap? You would get more than a 4th for the retention alone.

[kyuss275]

Does anybody know what frank seravalli predicted the return for hanifin would be? While I thought he didn’t have a good grasp on what returns of tanev and lindholm would be , he seems to be right on the money so far. Not suggesting what he predicts is gospel , just want to know his prediction for hanifin.

[Nelson]

Originally Posted by kyuss275

Does anybody know what frank seravalli predicted the return for hanifin would be? While I thought he didn’t have a good grasp on what returns of tanev and lindholm would be , he seems to be right on the money so far. Not suggesting what he predicts is gospel , just want to know his prediction for hanifin.

Initially, he said it would be similar to the return for Hampus Lindholm, which would be roughly a prospect recently picked in the 1st + 1st + 2 * 2nd.

Then, he said it might be a little less - 1st + 2 * 2nd, because the market is limited for Hanifin. I believe that was when Seravalli was talking about Hanifin only being willing to re-sign with the TBL.

[ForeverFlameFan]

https://twitter.com/user/status/1762913884979986905

Potentially a wrench in Hanifin talks

[TOfan]

Originally Posted by kyuss275

Does anybody know what frank seravalli predicted the return for hanifin would be? While I thought he didn’t have a good grasp on what returns of tanev and lindholm would be , he seems to be right on the money so far. Not suggesting what he predicts is gospel , just want to know his prediction for hanifin.

Believe FS has been saying the Flames hands are tied and the return for Hanifin is likely to underwhelm. Maybe I’m getting my journalists mixed up but I also believe he had been saying the Flames were looking for a strong return from Tanev to balance the two out.

In a vacuum I think the return for Tanev is fine. Maybe the return for Hanifin will be more than what FS is alluding to but I think fans should be mindful that it’s unlikely to be that haul we would like.

Truthfully, the best asset the Flames can hope for headed into the offseason is their own pick. I hope it’s top 10. I’m not going to cheer for loses but it would be a bit disappointing if the Flames end up picking 12 or 14 or 15…

[Lanny_McDonald]

Originally Posted by kyuss275

Does anybody know what frank seravalli predicted the return for hanifin would be? While I thought he didn’t have a good grasp on what returns of tanev and lindholm would be , he seems to be right on the money so far. Not suggesting what he predicts is gospel , just want to know his prediction for hanifin.

Seravelli has suggested the Flames would get a return similar to what Hampus Lindholm produced for Anaheim when they traded him to Boston.

So that would be a 1st rounder in the next draft, a 2nd rounder two drafts out, a 2nd rounder three drafts out, and a "B" or "C" level prospect (the prospect moved was #8 in Boston's prospect list according to the Hockey Writers).

Servelli projects that teams interested could include Detroit, New Jersey, Islanders, Tampa, Toronto, and Vegas.

Using the model above I would expect returns to look something like this from each team.

Detroit: Conditional 1st in 2024 (either theirs or Boston's is going to Ottawa so the Flames would get the other pick), 2nd in 2025, 2nd in 2026, William Wallinder (D)

New Jersey: 1st round pick in 2024, 2nd round pick in 2026, Graeme Clarke (RW) (Devils don't have a 2nd in 2025), Josh Filmon (RW)

Islanders: 1st in 2024, 2nd in 2025, 2nd in 2026, Calle Odelius (D)

Tampa: Tampa does not have a 1st until 2026 nor a 2nd until 2025, so this is going to be more prospect heavy. 2nd round pick in 2025, 2nd round pick in 2026, Niko Huuhtanen (RW), Jack Finley (C)

Toronto: Toronto has no 2nd rounders in the next three drafts so this will be prospect heavy as well. 1st rounder in 2024, Fraser Minten (C), Nick Robertson (LW) PLUS whatever works out for retention and players moving to make room for Hanifin

Vegas: 1st in 2024, 2nd in 2025, 2nd in 2026, David Edstrom (C) PLUS whatever works out for retention and players moving to make room for Hanifin

Not much in there that is sexy, but some good assets.

[CliffFletcher]

I doubt Hanifin returns what Lindholm brought the Ducks. The Bruins gave up a king’s ransom because they were certain they could sign Lindholm long-term (they signed a deal within hours of acquiring him). It’s unlikely any of the teams making offers for Hanifin are confident they can sign him, which reduces his value. It’s also a softer market this year.

I expect the return will a 1st and either a 2nd or a B prospect (better than Grushnikov, but not one of an organization’s top-3 prospects). Only way the Flames are getting one of a team’s top prospects is if the team is really prospect poor, like TB or BOS.

[Lanny_McDonald]

I think Conroy has done a pretty good job in moving pieces around so far. He's restocked the blueline and positioned it nicely IMO, with a balance of skill, size, and defensive responsibility. Proirier, Morin, and Brzustewicz are complemented by Kuznetsov, Solovyov, Grushnikov, and Jurmo. He got a mitt full of picks to deal with the gaps left behind by Treliving so the system will be replenished or he has draft capital to make deals at the draft.

He's got a couple more assets he really should exploit in Hanifin and Markstrom. These two are crucial and need to help address the gaps up front. I still have concerns he overplayed his hand with New Jersey and Markstrom. Getting a quality young forward like Holtz and a 1st may be a lost opportunity. I hope this isn't the case and he can circle back and grab those assets. Also have to hope that he can turn Hanifin into a good forward prospect and another few picks. The Flames have some good pieces but are sorely lacking the top end talent needed. Young players with top six potential should be targets from here on out. Must get some help in the middle!

[Freddy]

As has been mentioned in previous posts Conroy isn’t likely to get high end prospects back, but the 1st and 2nd round draft picks are his opportunity to acquire elite or blue chip prospects for the organization. I hope the scouting staff are all working overtime this season.

[Lanny_McDonald]

Originally Posted by Freddy

As has been mentioned in previous posts Conroy isn’t likely to get high end prospects back, but the 1st and 2nd round draft picks are his opportunity to acquire elite or blue chip prospects for the organization. I hope the scouting staff are all working overtime this season.

Elite prospects come in the first few picks of a draft. Blue chippers come in the top 10. Rarely do you get either outside of those bands. The picks being accrued are not going to get elite prospects or blue chip prospects. They will fill the cupboard with dinnerware, but it ain't going to be fine china.

[SuperMatt18]

Originally Posted by Heavy Jack

A 4th for a 50 percent retained mangiapane is woefully bad. Andrew continues to be severely undervalued by some; I mean I really loved Tanev in Calgary and yes the return at first glance is underwhelming but he is a rugged 34 YO UFA rental dman at a week from the TDL who missed a chunk of the playoffs the last time he was in them. If he can return what he did, a 28 year old former 35 goal scorer and likely 20 to 25 goal scorer at 50 percent for an entire season should return more than a measly 4th.

To me the best trade comparison for Mangiapane is Artturi Lehkonen. Lehkonen returned Justin Barron and a 2nd round pick when he was traded.

Many on CP are overly down on Mangiapane for no reason except their own expectations being too high.

[Harpz0012]

Sent from my SM-S918W using Tapatalk

[Freddy]

Originally Posted by Lanny_McDonald

Elite prospects come in the first few picks of a draft. Blue chippers come in the top 10. Rarely do you get either outside of those bands. The picks being accrued are not going to get elite prospects or blue chip prospects. They will fill the cupboard with dinnerware, but it ain't going to be fine china.

Accruing draft capital gives Conroy the opportunity to package multiple picks to potentially move up in the draft to your echelons of elite and blue chip.

[Lanny_McDonald]

Serious question. How many times have we seen teams traded up in the draft, especially into the top 10, over the past 10-20 years?

[The Cobra]

Originally Posted by Lanny_McDonald

Serious question. How many times have we seen teams traded up in the draft, especially into the top 10, over the past 10-20 years?

Seldom, as teams who have the chance of picking up elite prospects don't kick that for the chance to pick up lesser ones.

Teams on the low 20's will sometimes trade back for additional picks when there is a number of players they can pick and they don't think there is much difference in them.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by Lanny_McDonald

Serious question. How many times have we seen teams traded up in the draft, especially into the top 10, over the past 10-20 years?

It's fantasy in the NHL for the most part when it comes to teams in the top 10 trading down. It happens in the NFL because it's much more of a positional driven draft with teams desperate to draft a QB and teams that are settled at that position that can afford to trade back a few spots and address a position of need. The NHL draft is all about talent tiers and position takes a back seat so teams simply aren't willing to trade out of one of the top 2 tiers because their chances of getting an NHL player drops drastically outside of the top 10.

[boogerz]

Chychrun being in play is definitely a game changer for the D market. Lower AAV, signed for another year, slightly younger, and essentially brings the same thing as Hanifin.

If he's in play, it would make sense for Conroy to rush the Tanev deal a little bit last night to get a dman off the market and have more time/capacity to focus on moving Hanifin